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PoliGAF Interim Thread of USA General Elections (DAWN OF THE VEEP)

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S

sangreal

Member
Gaborn said:
Well, Canada gate was him claiming to the canadians that he was pandering. So he was telling Ohio that NAFTA was terrible, and telling Canada not to worry he was just pandering. What makes you believe he was telling the truth to Canada and not to the people of Ohio? for that matter what makes you think (if you indeed think that) that he won't pander to Ohio and work towards getting rid of NAFTA if he's elected? I'd think states such as Ohio are a little more important to a president than Canada so I'd tend to suspect he'll pander to them more.
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Fair enough, but in the past he has been supportive of Free trade and "The Audacity of Hope" contains a decent amount of insight into his stance on globalization. From what I remember, he believes that you can't stop globalization even if you wanted to so he supports measures like retraining programs to keep American workers competitive. Some of the more vocal positions included in his stump speech are actually more about Free trade than protectionism. He talks about our 1-sided trade deal with South Korea, his main objection being the trade barriers left in place on South Korea's side
 
D

Deus Ex Machina

Member
House OKs Surveillance Amendment

cryingliberty-1.jpg


http://www.time.com/time/politics/article/0,8599,1816688,00.html
(WASHINGTON) — The House Friday easily approved a compromise bill setting new electronic surveillance rules that effectively shield telecommunications companies from lawsuits arising from the government's terrorism-era warrantless eavesdropping on phone and computer lines in this country.

The bill, which was passed on a 293-129 vote, does more than just protect the telecoms.
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It is Christmas in the white house today. Bush will not be going to Jail.
 
G

Gaborn

Member
sangreal said:
Fair enough, but in the past he has been supportive of Free trade and "The Audacity of Hope" contains a decent amount of insight into his stance on globalization. From what I remember, he believes that you can't stop globalization even if you wanted to so he supports measures like retraining programs to keep American workers competitive. Some of the more vocal positions included in his stump speech are actually more about Free trade than protectionism. He talks about our 1-sided trade deal with South Korea, his main objection being the trade barriers left in place on South Korea's side
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Sure, and Bill Clinton talked about allowing gays to serve openly in the military and instead gave us DADT. A politician believing or not believing in something doesn't mean they're going to act in that particular way, particularly if they're displaying a tendency to pander rather than to lead on the issue. Obama has yet to take a strong stand on NAFTA and if Ohio starts slipping in the polls for him I fully expect the rhetoric to come roaring back.
 
D

Deus Ex Machina

Member
Obama campaign adds women to top ranks


080620_obama_femalestaff.jpg

Anita Dunn (left) joined the campaign as a senior strategist, Stephanie Cutter (center) will serve as a senior campaign adviser and top aide to Michelle Obama, and Patti Solis Doyle (right) will serve as chief of staff to the vice presidential nominee.
After taking primary season criticism over the number of women in its upper ranks, the campaign of Barack Obama has significantly ramped up its hiring of women in senior staff positions.

The move appeared aimed, in part, at reversing what one top aide said was a "bit of a bad rap" for running a male-dominated campaign organization.

Prominent women activists said that, through the primary season, they had taken note of a gender imbalance in the campaign’s top echelon, particularly when compared to that of Hillary Rodham Clinton's operation, but were pleased to see the presumptive Democratic nominee hiring more women.

"We could have more, and I think there will be more," said Kate Michelman, a former head of NARAL Pro-Choice America who endorsed Obama in February after initially supporting former Sen. John Edwards. "There needs to be more. But I know that Sen. Obama also knows that and sees that and is deliberately and carefully doing that."

Anita Dunn, a consultant who joined the Obama campaign in February as a senior strategist, acknowledged a problem — but said it was one of perception, not reality.

"This campaign has gotten a bit of a bad rap, since the reality is, when the initial discussions were going on about whether he should run, there were women at the table," Dunn said. "At every key strategic meeting, there are women at the table whose voices are being heard. This is a campaign with a large number of accomplished women."
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http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0608/11233.html
 
G

GhaleonEB

Member
Door2Dawn said:
Whats even worse is that Obama backs the bill. >_<
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Sans immunity, which is one of the key sticking points. I still wish he objected more holistically, but if immunity gets cut then it will actually resemble a compromise. Right now it's a giant gift to Bush.
 
D

Deus Ex Machina

Member
Door2Dawn said:
Whats even worse is that Obama backs the bill. >_<
Click to expand...
Barack Obama's statement on House passing FISA Compromise:

http://tpmelectioncentral.talkingpointsmemo.com/2008/06/obama_backing_fisa_compromise.php

"Given the grave threats that we face, our national security agencies must have the capability to gather intelligence and track down terrorists before they strike, while respecting the rule of law and the privacy and civil liberties of the American people. There is also little doubt that the Bush Administration, with the cooperation of major telecommunications companies, has abused that authority and undermined the Constitution by intercepting the communications of innocent Americans without their knowledge or the required court orders.

"That is why last year I opposed the so-called Protect America Act, which expanded the surveillance powers of the government without sufficient independent oversight to protect the privacy and civil liberties of innocent Americans. I have also opposed the granting of retroactive immunity to those who were allegedly complicit in acts of illegal spying in the past.

"After months of negotiation, the House today passed a compromise that, while far from perfect, is a marked improvement over last year's Protect America Act.

"Under this compromise legislation, an important tool in the fight against terrorism will continue, but the President's illegal program of warrantless surveillance will be over. It restores FISA and existing criminal wiretap statutes as the exclusive means to conduct surveillance - making it clear that the President cannot circumvent the law and disregard the civil liberties of the American people. It also firmly re-establishes basic judicial oversight over all domestic surveillance in the future. It does, however, grant retroactive immunity, and I will work in the Senate to remove this provision so that we can seek full accountability for past offenses. But this compromise guarantees a thorough review by the Inspectors General of our national security agencies to determine what took place in the past, and ensures that there will be accountability going forward. By demanding oversight and accountability, a grassroots movement of Americans has helped yield a bill that is far better than the Protect America Act.

"It is not all that I would want. But given the legitimate threats we face, providing effective intelligence collection tools with appropriate safeguards is too important to delay. So I support the compromise, but do so with a firm pledge that as President, I will carefully monitor the program, review the report by the Inspectors General, and work with the Congress to take any additional steps I deem necessary to protect the lives - and the liberty - of the American people."
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K

kaching

"GAF's biggest wanker"
Gaborn said:
In what sense is that a half measure? You're confusing legal equality with social equality incidentally.
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I'm not confusing legal and social equality. You're trying to compatmentalize them but they're intertwined. Inequality in one begets inequality in the other. Marriage fundamentally endorses discrimination that a measure to support same sex marriage simply doesn't do enough to remove. As such claiming obama doesn't do enough in his proposals is arbitrary at best, hypocritical at worst.
 
S

StoOgE

First tragedy, then farce.
Liara T'Soni said:
That idiot on MSNBC just called Rev Wright a "flip flop" for Obama....oh please....:lol
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this guy has no nutsack. He just let both sides lie about the other side back and forth without calling them out.

Obama raises taxes on families making less than 32K a year. Really? Show me.
 
G

Gaborn

Member
kaching said:
I'm not confusing legal and social equality. You're trying to compatmentalize them but they're intertwined. Inequality in one begets inequality in the other. Marriage fundamentally endorses discrimination that a measure to support same sex marriage simply doesn't do enough to remove. As such claiming obama doesn't do enough in his proposals is arbitrary at best, hypocritical at worst.
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What the hell are you talking about? Marriage equality, so the federal government no longer recognizes arbitrary distinctions between acceptable and unacceptable couples is important. You're never going to fix inequality on an individual level nor should the government try. Gay rights are a means of teaching why we value equality for ourselves under the law, but in the same way that racism is perfectly legal, so are degrees of homophobia, however, as much as I'd defend individuals rights to discriminate I DON'T believe the federal government has that right.
 
K

Kitschkraft

Member
StoOgE said:
this guy has no nutsack. He just let both sides lie about the other side back and forth without calling them out.

Obama raises taxes on families making less than 32K a year. Really? Show me.
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I know right.

Didn't CNN break down the numbers very clearly, showing that Obama only wants to raise taxes on the super rich, while McCain wants to lower taxes for EVERYONE (Including people like Exxon oil execs!)
 
S

StoOgE

First tragedy, then farce.
Also, that newsweek poll is bad news in a way. Obama up 15 points in a national poll? The MSM is going to go after him hard and fast to try and keep this close and interesting.

The best part, that poll doesn't even assume Obama gets out the black, latino or youth vote more than Kerry did. AND it fails to take into account the larger number of people self identifying as Dems. It might be worse than that... :lol :lol :lol
 
Guileless

Guileless

Temp Banned for Remedial Purposes
Re: foreign policy advisers. The people who will argue on the record that not intervening in Rwanda was the morally superior choice may not be suitable to the Democratic party because of their views on immigration, e.g. the guy who wrote Ron Paul's newsletters.
 
G

Gaborn

Member
Karma Kramer said:
Glad he supports the legalization of marijuana.
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Yeah, he's even lobbied for the Marijuana Party Project since becoming a Libertarian. He's definitely flipped on the issue but I honestly believe on that issue at least he's sincere. I DON'T like his position on gay marriage but then I already explained why it doesn't bother me in his case.
 
D

dead souls

Member
GrotesqueBeauty said:
I love how even when Democrats have the majority they still roll over. Spineless sacks of shit.
Click to expand...

Pretty much. It's very unfortunate. That's why I would never call myself a democrat. Such fucking weak charlatans.
 
D

Deus Ex Machina

Member
DreamMachine said:
did anyone find out how much obama raised in may?
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Obama raises $22 million in May

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080620/ap_on_el_pr/campaign_money_2

WASHINGTON - Democrat Barack Obama has reported raising $22 million in May for his presidential campaign, his weakest fundraising month this year. He ended the month with $43 million cash on hand, according to his campaign.

Obama has been the fundraising leader in the presidential contest, but his May totals nearly match Republican rival John McCain's fundraising for the month.

Overall, Obama has raised more than $287 million during the past 17 months. McCain has raised a total of $115 million.

Obama's campaign reported that, of his total cash on hand, nearly $10 million was exclusively for the general election.
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A

Amir0x

Banned
Disappointing those Obama fundy numbers. Obviously they're still ok, but He needs his full powerhouse raising to go the route he is.
 
T

Tamanon

Banned
Amir0x said:
So what's the news for today? I've been out since 6 this morning, so any relevant news is appreciated :)
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FISA OH NOOZZZZZZ

McCain and Obama raised the same amount this month

Newsweek says Obama is up 15 points nationally

And LOL at the President waving to two guys and they don't even wave back.:lol
 
T

Tamanon

Banned
It was just shown on countdown, can't find a clip on youtube yet. It was him getting out of a car with his entourage and there were 2 people on the other side of a fence here in NC, they're the only crowd. He waves at them like he always does, they don't respond, so he does one of those goofy-ass overemphasized waves and they still don't.:lol
 
S

speculawyer

Member
GrotesqueBeauty said:
I love how even when Democrats have the majority they still roll over. Spineless sacks of shit.
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I can't tell if they are spineless sacks of shit or if they sold us out for donations from telecoms.

Either way, they suck.
 
T

Tamanon

Banned
:lol :lol :lol

"Name one person that knows Obama that tells you he is elitist, if you're going to say you know people that know him, then name one for this charge"

Shuster!:lol
 
H

Hootie

Member
Tamanon said:
It was just shown on countdown, can't find a clip on youtube yet. It was him getting out of a car with his entourage and there were 2 people on the other side of a fence here in NC, they're the only crowd. He waves at them like he always does, they don't respond, so he does one of those goofy-ass overemphasized waves and they still don't.:lol
Click to expand...


Would've been epic if they both gave him the finger. :lol
 
G

GhaleonEB

Member
Wow. Obama only raised $22m this month, and McCain did $21.5m?

Of course, Obama has spent a lot of this month raising money for the DNC, but I'm surprised he didn't get more after locking the nomination.
 
T

Tamanon

Banned
GhaleonEB said:
Wow. Obama only raised $22m this month, and McCain did $21.5m?

Of course, Obama has spent a lot of this month raising money for the DNC, but I'm surprised he didn't get more after locking the nomination.
Click to expand...

Remember, he didn't lock up the nomination in May. That's what the fundraising numbers were for. Clinton was still running and acting like it was a real race.

I missed Obama's fundraiser in Jacksonville today:(
 
G

GhaleonEB

Member
Tamanon said:
Remember, he didn't lock up the nomination in May. That's what the fundraising numbers were for. Clinton was still running and acting like it was a real race.

I missed Obama's fundraiser in Jacksonville today:(
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GAH! I was just coming in here to edit. Total brain-fart. :lol
 
G

GhaleonEB

Member
One thing I noticed about Obama's numbers: his total went down from April, but he has more cash on hand now. He conserved big time in May relative to April.

Some crunching:

Code: 
	April	May
Raised	31	22
Spent	36	16
On-Hand	37	43
 
K

Karma Kramer

Banned
GhaleonEB said:
One thing I noticed about Obama's numbers: his total went down from April, but he has more cash on hand now. He conserved big time in May relative to April.

Some crunching:

Code: 
	April	May
Raised	31	22
Spent	36	16
On-Hand	37	43
Click to expand...

Well there were primaries he had to deal with in April.
 
K

Kitschkraft

Member
From what I understand, Obama barely even campaigned this month, he's no where near full capacity.

McCain is probably already going all out.

Obama is going to at least out raise McCain 2-to-1, don't worry fellas.
 
D

Deus Ex Machina

Member
Liara T'Soni said:
From what I understand, Obama barely even campaigned this month, he's no where near full capacity.

McCain is probably already going all out.

Obama is going to at least out raise McCain 2-to-1, don't worry fellas.
Click to expand...
I think the small donors are getting tapped out.. Gas prices are tapping out moderate/middle income donors too.
 
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