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PoliGAF 2013 |OT1| Never mind, Wheeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

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P

PhoenixDark

Banned
GhaleonEB said:
Democrats won the White House, and picked up seats in both the Senate and House (and got more votes than GOP House members). They had an effective message.
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It's not really a governing message. Raise taxes on the rich, protect abortion rights...and what? Solve the deficit in a balanced way? Overall the party doesn't really have any "big" ideas on jobs, and the idea of stimulus has been stigmatized in the eyes of many voters. Everything is a talking point, admittedly better than GOP talking points but still. Ultimately I think Clinton is right about this
 
S

Shadow Hog

Member
Escape Goat said:
Evilore and NeoGAF is pro life.

JzfM4rK.jpg


7oXgaxJ.jpg


jRexAlrLRors6.jpg
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I dunno, those last two look pretty pro-choice to me.
 
J

Jooney

Member
GhaleonEB said:
Democrats won the White House, and picked up seats in both the Senate and House (and got more votes than GOP House members). They had an effective message.
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Fair point, although I don't know how effective viewing messaging between the two parties solely through the prism of an election is, given the role that personality, identity politics and bullshit issues play.

My original comments were more in the context of pre-election, when Obama was out on the stump trying to sell the AJA. Given that it got nowhere (even when it was cut into pieces), can you really say that dems had effective messaging on this?

Moreover, how about taking a step back and seeing what it is that America as a nation has been talking about?

Has the discussion been focused on growing jobs, or deficit reduction?
Healthcare for all, or socialism?
Addressing climate change, or debating whether it even exists?
And the list goes on.

The Republicans have been the minority for four years yet their have a hugely disproportional impact on the terms of the national dialogue and in setting the agenda. There's no special reason for why this should be so, other than Democrats can't sell their agenda - and their successes - as well as republicans can.
 
G

GhaleonEB

Member
Jooney said:
Fair point, although I don't know how effective viewing messaging between the two parties solely through the prism of an election is, given the role that personality, identity politics and bullshit issues play.

My original comments were more in the context of pre-election, when Obama was out on the stump trying to sell the AJA. Given that it got nowhere (even when it was cut into pieces), can you really say that dems had effective messaging on this?
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My point is that it didn't matter what Obama's messaging was on jobs. The GOP was not going to pass it, or part if it, full stop. No amount of public pressure or even a lost election will dent it. Nothing. Just look at what's going on right now, and the new Congress has just begun.

I do think Obama's messaging on the jobs act was far better than it was with say, the original stimulus bill. (Which the Jobs Act closely resembled.) But Obama and Dems twisted themselves into knots and diluted their own message by engaging in the deficit hysteria. I wince every time Obama talks about jobs and cutting the deficit a few breaths apart. So he and Dems certainly could have had a better focus.

That said, while I think it did get through to the public, it doesn't matter. The GOP will not go along with any of Obama's job proposals. No messaging or public support etc. will change that. In part because the House GOP feels so entrenched due to redistricting that they can do pretty much what they want, knowing their majority is safe.
 
O

Oblivion

Fetishing muscular manly men in skintight hosery
Copernicus said:
Looks like Rand Paul is going to deliver the Tea Party response for the SOTU.

Oh joy.


The online stream of the sotu is enhanced BTW...

They got pacman and Steve jobs planned it seems
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Wait, but Rubio is a tea bagger too. Why do they need a separate response with another tea bagger?


Speaking of the tea folk:

Former Rep. and Tea Party darling Joe Walsh has filed a request in Cook County Circuit Court to cease paying child support payments because he is no longer employed, the Chicago Sun-Times reported on Monday:

In a Feb. 1 court filing entitled “motion to terminate child support obligation,” Walsh’s attorneys asked to change his support requirement, which under a previous agreement, was to continue until May.

“Joe’s employment has been terminated through no voluntary act of his own and he is without sufficient income or assets with which to continue to pay his support obligation,” the filing states. “Due to substantial change of circumstances, Joe requests that his child support obligation be terminated based on his present income and circumstances.”

At one point, the filing asks to amend his payments to be equal to 20 percent of his income — which presumably is 20 percent of zero.
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http://livewire.talkingpointsmemo.com/entry/ex-rep-joe-walsh-i-cant-afford-child

Love the bolded, lol.
 
B

Black Mamba

Member
Oreilly is spending 30 minutes tonight to double down on the drone story he got called out on. lol. He's not changing tunes. Some liberal professer he brought on could only shake his head at the stupidity.

Man, he's gone off the deep end of late.
 
A

adamsappel

Member
speculawyer said:
The GOP brings the 'Nuge . . . a chickenhawk that crapped in his own pants to avoid the draft.
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I had never heard of this story, so I googled. Hilarious! From a High Times interview (another thing that should put him on the outs with conservatives):

' “Well, on that day I ceased cleansing my body,” Nugent said. “No more brushing my teeth, no more washing my hair, no baths, no soap, no water. Thirty days of debris build. I stopped shavin’ and I was 18, had a little scraggly beard, really looked like a hippie. I had long hair, and it started gettin’ kinky, matted up. Then two weeks before, I stopped eating any food with nutritional value. I just had chips, Pepsi, beer-stuff I never touched-buttered poop, little jars of Polish sausages, and I’d drink the syrup, I was this side of death. Then a week before, I stopped going to the bathroom. I did it in my pants. Poop, piss the whole shot. My pants got crusted up.” '

Years later the National Rifle Association board member went on to tell Creem magazine that he also snorted a line of crystal meth before attending his physical examination, giving him a “big, juicy 4F,” meaning failure and rejection from service.
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Another guy I never understood why he had Republican cred was PJ O'Rourke. He was an old hippie unrepentant draft-dodger who worked at a decadent liberal pornographic magazine. Why should they embrace him?
 
T

Talon

Member
Don't you like how, despite all the posturing by North Korea regarding an impending nuclear test since late November, none of the questions for Hagel had to do with North Korea?
 
P

PhoenixDark

Banned
Shadow Hog said:
If the Tea Party is just a subset of the Republican Party, why the hell do they need their own response to the SotU, anyway?
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Because they're not republicans wink wink

So glad that little experiment has effectively imploded, although I do look forward to seeing just how many crazy people they can get to run for senate seats (and potentially hand victory to democrats). Steve King is first in line
 
O

Oblivion

Fetishing muscular manly men in skintight hosery
I'm actually surprised many of these morons are still willingly clinging to the "Tea Party" moniker. The brand is toxic as fuck at this point.
 
D

Drakeon

Member
Oblivion said:
I'm actually surprised many of these morons are still willingly clinging to the "Tea Party" moniker. The brand is toxic as fuck at this point.
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I think if this last election taught us anything, it's that they live in their own reality. Try explaining to the actual tea party die hards (which, coincidentally are usually the ones still using the moniker) that their brand is toxic. It won't work. Just like attempting to convince them that 538 was accurate with its polling data didn't work.
 
J

Jackson50

Member
PhoenixDark said:
So..he just gives up and never discusses it again? An assault weapons ban is far more unlikely, as is climate control, yet he's pivoted to both. You don't just have to just spend money to address the economy. Obama proposed a corporate tax cut years ago and there has been no movement on it. I'm not saying that is some major thing to fix unemployment, but it could certainly be a part of any jobs bill to entice republicans.
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No. He should promulgate his plans fervidly. Realistically, however, such efforts are unlikely to yield concessions from Republicans. And that is the crux of the problem. It is not the lack of a jobs plan. Democrats have had a jobs plan which they promoted with earnest. But Republican obstinacy remains an insuperable impediment. So a jobs plan, which Democrats already have but you suggested is the solution, only reinforces the status quo.

Also, I never specified the AWB or climate change legislation as the alternatives. Those are worthwhile options, of course. And I hope he mentions both in his speech. But both remain risky propositions likely to be occluded by House Republicans. A more fruitful avenue would be to focus on immigration reform where he can probably exploit the fissures within the Republican base.
Shadow Hog said:
If the Tea Party is just a subset of the Republican Party, why the hell do they need their own response to the SotU, anyway?
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Part of their appeal is the appearance of opposing the establishment. So to perpetuate that charade they feign independence. But their message is not meaningfully different. It's just to put on airs.
 
S

Shadow Hog

Member
Oblivion said:
I'm actually surprised many of these morons are still willingly clinging to the "Tea Party" moniker. The brand is toxic as fuck at this point.
Click to expand...
I seriously wonder how long it'll be before the phrase "Tea Party", in reference to American politics and history, will make me think of the Boston Tea Party first and not these clowns.
 
S

speculawyer

Member
makingmusic476 said:
So my dad sent me this:

http://www.westernjournalism.com/is-obama-looking-to-create-a-civilian-national-security-force/

I sent him these:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Df2p6867_pw#t=14m54s
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZUTDu3VZZGk

Fucking Fox News.
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Fox Business. They actually managed to create a channel worse than Fox News. That channel is a cesspool.

Solicited bids for 1.6 billion rounds. Perhaps they just asked a large number of different vendors for a bid for tens of millions and they multiplied it all out as if they were going to buy from everyone? What is Fox Business implying? That DHS is going to put everyone in concentration camps? What is the point of this story other than a vague unsubstantiated conspiracy that feeds nut cases what they want to hear. FFS, this is barely above Alex Jones level shiite.
 
Dominican Power

Dominican Power

Member
Obama statement on N. Korea's nuclear test

North Korea announced today that it conducted a third nuclear test. This is a highly provocative act that, following its December 12 ballistic missile launch, undermines regional stability, violates North Korea’s obligations under numerous United Nations Security Council resolutions, contravenes its commitments under the September 19, 2005 Joint Statement of the Six-Party Talks, and increases the risk of proliferation. North Korea’s nuclear weapons and ballistic missile programs constitute a threat to U.S. national security and to international peace and security. The United States remains vigilant in the face of North Korean provocations and steadfast in our defense commitments to allies in the region.

These provocations do not make North Korea more secure. Far from achieving its stated goal of becoming a strong and prosperous nation, North Korea has instead increasingly isolated and impoverished its people through its ill-advised pursuit of weapons of mass destruction and their means of delivery.

The danger posed by North Korea’s threatening activities warrants further swift and credible action by the international community. The United States will also continue to take steps necessary to defend ourselves and our allies. We will strengthen close coordination with allies and partners and work with our Six-Party partners, the United Nations Security Council, and other UN member states to pursue firm action.
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http://live.reuters.com/Event/North_Korea/63214575

You done goofed NK.
 
Z

zero shift

Banned
North Korea is one of the poorest countries in the world yet one of the exceptional few that can actually build long range nuclear missiles.

Could you imagine that if say Burkina Faso was doing something similar? Insane.
 
K

kingkitty

Member
I'll need to stock up in Girls Generation before the Korean War Pt.2

It will be interesting to see how China reacts. No matter how North Korea tries to modernize like asking help from the Germans with their economy, they'll never really change.
 
Z

zero shift

Banned
kingkitty said:
I'll need to stock up in Girls Generation before the Korean War Pt.2

It will be interesting to see how China reacts. No matter how North Korea tries to modernize like asking help from the Germans with their economy, they'll never really change.
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I find it ridiculous that North Korea's economy has collapsed to the 19th century while Cuba has recovered from the fall of the Soviet Union and is now inline with GDP growth with its surrounding nations. The Kims truly don't give a fuck.
 
T

Tim-E

Member
It looks like the civil war among conservatives will come to fruition. Instead of unifying to attack democrats, it seems like they're ready to go at each others throats for pure primary candidates. This will be delicious. I hope they can keep it up for two years.
 
K

kehs

Banned
Former Vice President Dick Cheney says the Obama administration's policy of targeting terrorists abroad with unmanned drone strikes is "a good policy," even though he disagrees with most of President Barack Obama's views on national security.

In an interview that aired Tuesday on "CBS This Morning," Cheney dismissed the need for "checks and balances" against the drone program. He says Obama "is getting paid to make difficult, difficult decisions."
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http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/02/12/dick-cheney-obama-drone_n_2668511.html

Right before the SOTU, nice play Dick.
 
B

Baraka in the White House

2-Terms of Kombat
Fuck the Tea Party. Never should have been hoisted into the spotlight to begin with.

Nothing but a Hail Mary by Republicans to remain relevant after getting pushed against the ropes in 2008 that unfortunately - and thanks in no small part to a bunch of establishment funding and logistics - worked.
 
R

RustyNails

Member
Tim-E said:
It looks like the civil war among conservatives will come to fruition. Instead of unifying to attack democrats, it seems like they're ready to go at each others throats for pure primary candidates. This will be delicious. I hope they can keep it up for two years.
Click to expand...
My only concern is Tea Party breaking off from the GOP will make the GOP look like moderates, with Tea Party and Democrats being perceived/labelled as extreme ends of political spectrum. It's just the advantage GOP gets with there being 3 parties on a spectrum.
 
R

Rocket Scientist

Member
(...) imagine Obama playing a video in the middle of Congress, a video that claims to show Boehner’s brother soliciting a massive bribe. The Iranian version of that is exactly what happened in Tehran last Sunday. In the middle of a packed house, Ahmadinejad played a secretly filmed video, one of many he claims to have collected. The man at the center of all this was Fazel Larijani. His brother Ari Larijani, the speaker of the parliament, was enraged. The speaker berated the president saying, "You are not allowed to talk anymore." And then, "Please leave. Please leave."
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(Ahmadinejad) wants to be the president who negotiates with America, breaks Iran's isolation and makes a deal resolving the nuclear problem. During his last presidential campaign, he was actually attacked by the opposition leader, Mir Hussein Moussavi, for offering too many concessions to the West. Well, last week, Ayatollah Khamenei slapped him down. Ahmadinejad and his foreign minister had expressed interest in negotiating directly with the United States responding to comments by Vice President Biden. But Khamenei rejected the process and dismissed people like Ahmadinejad as naive, even wondering if they wanted America to dominate Iran again.
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http://globalpublicsquare.blogs.cnn.com/2013/02/12/behind-irans-leadership-tensions/

It says his term ends in June. I'm assuming that means new elections? Do we know anything about who could be his successor? It seems like whoever it is it won't really matter as Khamenei is a punk anyway. Sad.
 
F

Fenderputty

Banned
RustyNails said:
My only concern is Tea Party breaking off from the GOP will make the GOP look like moderates, with Tea Party and Democrats being perceived/labelled as extreme ends of political spectrum. It's just the advantage GOP gets with there being 3 parties on a spectrum.
Click to expand...

A more moderate GOP isn't a bad thing though. It could push the whole political spectrum to the left.
 
C

Chichikov

Member
RustyNails said:
My only concern is Tea Party breaking off from the GOP will make the GOP look like moderates, with Tea Party and Democrats being perceived/labelled as extreme ends of political spectrum. It's just the advantage GOP gets with there being 3 parties on a spectrum.
Click to expand...
The Tea Party cannot survive outside the GOP, and that's exactly why you'll never see them break away in force.
Sure, you'll probably have some idiots who lost primaries trying to run under that banner, but I seriously doubt you'll see someone like Rand Paul falling on his sword for the Tea Party.
 
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