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Sega Saturn Appreciation and Emulation Thread
- Thread starter Seik
- Start date
Shadow Hog
Member
Is it sad that I saw a YouTube video of Virtual Hydlide and thought "well, this doesn't look QUITE as bad as it's been made out to be"? I'm well aware that it kind of is as bad as it's been made out to be, but still.
I actually own another T&E Soft Saturn game... Pebble Beach Golf Links. Was never any good at it, but the framerate's somehow even worse than VH's.
I actually own another T&E Soft Saturn game... Pebble Beach Golf Links. Was never any good at it, but the framerate's somehow even worse than VH's.
theSlacker
Member
It's what got me to get the game. It's not bad. Once you get past the frame rate.
Saturn pickups.
I grabbed NiGHTS Into Dreams from the shelf, dude said "Sorry, I can't find the disc", what a buzzkill.
Aside from the NiGHTS mishap, thats still pretty good. Especially at 10 bucks each for NA complete stuff.
Honestly I really want Virtua Fighter Kids for some reason. Always thought SD fighters were funny.
sixteen-bit
Member
Did you ask for the empty Nights case? It would be cheaper and easy to find the disc alone to complete it.
So my PVM broke 
Pretty gutted as it is really all I have to display my Saturn.
I have a really nice LED IPS monitor, but TBH I don't really want to drop the price of the PS4 on a Framemeister, especially when I could potentially get the equivalent experience using my Saturn discs though SSF right? Oh and for the record my saturn collection is mainly shmups, and shmups are all i'm really focusing on collecting these days (other than still wanting astal really...)
What do you guys think? Really worth it to shell out for a scaler or can I just use SSF to the same effect essentially? I'd be using the same display regardless.
Pretty gutted as it is really all I have to display my Saturn.
I have a really nice LED IPS monitor, but TBH I don't really want to drop the price of the PS4 on a Framemeister, especially when I could potentially get the equivalent experience using my Saturn discs though SSF right? Oh and for the record my saturn collection is mainly shmups, and shmups are all i'm really focusing on collecting these days (other than still wanting astal really...)
What do you guys think? Really worth it to shell out for a scaler or can I just use SSF to the same effect essentially? I'd be using the same display regardless.
Shadow Hog
Member
The only thing really preventing me from simply getting a Framemeister and calling it a day is the idea that I might, one day, want to replay a light-gun game. Admittedly, the only ones I own are Duck Hunt and Virtua Cop (and between the two, I only have the Zapper to actually play it light gun-style), but it's the principle of the thing.
sixteen-bit
Member
Why not replace the PVM? If you hunt it should be much cheaper than an XRGB Framemeiser.So my PVM broke
Pretty gutted as it is really all I have to display my Saturn.
I have a really nice LED IPS monitor, but TBH I don't really want to drop the price of the PS4 on a Framemeister, especially when I could potentially get the equivalent experience using my Saturn discs though SSF right? Oh and for the record my saturn collection is mainly shmups, and shmups are all i'm really focusing on collecting these days (other than still wanting astal really...)
What do you guys think? Really worth it to shell out for a scaler or can I just use SSF to the same effect essentially? I'd be using the same display regardless.
Does SSF even have upscaling and scanline filters to replicate XRGB?
theSlacker
Member
So my PVM broke
Pretty gutted as it is really all I have to display my Saturn.
I have a really nice LED IPS monitor, but TBH I don't really want to drop the price of the PS4 on a Framemeister, especially when I could potentially get the equivalent experience using my Saturn discs though SSF right? Oh and for the record my saturn collection is mainly shmups, and shmups are all i'm really focusing on collecting these days (other than still wanting astal really...)
What do you guys think? Really worth it to shell out for a scaler or can I just use SSF to the same effect essentially? I'd be using the same display regardless.
Or you can try to get another pvm.
Shadow Hog
Member
How large do those PVMs get, anyway? I'm trying to decide if I should get one or not - while I'd probably stick with S-Video for now, I like the idea of having a CRT TV that supports RGB.
theSlacker
Member
20 is about the biggest you should buy, but there are bigger. Think the ones that were made bigger have screen problems and are older.
Shadow Hog
Member
See, I'm concerned that a 20" television would be kind of hard to play on from across the room. I mean, my current computer monitor, the Asus VH236H, is 23", and while it's fine for when I'm only a few feet away from the monitor, I don't think it's good for the kind of setup I'd be hoping for whenever I move into an apartment or condo.
Does is? I have no idea. I don't even have windows machine, I'll be dual booting for this purpose.
And yeah, of course a PVM hunt is already underway, but given the last one took close to a year to find (8 months to be exact) I guess i'm asking if this is a viable solution until and if a PVM becomes an option...
I can't deny the death of my PVM has soured me a little on CRT's - i now have first hand experience that this is simply old technology that will one day likely be entirely unavailable.
As great as CRTs are they are eventually going to disappear. That is why I kinda tag-team CRT/HDTV.
Have you looked into getting it repaired? Not sure where you are located but in LA, for example, plenty of folks who still work on them given the production legacy. Might just be a simple fix. You can always trouble-shoot yourself as well. I don't recommend going inside the unit but I did take one of my larger PGMs apart just to see how it was built and where the other pots are located.
Have you looked into getting it repaired? Not sure where you are located but in LA, for example, plenty of folks who still work on them given the production legacy. Might just be a simple fix. You can always trouble-shoot yourself as well. I don't recommend going inside the unit but I did take one of my larger PGMs apart just to see how it was built and where the other pots are located.
Screens are flat but if you are talking profile then no...you need the depth for the gun.
Shadow Hog
Member
Upscaling is more relevant to raw video signals. Most emulators do not attempt to mimic the raw video signals a television would take in; they instead capture the raw image that would be sent out and display that directly, and can quickly and cheaply scale it as needed. (If it's not obvious, I'm not 100% confident this description is entirely accurate, but there is a difference between the raw image an emulator deals with, and a picture designed for display on an interlaced display, with things like luminance, chrominance and such to worry about.)
And SSF has adjustable scanlines, yes.
Yes! I imagine you'd have to get it second-hand but I remember Sony made some nice ones back in the day...
Case in point... http://www.overstock.com/Electronics/Toshiba-34-inch-HD-Ready-Flat-Screen-TUBE-TV-Refurb/1927539/product.html
theSlacker
Member
Yeah it's not for everyone. People that get them for gaming normally have them set up in a way like using a computer, where they sit fairly close to them, not across a room. CRTs end up weighting a giga ton when you get ones that can be viewed from that far away.
With this I wouldn't really have a reason to use anything over the A/V cables for old consoles.
Please answer this if you can, does a Sega Saturn/SNES/N64/Genesis look better on a LCD/Plasma using SCART/S-Video or look better on a CRT using A/V cables?
sixteen-bit
Member
Genesis looks awful in composite, but you're probably fine with the others. Keep in mind that is a HD CRT, so it won't have scan lines and your old stuff won't look as nice as on an SD CRT. I have also heard reports of HD CRTs introducing lag when displaying SD content, but I don't know if that's true.
Shadow Hog
Member
I've also heard that HD CRTs don't work with light-gun games, which kind of defeats the entire point of me getting one.
smbu2000
Member
Isn't your monitor widescreen though? 16:9 (1080p) most likely? Viewing 4:3 content on that would be about the equivalent of an 18.7" 4:3 tv. That 20" would have a slightly bigger viewable area for 4:3 content.
If you don't mind the extra size/weight you could also go with a larger WEGA or something. It's a pain to move them around though.
I'm still using my 25" WEGA until I get the BNC->JP21 RGB cable I ordered for my 20" PVM. I'll probably still use it for my PS2 as well. My Saturn/MD/SFC etc will all be on the PVM though.
ExitPlanetDust
Member
Absolutely. A true hidden gem.
Dammit
sixteen-bit
Member
I've never played it, but from the footage I've seen, it really doesn't look like my cup of tea. I've heard good things though!
BlackClouds
Member
This thread makes me sad that all my Saturn game cases got destroyed (long story), those things were so fragile. I still have my Saturn and disc only games including burning rangers, guardian heroes, SF collection, enemy zero, sonic jam, etc. Might be time to let somebody else enjoy these titles.
cj_iwakura
Member
Update on Princess Crown:
Morrigan Stark
Arrogant Smirk
Holy shit, a Princess Crown patch is in the works? That is so awesome. I've had the game for a while and even printed a FAQ to be able to play, but I sorta gave up because it was a pain in the ass. I'd love to revisit it if it's translated!
Bar81
Member
Such a good game.
How to tell Japan 21-pin and SCART apart: http://www.gamesx.com/wiki/doku.php?id=av:scart2rgb - should be pretty simple as a few pins are not used on the Japan side that are for SCART. Opening the cable is very simple; loosen the cylinder on the side of the SCART connector by hand, then use a flat, small screwdriver to pop the connector apart. It is held together by locking tabs.
Opening the connector or using a DMM on the pins is the only way you're going to know how it is wired.
You can buy cables here: http://www.retrogamingcables.co.uk/ - he can pin them for either Japan 21-pin or SCART, just ask (SCART by default). Note that for Saturn you MUST specify if the console is NTSC or PAL (it matters).
Opening the connector or using a DMM on the pins is the only way you're going to know how it is wired.
You can buy cables here: http://www.retrogamingcables.co.uk/ - he can pin them for either Japan 21-pin or SCART, just ask (SCART by default). Note that for Saturn you MUST specify if the console is NTSC or PAL (it matters).
Didn't see this answered, apologies if someone already mentioned it.
This is because you purchased the game on a friend's system; the game's license is associated with the console, which is why you can only play it on your console if you're online.
To fix this, you need to use the DRM License tool. You can only use this a limited amount of times (check the help articles).
This will fix your problems with your home (main) console and you will be able to play it offline... on your home (main) console. If you try and play at your friends place, you will need to login.
Why doesn't the add to cart button work?
Yes! One of my top 10 favourite Saturn games, period. Extremely overlooked by Saturn fans, even considering it's Japan only.
I tried playing Princess Crown with the translation guide on a laptop next to my TV, but it's too much work. This is the first I have heard of an actual translation... hell yeah!
Genesis Knight
Member
Nice to hear! My copy is ready and waiting!
Mouse over -> OUT OF STOCK
Sorry folks, didn't notice
Shoot him an email, I've ordered items from him before that way that were listed as being out of stock.Shadow Hog
Member
Come to think of it, I wonder if they could wire up a custom Genesis Model 1 cable that gets the RGB from the back of the console, but has two separate wires for stereo audio? I kind of want to fetch the stereo from the stereo ports on either the Sega CD it's plugged into, or the stereo ports that were modded into the Genesis as part of the S-Video mod I've got on it.
I do see a SCART cable with separate RCA audio cables, but that seems to be on the output end and not the input end. The closest thing I see to what I do want is a cable that fetches RGB from the port in back and stereo audio from the headphone port, which is... probably acceptable, but not ideal.
(I'm not quite ready to jump to RGB, since nothing I have really supports it at this time, but thinking ahead...)
I do see a SCART cable with separate RCA audio cables, but that seems to be on the output end and not the input end. The closest thing I see to what I do want is a cable that fetches RGB from the port in back and stereo audio from the headphone port, which is... probably acceptable, but not ideal.
(I'm not quite ready to jump to RGB, since nothing I have really supports it at this time, but thinking ahead...)
theSlacker
Member
The only thing that outputs stereo on the original genesis is the front headphone port. So the only way to get stereo from it is to get it from the front headphone port, be it from a connecter from it to the back of a sega cd, or the scart cable that has the extra cord to go get it.
Shadow Hog
Member
Except for my Genesis, which has stereo ports on the back.
I'm just saying, these cables were custom-made already, right?
Sega Saturn is my favorite Sega console. I love it more than even the Dreamcast. It's hard to describe how awesome it was to play Street Fighter Zero 3 and recognizing they added the little details that was in the arcade version. I end up buying stuff for it cause it was for the Saturn. Which leads me to this question
I bought this mpeg card on ebay for $55 a few years ago (I'm thinking 2007, 2008). I've yet to see it again anywhere. Is anyone familiar with this specific model? I know the Sega brand well as I often see them on auction.
I bought this mpeg card on ebay for $55 a few years ago (I'm thinking 2007, 2008). I've yet to see it again anywhere. Is anyone familiar with this specific model? I know the Sega brand well as I often see them on auction.
theSlacker
Member
Sorry about that.
Danny Dudekisser
I paid good money for this Dynex!
Sega Saturn is my favorite Sega console. I love it more than even the Dreamcast. It's hard to describe how awesome it was to play Street Fighter Zero 3 and recognizing they added the little details that was in the arcade version. I end up buying stuff for it cause it was for the Saturn. Which leads me to this question
I bought this mpeg card on ebay for $55 a few years ago (I'm thinking 2007, 2008). I've yet to see it again anywhere. Is anyone familiar with this specific model? I know the Sega brand well as I often see them on auction.
Oh, yeah, that's the newest version of the Victor VCD card. It'll let you use photo CDs, too. As far as I know, Victor's cards were the go-to for VCD playback.
RoryDropkick
Member
Sega Saturn is my favorite Sega console. I love it more than even the Dreamcast. It's hard to describe how awesome it was to play Street Fighter Zero 3 and recognizing they added the little details that was in the arcade version. I end up buying stuff for it cause it was for the Saturn. Which leads me to this question
I bought this mpeg card on ebay for $55 a few years ago (I'm thinking 2007, 2008). I've yet to see it again anywhere. Is anyone familiar with this specific model? I know the Sega brand well as I often see them on auction.
Oh, the Saturn Twin Operator, it plays Video and Photo CDs. I have one in my Saturn currently.
Shadow Hog
Member
It's cool.
Thinking about it, I could probably just get the Model 1 SCART cable with the 2.5mm male connector, and find a 2.5mm to 2xRCA adapter. 2.5mm goes into the adapter, other end of the adapter goes into the added ports on the back. I know those exist, I've seen them...
This should really be in the Genesis thread, shouldn't it? (Not like this RGB talk doesn't float in between here, there and the SNES thread all the time, anyway...)
Morrigan Stark
Arrogant Smirk
I recently borrowed Shining Wisdom from my brother. I remember this game having had average reviews back in the day, and I can sorta see why. It plays and feels like a 16-bit game, not a 32-bit game*. And I don't just mean the graphics, though they are indeed fairly primitive, but as far as Zelda clones go I've seen much better. The sword has pitiful range, and the enemies respawn if you so much as move out of the screen for two inches, making combat a bit frustrating sometimes. Also it was frustrating to not be able to use the special boots at the same time as the sword (seriously, WTF). The Saturn had 6 buttons, there's really no excuse for that; even if it's adapted from a Genesis framework, the Genesis did have a 6-button controller!
I'm still early into the game and haven't yet found any orbs, so I'm hoping this will add some depth to the combat a bit.
Oh and the music is honestly pretty bad so far. The dungeons background music is a more repetitive ambient style that isn't too grating, but the world map, the main town and the castle have really bad music. Which is really surprising considering it's the same composer as Landstalker and Shining Force 1 and 2, which had pretty good music on a less powerful console too. Weird.
* According to Wikipedia, "Shining Wisdom was originally designed for the Mega Drive, and adapted for the Saturn at the last minute, presumably in order to bolster the new system's library of games.", which certainly explains a lot. Though honestly there are later Genesis games that look, sound and play better than Shining Wisdom, such as Beyond Oasis or Landstalker, hah.
I'll still give it a chance but overall it seems like an okay game at best, to play if you really need to scratch that Zelda itch.
I'm still early into the game and haven't yet found any orbs, so I'm hoping this will add some depth to the combat a bit.
Oh and the music is honestly pretty bad so far. The dungeons background music is a more repetitive ambient style that isn't too grating, but the world map, the main town and the castle have really bad music. Which is really surprising considering it's the same composer as Landstalker and Shining Force 1 and 2, which had pretty good music on a less powerful console too. Weird.
* According to Wikipedia, "Shining Wisdom was originally designed for the Mega Drive, and adapted for the Saturn at the last minute, presumably in order to bolster the new system's library of games.", which certainly explains a lot. Though honestly there are later Genesis games that look, sound and play better than Shining Wisdom, such as Beyond Oasis or Landstalker, hah.
I'll still give it a chance but overall it seems like an okay game at best, to play if you really need to scratch that Zelda itch.