Yeah, im just a fan of the series in general, so figured id enjoy it regardless. Plus ive never really seen a bad 16bit konami game...aside from tmnt tournament fighters.
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Sega Genesis/MegaDrive Appreciation Thread: Alien Storm > Golden Axe
- Thread starter IrishNinja
- Start date
Yeah, im just a fan of the series in general, so figured id enjoy it regardless. Plus ive never really seen a bad 16bit konami game...aside from tmnt tournament fighters.
Morrigan Stark
Arrogant Smirk
This might be a very, very stupid and ignorant question, considering I've owned a Genesis for a long time and I've been an avid player back in the day but... what does that button do? I don't think I've ever played a game where it was used... >_>
Shadow Hog
Member
It's either used as a button in a game (very rarely), or you hold it in while powering the console on and the controller will then work as a 3-button one (only useful for games that flip the heck out otherwise, like Forgotten Worlds).
On a Nomad, you still need to plug in a 3-button pad to get Forgotten Worlds to actually start playing. It is not fooled by mode on that system
saveweyard
Banned
I never owned any of the Sega consoles (don't hate me!) but I've been looking into some of the older shmups across all systems and the Genesis looks like it had some good ones.
I only recently got into the genre, which is a shame because I've been missing out on so much! I'm looking forward to trying out Thunder Force IV and some of the other ones soon.
I only recently got into the genre, which is a shame because I've been missing out on so much! I'm looking forward to trying out Thunder Force IV and some of the other ones soon.
thelatestmodel
Junior, please.
Got a few CIB games this week:
And I finally got a complete copy of Crack Down! Can't wait to play co-op.
Japanese Crack Down was one of the first games I got with my Asian Mega Drive (no idea how I ended up with one in the UK at age 9). I remember being very intrigued by the Japanese cartridge shape and different logos.
Arguably the best version of the game - I went back and tried the arcade version and it just felt a lot more clunky and unreasonably hard.
sixteen-bit
Member
PCE/TG16 has the best shooters of that console era, but Genesis certainly is no slouch.
J-Roderton
Member
If I had known I was going to start collecting SEGA Genesis again at 23, I would have kicked my own ass for trading away all of my games and console many years ago. Just grabbed a Genesis and a few games. The retro shop that opened up in my town doesn't exactly have the best selection of Genesis games and 90% of what they have CIB is just sports titles. I pretty much bought them out of any Genesis game that's worth anything. Looks like I'll just be checking in weekly to see what they get in.
Also picked up one of those off brand 6 button controllers. I got it for Eternal Champions and it won't even register that a controller is plugged in but it works for all other games that don't even need 6 buttons. WTF? Anyone ever had that happen?
Also picked up one of those off brand 6 button controllers. I got it for Eternal Champions and it won't even register that a controller is plugged in but it works for all other games that don't even need 6 buttons. WTF? Anyone ever had that happen?
I apreciated the changes to the gameplay from Genesis Sparkster compared to the recycled SNES version. Its overall a faster game, and more focused about your jetpack (it now refills automatically and you can chain two jetpack boosts).
Problem is that the new art is kind of ugly and some of the levels arent that good (that robot level....).
RKA is still far superior to both though.
sixteen-bit
Member
Sparkster Genesis' roulette system is awful and ruins the game. There's a great deconstruction here:
http://youtu.be/2lQnL9wsTPY?t=4m5s
A Black Falcon
Member
Yeah, it's one of Konami's few great Genesis games. A lot of their Genesis games seem pretty low-budget or lacking, but not Rocket Knight Adventures or Contra: Hard Corps. The rest of them though... :S
IrishNinja
Member
man Bloodlines was awesome
A Black Falcon
Member
No way, Bloodlines is mediocre and highly disappointing compared to Super Castlevania IV or Rondo of Blood.
IrishNinja
Member
those are fantastic games, but do not take from Bloodlines' greatness. its shorter & something different, but by no means disappointing! i reject this opinion, falcons.
Bar81
Member
Agreed.
IrishNinja
Member
OH SNAP
might have to update the OP
A Black Falcon
Member
Bloodlines is very, very far from being a great game. I don't quite know why some Genesis fans insist on defending it, it's half the game that SCIV was at best...
Morrigan Stark
Arrogant Smirk
Except that isn't true at all and Bloodlines is awesome and you're wrong!
IrishNinja
Member
undeniably, there was hype about finally getting a CV game on a sega system
the world tour of stages provided for some cool environments, the soundtrack is still some of the better examples of genesis' sound, and while IV did some cool things with rotating levels, bloodlines was no slouch in switching it up as well.
level design was good and i recall having multiple paths, bosses were memorable...admittedly the game gets forgotten around here in CV discussions too often but it's a solid entry in the series, i wanna say it's every bit as good as i remember Dracula X at the least. what exactly do you think it needs defense from? it's a great game.
smbu2000
Member
Haha, but couldn't you use that phrase with one of the Genesis/MD "stack" pics as well.
I cant say I agree in some points. I understand the bombs could be annoying, although I didnt have much problems with it. And the sword is nerfed because the jetpack is overpowered now, gameplay focus more on using it.
I think the problem is that the game lacked polish to implement the new ideas, especially on its level design. SNES version was way more polished.
IrishNinja
Member
Haha, but couldn't you use that phrase with one of the Genesis/MD "stack" pics as well.
damn, that pic accounts for like 10% of the 32X's lifetime sales, too
sixteen-bit
Member
Chiaroscuro
Member
I remember this add from the magazines of the early 90s. I still have my EGM collection from that period. Good times.
Shadow Hog
Member
I think my only real issue with Bloodlines is the limited continues - and that the password save how many continues you have. Otherwise, it's quite fun.
Blows my mind everytime I hear that. PC engine was nuts. I need to hit the PC engine thread to ask some questions lol.
A Black Falcon
Member
Bloodlines has several serious problems.
First, the graphics and sound aren't as good as the SNES or TGCD games. I guess it's okay looking and sounding for the Genesis, but the system can do better -- look at Rocket Knight Adventures or Contra Hard Corps for example, both have better graphics, and as good or better music, too. Bloodlines doesn't look like anything special, really; the graphics are average at best. As for the music, it's nowhere near as good as Super Castlevania IV; I know some of that is probably hardware limitations, but I can't help but compare them, and Bloodlines comes up very seriously lacking.
Second, the game has Konami Genesis game level design, which means that the game has too few levels which are too long. TMNT: The Hyperstone Heist (a very seriously mediocre game, for a Turtles beat 'em up), Sunset Riders (another major disappointment), Bloodlines, and some other Konami games are like this. RKA is too, really. All of those games have a relatively small number of fairly long levels. It's a balance which sometimes works (RKA), but more often isn't as fun as the shorter levels in the SNES games in those franchises. This design decision means that if you die in Bloodlines and it's game over, you go back a LONG way. It can be frustrating.
Third, in Bloodlines, the above issue is compounded almost to game-breaking status when you remember that it's the one and only Castlevania game ever that has limited continues... and the continues are saved in your password! This is just a ludicrous design decision. Yes, I know Genesis games are often hard, more so than SNES games, but that kind of horribly cruel design is not okay, This decision makes the game more frustrating than it's worth, a lot of the time.
And last, the game has two playable characters. That may sound good, but it's not. One of the characters can attack diagonally while on the ground, but can't attack diagonally in the air, while the other can attack diagonally while in the air, but not on the ground. It's an absurdly cruel joke, like the programmers saying "hey, remember how great Super Castlevania IV's whip controls were? Well, here's half of that, have fun being frustrated at how much worse the controls are here than SCIV!" Ugh!
That's only one of its major flaws.
Well, the TG16 has an 8-bit CPU, but I think the graphics chip is 16-bit...
Red Liquorice
Member
I see Flicky near the top. Great game, I remember it getting good reviews in magazines but all my friends having a go at me for paying £30 for an old game with "bad graphics". Still love that game even now, they were so wrong.
Morrigan Stark
Arrogant Smirk
Let's just say that I don't agree with a single thing Falcon said. Bloodlines had beautiful graphics (and who can forget the nice mode 7 scaling in the Pisa boss area?), awesome music, having two characters was a strength (one was much harder than the other, but that's okay), the level lengths were fine, and it was hard but not that hard considering I actually beat the game once and I am outright terrible at classicvanias so it can't be that bad. (I struggle a lot more in Super Castlevania IV, never did beat that one.)
Why the bitching at restarting a long way if you die? It's standard classicvania fare, hell, it's standard 8-bit and 16-bit design, Bloodlines is not special or particularly cruel in that.
Why the bitching at restarting a long way if you die? It's standard classicvania fare, hell, it's standard 8-bit and 16-bit design, Bloodlines is not special or particularly cruel in that.
A Black Falcon
Member
Uh, that Bloodlines has longer levels (and thus fewer bosses, something I didn't mention), splits its diagonal attacks between the characters, and has limited continues and saves the number of continues you have left are facts, not opinions. You could try to explain away why you don't mind those things, but they ARE flaws, flaws which SCIV does not have.
Yeah, I don't agree at all on any of these points. The graphics are bland and uninteresting, the music's a pale imitation of SCIV's music, splitting the diagonal attacks ruined any benefits that having two characters would have had and anyway the two are pretty similar beyond each having a unique special or two; look at Portrait of Ruin or Rondo of Blood for games which do having multiple characters to choose from well, not this game... and the levels are a bit too long, just like, as I said, Hyperstone Heist and Sunset Riders.
It really is amazing how opposite Contra Hard Corps is from most anything else Konami did on the Genesis... it's got amazing graphics, short levels, better design and gameplay than the SNES incarnation in its franchise... doesn't feel like a Konami Genesis game at all! Okay, it is crazy, crazy hard in its Western release, because of how they added in limited continues and reduced your health from three hits to one (versus the Japanese original), but still, it's easily my favorite Contra game ever.
The levels are probably half again as long as the levels in almost any other classic Castlevania game, that's the problem. You aren't sent back nearly as far in the other games.
"Limited continues" is now inherently a flaw? lol, man. I cannot relate with any of this.
A Black Falcon
Member
When every single other Castlevania game ever made lets you continue as many times as you want, while only this one does not let you do that, yes, it absolutely is a flaw.
Seven Force
Banned
SCIV's definitely a good game, but it's just so goddamned boring to play after a while. I'll take the arcade-y style of Bloodlines over SCIV any day.
Wait, what? Bloodlines and Super Castlevania IV have completely different musical styles. SCIV's soundtrack is a lot moodier and somewhat grand on occasion, whereas Bloodlines has a more upbeat soundtrack more in line with the NES trilogy. They aren't even comparable.
Wait, what? Bloodlines and Super Castlevania IV have completely different musical styles. SCIV's soundtrack is a lot moodier and somewhat grand on occasion, whereas Bloodlines has a more upbeat soundtrack more in line with the NES trilogy. They aren't even comparable.
Morrigan Stark
Arrogant Smirk
Or having long levels. I mean, WTF.
Chiaroscuro
Member
It is a design choise. If limited continues and long levels does not appeal you as a gamer and thus you enjoyed the game less it is not a game flaw, but your opinion about the game. The game is not broken because of that, it is just harder.
i am gobsmacked
A Black Falcon
Member
I'm sorry, but no. Save systems are absolutely something which can be objectively better or worse, and better save systems make games better (and vice versa). Of course a great game can overcome a poor save/continue system, such as how I love US Contra: Hard Corps despite the damage Konami did to it in its Western release, but it hurts.
SCIV does have a harder second quest, you know... and yeah, it's definitely a much longer game, but I think that makes it better. It's a great epic adventure.
I didn't mean that they have the same music, but there are some songs that are in both games, and they're worlds better on SNES, as is the soundtrack as a whole. And they do have musical similarities, both being Castlevania games. SCIV has one of the great soundtracks of its time. Bloodlines... doesn't.
I said that having long levels isn't always bad. It depends on the implementation -- RKA has long levels but does it well, while Hyperstone Heist, Bloodlines, and Sunset Riders don't. Done well or not though, it's just a common theme that seems to be in a bunch of major Konami Genesis games.
Seven Force
Banned
I'll just agree to disagree, then. I think the omni-directional whip (as cool as it is) kind of breaks the game since it's pretty easy to manipulate it into being makeshift shield of sorts to negate damage, in addition to some of the challenge being taken out the platforming since you no longer had to 100% commit to a jump like the older games. And I just prefer Bloodlines' soundtrack more overall.
To each their own, though!
To each their own, though!
Retry structures ("save systems") don't exist in a vacuum. How lax one is does not directly correlate with how good it is (which is what you seem to be suggesting), since its quality is measured by how well it compliments everything else about the game. Certain types of games work best with more limiting retry structures than others, and short 2D action games (like Bloodlines) are among the most fitting.
A Black Falcon
Member
Unless the game is pretty easy, platformers should almost never have limited continues.
Sir Ilpalazzo
Member
Why not? Limited continues put a lot more pressure on the player and encourage mastery of the whole game rather than just a few segments, which are both pretty great qualities to have in a strong action game.
Gunstarheroes
Member
I know i enjoyed my time with Bloodlines, having played through it 3 times now. I really dig some of the bosses and music in the game. Though, i do feel it pales in comparison to Super Castlevania IV.
Shadow Hog
Member
Seriously? Bloodlines graphics and sound are mediocre? I can't agree with that at all.
Graphically, Bloodlines has some set-pieces I still remember fairly distinctly (like the sinking sanctuary, the blimps, the circular stairway around the Tower of Pisa, etc), and it always looked quite good for the console. SCIV looks better, fair enough, but I chalk that up to the Genesis/SNES difference more than anything else.
As for music, it took me forever to acclimate to any of Super Castlevania IV's soundtrack, because most of it is ambient stuff so unlike the rest of the franchise (which typically relies on catchy melodies that sound like they could either be rock songs or baroque music, or somewhere in between); meanwhile, Bloodlines, while the bass could stand to be a fair bit stronger than it is, hooked me pretty quickly. "Reincarnated Soul", "The Sinking Sanctuary" and "Iron-Blue Intention" are all some of the best tracks in the entire series (all getting remixed in Castlevania the Adventure Rebirth, Legacy of Darkness/Circle of the Moon and Portrait of Ruin, respectively). I even prefer its version of "Theme of Simon Belmont", despite SCIV being the game to introduce it. On top of that, it's the first game in the series to be done by the woman who's generally considered to be the premier composer for the series, Michiru Yamane - not too long before she went on to solidify that claim with Symphony of the Night's soundtrack. So yeah... not to knock SCIV, but Bloodlines easily has the edge here.
Also, my mind's always been somewhat blown by how Bloodlines makes the Bram Stoker book canon. Granted, it has to jump through some rather awkward hoops to do so (which had to be elaborated upon in Portrait of Ruin, making the Morris family the stewards of the Vampire Killer from when Richter Belmont was done with it up until Julius Belmont would inherit it for the final battle in 1999), but the fact they were willing to try amuses me greatly.
I definitely agree about the continues thing, though. That shit would've ruined Rayman if there weren't cheats to give you practically infinite continues - 10 might sound generous, but given the game's length, it really isn't. That said, Bloodlines didn't strike me as a game long enough to worry so much about it - I've never beaten it, admittedly, so I don't know how annoying that gets later into the game.
Graphically, Bloodlines has some set-pieces I still remember fairly distinctly (like the sinking sanctuary, the blimps, the circular stairway around the Tower of Pisa, etc), and it always looked quite good for the console. SCIV looks better, fair enough, but I chalk that up to the Genesis/SNES difference more than anything else.
As for music, it took me forever to acclimate to any of Super Castlevania IV's soundtrack, because most of it is ambient stuff so unlike the rest of the franchise (which typically relies on catchy melodies that sound like they could either be rock songs or baroque music, or somewhere in between); meanwhile, Bloodlines, while the bass could stand to be a fair bit stronger than it is, hooked me pretty quickly. "Reincarnated Soul", "The Sinking Sanctuary" and "Iron-Blue Intention" are all some of the best tracks in the entire series (all getting remixed in Castlevania the Adventure Rebirth, Legacy of Darkness/Circle of the Moon and Portrait of Ruin, respectively). I even prefer its version of "Theme of Simon Belmont", despite SCIV being the game to introduce it. On top of that, it's the first game in the series to be done by the woman who's generally considered to be the premier composer for the series, Michiru Yamane - not too long before she went on to solidify that claim with Symphony of the Night's soundtrack. So yeah... not to knock SCIV, but Bloodlines easily has the edge here.
Also, my mind's always been somewhat blown by how Bloodlines makes the Bram Stoker book canon. Granted, it has to jump through some rather awkward hoops to do so (which had to be elaborated upon in Portrait of Ruin, making the Morris family the stewards of the Vampire Killer from when Richter Belmont was done with it up until Julius Belmont would inherit it for the final battle in 1999), but the fact they were willing to try amuses me greatly.
I definitely agree about the continues thing, though. That shit would've ruined Rayman if there weren't cheats to give you practically infinite continues - 10 might sound generous, but given the game's length, it really isn't. That said, Bloodlines didn't strike me as a game long enough to worry so much about it - I've never beaten it, admittedly, so I don't know how annoying that gets later into the game.
Chiaroscuro
Member
So I ended buying a Model 1 Sega CD on ebay today. I was planning to do so, but I was watching this auction for a few days and it did have a best offer option besides the BIN price. So I just send an offer almost half the BIN price, not expecting anything but the seller accepted it.
It was more like an impulse offer, the Model 1 was the machine I had at the time and nostalgia was hitting me. I know a Model 2 would be more reliable and it is really a gamble since the seller did not test the unit. It looks complete in the box (which however shows wear) The shipping costs are really high for me besides the import fees that I may pay to custos. I am having second thoughts now. Did I make a mistake?
Ah, the auction: http://www.ebay.com/itm/271244035954?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1497.l2649
It was more like an impulse offer, the Model 1 was the machine I had at the time and nostalgia was hitting me. I know a Model 2 would be more reliable and it is really a gamble since the seller did not test the unit. It looks complete in the box (which however shows wear) The shipping costs are really high for me besides the import fees that I may pay to custos. I am having second thoughts now. Did I make a mistake?
Ah, the auction: http://www.ebay.com/itm/271244035954?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1497.l2649
It is sexy. It was the version I had as well. Model 2 Sega CD really does nothing for me. Everything is great about the Model 1 with the the exception of the Sega CD logo, which kinda blows. The MD version looks better.
I forget the actual timeline of release in the different territories but the Mega CD versions were around at the various import shops and time-to-play places for a good while before it actually streeted in the US...so I'm a bit more familiar and partial to the MD version.
I have been looking at various Sega CD systems since I wanna get Night Trap and Snatcher. I'm guessing the X'Eye might be a good version. Seems reliable enough.
theSlacker
Member
Grats. Was watching that before I got a boxed model 2 a few days ago. Sounds like you paid less then I paid for the model 2.
If it works, under $100 for a complete boxed model 1 is good. Even with that shitty box.
Gunstarheroes
Member
Please look at my username, and discover the perfection that is Gunstar Heroes