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[Javier]

If you have to make this many concessions, then it probably isn't going to work out. Aside from the fact that he can hurl turnips (like Peach!!!), what can Captain Toad even do? Pull a firecracker out of his backpack? Give me a break. Again, what can Captain Toad do that normal Toad can't? Mario is the last franchise that needs a new representative, and I don't like the idea of including worthless characters just because they're recent.

I don't know about that. I mean, the Captain Toad devs definitely seem to be pushing for the character:

http://nintendoeverything.com/capta...s-to-see-the-character-in-a-variety-of-games/

I personally want to see him featured in a variety of games. I’ve even ‘secretly’ emailed the director of Mario Kart to see if he’d consider including Captain Toad, but I haven’t heard back from him yet!

Through the development of this game I’ve grown even fonder of Captain Toad. he can’t jump, and struggles to defeat his opponents, but it’s precisely that he is not a powerful character that he can show us his unique take on all these situations. as a developer of his game, and one of his fans, I look forward to seeing where he goes next.

At the rate this is going I feel that Captain Toad might become THE Toad.

 

[balladofwindfishes]

If you have to make this many concessions, then it probably isn't going to work out. Aside from the fact that he can hurl turnips (like Peach!!!), what can Captain Toad even do? Pull a firecracker out of his backpack? Give me a break. Again, what can Captain Toad do that normal Toad can't? Mario is the last franchise that needs a new representative, and I don't like the idea of including worthless characters just because they're recent.

Captain Toad can be a stand alone character with an actual name unique appearance and personality, regular Toad has to be identified by the color of his head, that's how unique he is. So that's one major thing Captain Toad has, that Toad does not.

As for the rest of your post, I could substitute it with Captain Falcon, pre Smash 64 and the same argument would work. Just change the firecracker bit to be about driving a car.

But anyway, Captain Toad can pick turnips. He can use a pick axe. He could shine his light to stun people. He can heave his backpack around for attacks. He can fumble in his pack and throw random stuff. His final smash could be calling the rest of the toad brigade in to do something. He could easily have a Toadette alt character costume.

They could easily make him unique, just look at Bowser Jr. They took what could have just been Bowser, but smaller, and made him into a mech fighter and entirely unique to anything we've seen in Smash.

 

[Wreck-It Ralph]

The problem with this argument is that Dixie is a near clone of Diddy in her own games. If you want to give her some crazy unique moveset that doesn't play like diddy's at all, then you'd have to deviate from the source material to get a moveset.

That works, sometimes, like in the case of bowser jr, but that also only worked because nobody gave a shit about Bowser Jr, really.

Have you actually played DKC2? Dixie is almost as different from Diddy as Diddy was from DK in DKC1:

Comparing them to Diddy:

DK - Slower, holds barrels above his head, has a ground slap, can kill bigger enemies by jumping on them.
Dixie - Slower, holds barrels above her head, has the twirl glide.

DK has one more extra difference than Dixie.

Going by your logic, Diddy should be a clone of DK, and the fact that he isn't is seriously deviating from the source material.

Dixie doesn't have a tail, but instead a ponytail. She doesn't use peanut popguns or rocketbarrels, and Diddy's other two specials, the banana peel and whatever his side B is called, were completely original to Smash. So were nearly all of his normals except his running cartwheel attack.

I just don't understand your logic at all. You're starting with the assumption that Dixie MUST be a Diddy clone and ignoring any argument against that assumption, and in fact invent new reasons to assert that assumption every time your old reasons are shot down.

You imply that you think she should be a clone because doing otherwise would upset her fans. Now, ignoring for a second that I doubt any fans of Dixie would prefer for her to be a Diddy clone than have a unique moveset, don't you think that it upsets her fans more that she's not in the game? Like, I know Wario fans are annoyed that Wario barely resembles his Wario Land character and instead has a moveset that's basically 100% invented by Sakurai, but I seriously doubt that Wario fans would prefer he wasn't in the game at all.

If you just don't like the character, then that's fine, whatever. But your reasoning for why she shouldn't be in the game is flimsy at best.

 

[AzureTranquility95]

F-Zero's rep is totally reasonable. That is not a popular franchise in any reality, and has had few games.

I'm gonna have to agree. 15 songs, most of them being good to great, in addition to the bare minimum of 1 character and 1 stage(It actually has more than 1, I think like 3-4 between the entire series?), while also throwing in Samurai Goroh as an Assist Trophy because adding him as a character would have just given us "another swordsman".

 

[A Link to the Past]

Sakurai: "When Captain Toad got his invitation to join Smash, he started working out night and day to get his jump in tip-top shape. He's still a bit of a heavyweight with that pack, but at least he can participate now!"

There, that easy. Paula taught Ness magic, Captain Toad exercised.

 

[RomanceDawn]

Have you actually played DKC2? Dixie is almost as different from Diddy as Diddy was from DK in DKC1:

Comparing them to Diddy:

DK - Slower, holds barrels above his head, has a ground slap, can kill bigger enemies by jumping on them.
Dixie - Slower, holds barrels above her head, has the twirl glide.

DK has one more extra difference than Dixie.

Going by your logic, Diddy should be a clone of DK, and the fact that he isn't is seriously deviating from the source material.

Dixie doesn't have a tail, but instead a ponytail. She doesn't use peanut popguns or rocketbarrels, and Diddy's other two specials, the banana peel and whatever his side B is called, were completely original to Smash. So were nearly all of his normals except his running cartwheel attack.

I just don't understand your logic at all. You're starting with the assumption that Dixie MUST be a Diddy clone and ignoring any argument against that assumption, and in fact invent new reasons to assert that assumption every time your old reasons are shot down.

You imply that you think she should be a clone because doing otherwise would upset her fans. Now, ignoring for a second that I doubt any fans of Dixie would prefer for her to be a Diddy clone than have a unique moveset, don't you think that it upsets her fans more that she's not in the game? Like, I know Wario fans are annoyed that Wario barely resembles his Wario Land character and instead has a moveset that's basically 100% invented by Sakurai, but I seriously doubt that Wario fans would prefer he wasn't in the game at all.

If you just don't like the character, then that's fine, whatever. But your reasoning for why she shouldn't be in the game is flimsy at best.

Ralph knows whats up!

I go through this argument with my brother almost every Smash session. He was only born when DK Country 2 was released so he still assumes she is a no body and no one cares about the DK series.

Dixie automatically being assumed to be a Diddy clone is as bad as "Little Mac can only punch and he doesn't jump in the punch out series!" Just stop please! Or the one that I was so glad was proven wrong, "Rosalina would only be a Peach clone!"

Dixie has a 3rd arm/whip/propellor on her head. There are a ton of things she can do with it that would give her such unique flair.

 

[Drago]

Sakurai: "When Captain Toad got his invitation to join Smash, he started working out night and day to get his jump in tip-top shape. He's still a bit of a heavyweight with that pack, but at least he can participate now!"

There, that easy. Paula taught Ness magic, Captain Toad exercised.

Concept pic of Toad in Smash 5:

Spoiler

even in his new form, he cannot jump

 

[Neoxon]

Is this thread going on the base assumption that Mewtwo is the only DLC character?

 

[A Link to the Past]

Concept pic of Toad in Smash 5:

Ha! I see that he has a different kind of pack now.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g-4-gLlF0uw

Is this thread going on the base assumption that Mewtwo is the only DLC character?

No, it's more of "assuming the worst"

 

[Narpas Sword0]

Ms. Pac-Man is not a Namco character.

Wario is a Mario character.

 

[A Link to the Past]

Ms. Pac-Man is not a Namco character.

Wario is a Mario character.

Ms. Pac-Man is in Mario Kart Arcade GP 2.

Wario has his own series according to Smash, and has like 20 games that have nothing to do with Mario. If he is a part of Mario, then frankly, the standard for a series being considered its own thing is impossibly high.

 

[Drago]

Ms. Pac-Man is not a Namco character.

Wario is a Mario character.

Nah, Wario is pretty clearly based entirely on the WarioWare series. If you played those games you'd know they aren't Mario games at all. They have a defined and unique cast and they play absolutely nothing like any Mario games. They do riff on Mario through the microgames (as well as tons of other Nintendo series) but that's as far as the relation goes.

Just because Wario started off in Mario games (and still appears in spinoffs) doesn't make him a Mario character, he's got his own franchise that he represents (two of them, really) and that's what you see in Smash. I'd make the same argument for DK too. Not so much Yoshi though, he's had his own games but those were still pretty firmly rooted in the Marioverse.

 

[Blues1990]

All I wanted was the GBA to be represented in some fashion. Issac from the Golden Sun series would have been a perfect playable character. Dark Pit & Lucina could have been alternative costumes for Pit & Marth respectively.

 

[Neoxon]

All I wanted was the GBA to be represented in some fashion. Issac from the Golden Sun series would have been a perfect playable character. Dark Pit & Lucina could have been alternative costumes for Pit & Marth respectively.

FTFY. Also, it's not like they screwed anyone else out of the game, so there's no harm in them being in the game.

 

[A Link to the Past]

Dark Pit screwed Alph over tho :v

Also, while I'll definitively say that Wario = Wario, not Mario, his classic costume is almost definitely in because of Mario Kart. If Wario wore his biker outfit in Mario Kart, he wouldn't have that alt.

 

[Drago]

Dark Pit screwed Alph over tho :v

Also, while I'll definitively say that Wario = Wario, not Mario, his classic costume is almost definitely in because of Mario Kart. If Wario wore his biker outfit in Mario Kart, he wouldn't have that alt.

I agree with that. His overalls outfit is far more iconic than his biker outfit and that's not because he wears it in Wario Land...

Also the more I think about it, the more I really think Alph should have been cloned before Dark Pit. Pikmin could've use two reps (even if one was a clone) instead of Kid Icarus getting three.

 

[A Link to the Past]

I agree with that. His overalls outfit is far more iconic than his biker outfit and that's not because he wears it in Wario Land...

Also the more I think about it, the more I really think Alph should have been cloned before Dark Pit. Pikmin could've use two reps (even if one was a clone) instead of Kid Icarus getting three.

The worst part was that Dark Pit's "he wouldn't use the three sacred treasures" argument worked when adjusted for Alph, too. He could have easily given Alph a few new moves. Alph could be given Rock Pikmin (which would really actually change him quite a bit), give him a Pikmin Swarm FS, and we're gravy!

 

[balladofwindfishes]

The worst part was that Dark Pit's "he wouldn't use the three sacred treasures" argument worked when adjusted for Alph, too. He could have easily given Alph a few new moves. Alph could be given Rock Pikmin (which would really actually change him quite a bit), give him a Pikmin Swarm FS, and we're gravy!

At the absolute minimum, even as an alt costume, he should use the Drake and not Olimar's Ship for his entrance and Final Smash. It just seems sloppy.

How hard could it have been to make this model swap. The Drake is even already in Smash...

 

[Drago]

The worst part was that Dark Pit's "he wouldn't use the three sacred treasures" argument worked when adjusted for Alph, too. He could have easily given Alph a few new moves. Alph could be given Rock Pikmin (which would really actually change him quite a bit), give him a Pikmin Swarm FS, and we're gravy!

Yeah, I would've had purple pikmin replaced with rock pikmin with different properties (not as strong but can be thrown farther, perhaps) and replace white pikmin with flying ones for the rotation outside of the up-B, not sure what their properties would be though. Give him a new FS, maybe change some normal properties and bam. Probably too much work for a very late clone though, but I bet if Sakurai had more time he would've made Alph a full on clone.

Side note but does anyone else think Alph looks really weird as an Olimar alt? Like, he looks taller than he should be. Minor thing but it bugs me.

 

[jnWake]

Some "quick" opinions:

Mario series: Character-wise I feel it's fine. It has all the important classic characters and the more important newer ones. Only thing the Mario series lacks is more representation for the spin-offs. Other than Mario Kart, spin-offs feel very underrepresented. Other than Waluigi and Peach's FSmash, there's almost no reference to Mario Sport games. I'm not sure what could be done honestly, but maybe a travelling stage that goes through golf, tennis and soccer courses? There's also no reference to Mario Party when the franchise could easily have its own stage. Mario RPGs are also very underrepresented. Wii U should've gotten a Paper Mario stage and 3DS a Mario&Luigi stage. There could also be Assist Trophies from that series (Fawful, Dimentio, partners from Paper Mario). If for Smash 5 custom moves are given more relevance, it would be cool having some moves that reference spin-offs too. Dr. Mario and Bowser deserve stages too IMO.

DK series: Characer-wise the series is underrepresented. It deserves Dixie and maybe K. Rool IMO. There's a lack of villains in the roster currently. Stage-wise, it's odd that DKCTF didn't get a stage when MK8 and Yoshi's Wooly World did. I feel 3DS should've got a DKCR level and Wii U should've got a DKCTF one and maybe a DKC2 level (along with Dixie!). Items-wise I feel it's fine since the series doesn't use many items. However, there could be an Animal Crate assist/item though.

Zelda: Cutting Sheik for Impa seemed a reasonable choice for this game IMO. Impa still deserves a spot but I'm not sure how she could be too different from Sheik. Otherwise, characters are fine. Wii U version deserved at least one more Zelda stage, something for Toon Link and maybe something for Ganondorf.

Metroid: People will hate me but I feel it's fine character-wise, unless the next game introduces a new interesting character. I do feel the series deserves way more stages that represent more than lava.

For the rest I feel representation is mostly okay, character wise. Yoshi series doesn't have many characters, WarioWare is more of an ensemble so no character really stands out as playable material IMO. Star Fox and Mother got screwed but I'm hoping for DLC! Fire Emblem has nice representation, although more weapon variety would be cool. Stage-wise, I feel that every franchise should have at least one new stage per game (Wii U and 3DS), so there are some underrepresented ones.

 

[IntelliHeath]

Is this thread going on the base assumption that Mewtwo is the only DLC character?

I think it is more likely to be safe way to go with.

Dark Pit screwed Alph over tho :v

Also the more I think about it, the more I really think Alph should have been cloned before Dark Pit. Pikmin could've use two reps (even if one was a clone) instead of Kid Icarus getting three.

Eh, I always felt that Pikmins are the main characters in a sense of moveset, not Olimar or Alph.

 

[Neoxon]

Some "quick" opinions:

Mario series: Character-wise I feel it's fine. It has all the important classic characters and the more important newer ones. Only thing the Mario series lacks is more representation for the spin-offs. Other than Mario Kart, spin-offs feel very underrepresented. Other than Waluigi and Peach's FSmash, there's almost no reference to Mario Sport games. I'm not sure what could be done honestly, but maybe a travelling stage that goes through golf, tennis and soccer courses? There's also no reference to Mario Party when the franchise could easily have its own stage. Mario RPGs are also very underrepresented. Wii U should've gotten a Paper Mario stage and 3DS a Mario&Luigi stage. There could also be Assist Trophies from that series (Fawful, Dimentio, partners from Paper Mario). If for Smash 5 custom moves are given more relevance, it would be cool having some moves that reference spin-offs too. Dr. Mario and Bowser deserve stages too IMO.

DK series: Characer-wise the series is underrepresented. It deserves Dixie and maybe K. Rool IMO. There's a lack of villains in the roster currently. Stage-wise, it's odd that DKCTF didn't get a stage when MK8 and Yoshi's Wooly World did. I feel 3DS should've got a DKCR level and Wii U should've got a DKCTF one and maybe a DKC2 level (along with Dixie!). Items-wise I feel it's fine since the series doesn't use many items. However, there could be an Animal Crate assist/item though.

Zelda: Cutting Sheik for Impa seemed a reasonable choice for this game IMO. Impa still deserves a spot but I'm not sure how she could be too different from Sheik. Otherwise, characters are fine. Wii U version deserved at least one more Zelda stage, something for Toon Link and maybe something for Ganondorf.

Metroid: People will hate me but I feel it's fine character-wise, unless the next game introduces a new interesting character. I do feel the series deserves way more stages that represent more than lava.

For the rest I feel representation is mostly okay, character wise. Yoshi series doesn't have many characters, WarioWare is more of an ensemble so no character really stands out as playable material IMO. Star Fox and Mother got screwed but I'm hoping for DLC! Fire Emblem has nice representation, although more weapon variety would be cool. Stage-wise, I feel that every franchise should have at least one new stage per game (Wii U and 3DS), so there are some underrepresented ones.

The problem is that Sakurai wants every Zelda character (sans Toon Link) to have the same design source, & Impa has no Twilight Princess design that Sakurai can draw upon (he at least had one for Sheik).

 

[A Link to the Past]

Pikmin are definitely major stars, but isn't that more reason to have Alph (or Louie) to give Rock Pikmin a chance to be a part of the moveset?

 

[Narpas Sword0]

Mario is a Donkey Kong character

 

[jnWake]

A Mass of Rock Pikmin will be a new character in Smash 5 (a la Knack).

It's a shame Pikmin doesn't allow more characters because there aren't that many differences between them, since the series is so good. If we had some sort of Adventure Mode, we could have amazing Pikmin Bosses, like the Titan Dweevil.

 

[A Link to the Past]

A Mass of Rock Pikmin will be a new character in Smash 5 (a la Knack).

It's a shame Pikmin doesn't allow more characters because there aren't that many differences between them, since the series is so good. If we had some sort of Adventure Mode, we could have amazing Pikmin Bosses, like the Titan Dweevil.

I made a moveset for Rock Pikmin a while ago

 

[GiantBreadbug]

I made a moveset for Rock Pikmin a while ago

Link plsss, I love Rock Pikmin.

Also I was hoping, while collecting custom specials, that Rock Pikmin would be a custom B for Olimar, and that they would just behave like Purples.

I was unhappy when this did not happen.

 

[CreatureX3]

Mario is a Donkey Kong character

Damn right he is!

 

[Forkball]

5/6 the Donkey Kong stages are jungles. Please understand.

We need a Metroid version of this where everything is lava.


There are definitely some issues with over/under representation. Let me just preface this nitpicking by saying that Sakurai and crew were probably under immense pressure and time constraint when developing fucking TWO of these games at the same time. One on a handheld that nearly explodes when you start it up. I don't blame Sakurai's team and Namco for pulling as many assets as they could.

Sakurai: Oh god, these games need to be out by November and all I've done is work on Palutena's custom moves. I have all the models from Uprising on my desktop, I'm putting as many of those guys in as I can. What other 3DS games came out? Dillon something? Put that fucker in there. Cut Ice Climbers I don't have time to deal with this furshading shit.

Mario: Mario is Nintendo's bread and butter. He gets free reign to do whatever he wants. You could make a good Smash game solely with Mario characters. Hell I wouldn't mind it if they put MORE Mario stuff in there. I love that NSMB got a stage BAH BAH. Where's my SMB3 airship level? Look man, Sunshine was a good game, but we don't need Delphino again. Also I would prefer to see more Galaxy stuff. We had two of those games on Wii, yet we get one stage. A stage with GRASS and a HOUSE. Out of all the amazing sights of the Galaxy games, this is what we settle on?

Yoshi: You got Yoshi and basically a new stage every game. I'd like to see more songs, but I'm not really sure what else you can really add. A Shy Guy assist trophy? Some huge ass egg item?

DK: Honestly I'm not a huge DK fan, but I do agree that he is very underrepresented. I wanna ride Rambi! 75m is a fun concept for a stage, but not good to fight on. Just make it 25m. All the jungle levels are basically the same, but I like the dual plane one. The songs are redonkulous. If I had to remix Jungle Level over and over again I'd go deaf. Also good god, please let's move past the bongos and give him a good final smash.

Wario: I like the Warioware series, but I like Wario Land even more. It's sad that this part of him is basically completely ignored. They even took away his shoulder barge. His Wii game had a great visual style so I would have like to have seen that represented in some way. Or maybe a stage based on Wario Land 3, HIS BEST GAME.

Zelda: No new characters in 14 years. No, Toon Link doesn't count. Ganondorf is forever a Falcon clone. I don't care if they kinda turned him into the One Punch Man, he's still too cloney. There are numerous candidates: Pig Ganon, Wind Waker Ganon, Impa, Tingle, Skull Kid, Vaati, Zant, Demise, Ghirahim, Fi etc. Zelda is another series that could easily fill up a fighting game roster alone. I think the song selection is pretty great, but nearly every level is like the plains or a castle. Where was the Link's Awakening stage on the 3DS version? I want to fight with the big egg in the background. HOW DID THAT NOT HAPPEN?

Metroid: The stages need more variety, but I think the representation is pretty good. I mean who else are you going to add? Dark Samus is seriously the only good contender. I want Ridley as much as the next guy, but it's not going to happen. At least his boss fight stage is cool.

Kirby: Kirby was Sakurai's baby before Dark Pit corrupted him and HAL developed the first two games by themselves, so he also kind of gets free reign. Kirby has a ton of games so there's always more things you can pull from. I really like how his 3DS stage is a big homage to the Game Boy.

Pokemon: Pokemon is one of Nintendo's biggest franchises, so obviously they should get a lot of inclusions. Hell, there are so many Pokemon you could put in the game that Namco is making their own Pokemon fighting game. The stages are pretty diverse and interesting, plus the Pokeball item is one of the best in the series. My main gripe is that there isn't a single Gold/Silver song in the Wii U version. All other gens have a song, WHY DO YOU HATE JOHTO SAKURAI?

Star Fox: I'd prefer Wolf over Falco, but I think it has good series representation. Pretty sick of the Landmaster though.

Fire Emblem: Awakening actually sold copies, so you can't fault them for featuring it heavily. Four fighters is actually quite a bit, even though there's a lot to pull from. Keep in mind that the US didn't get any FE games until the GBA, and there were even DS titles that didn't make it over here. Two of the three stages are kind of based on nothing though, just an amalgam of stuff from other games. I'd like to see the stages focus on specific moments in the series.

Kid Icarus: Good god. Look, I know why there's so much representation. It's easy to take assets from and Sakurai worked on it. So many damn enemies in Smash Run are ugly KIU jobbers. Also why does KIU get TWO assist trophies? They took out Isaac for Phosphora? ISAAAAAC. The Palutena's Guidance segments are really funny though.

Earthbound: I know a lot of people complain about how the Mother series gets dumped on and people are mad about Lucas, but Earthbound has more inclusions than I expected. The 3DS version has a stage based on the original Mother, talk about going retro. We also have numerous items and assist trophies. I would like to see an original Wii U stage though, I mean we got two in Melee.

F-Zero: Everything was Mute City. Sakurai pays more attention to this series than Nintendo does, so consider yourself lucky.

Pikmin: There are Pikmin, what more needs to be said? Alph could be his own character if they gave him different types of Pikmin than Olimar I suppose. I'd like to see a giant Duracell battery item.

Animal Crossing: I think this series is actually pretty underutilized. First of all, the game is completely based around items. In Smash you just have the pitfall and the beehive, literally the two worst things in AC. Also Smashville and Town and City LOOK EXACTLY THE SAME. At least make it a different season or something. The song selection is great and there's a lot more you could add. You can certainly add in some more characters as well: Isabelle, Tom Nook, KK Slider, and even New Leaf Villager (completely different design from the current Villager which is based on City Folk). Also bring back Mr. Resetti as an assist trophy.

Other dudes: Shulk, Little Mac, Game and Watch, Duck Hunt, Wii Fit Trainer etc. are all ok. The third party characters are lucky to be in here so there shouldn't be any complaining about those guys.

I definitely think some franchises could have more, namely Golden Sun. There is ONE Golden Sun song between the two games. Not even an Isaac trophy. That's cold.

 

[balladofwindfishes]

I believe one of the Melee Stadium 1 remixes is from Gold and Silver.

Edit: Yes, Melee had a medley of GS music, just checked. It's still in Smash 4

 

[Clefargle]

I still need snake, then Sakurai can put whatever other 3rd party chars or returning vets he want in. Just give me snake back please.

 

[BGBW]

One disappointment with Game & Watch is that there is a series that could be represented with him and that's the Game & Watch Gallery series. Of course it crosses over with Mario, but a few tunes from the games wouldn't go amiss.

Manhole for example is a pretty catchy tune.

Also the Flatzone X stage was a bit odd. It was advertised as a mix of the two previous Flatzones and yet felt 90% Flatzone 2 (doesn't help that it constantly goes back to Fire) which was already in the 3DS version.

 

[Spinosaurus]

(also Wario with an actual, good moveset)

?

He has an incredibly fun and diverse moveset as is. Please don't change it into a generic brawler style character just for better Wario Land representation. All he's missing is his Brawl fsmash.

 

[Axass]

What, Palutena was heavenly requested, Dark pit was not (at least not in Japan).

It's quite the opposite and I think that's part of the reason why he's been put in at the last moment as a clone.

 

[Azuran]

It's quite the opposite and I think that's part of the reason why he's been put in at the last moment as a clone.

I'll gladly take Gaius over Fox.

 

[BGBW]

There should be more representation for old Nintendo. The paddles from Color TV Games was pretty good but I'm proposing a character that could utilise all those crazy things Nintendo came up with before hitting it big with videogames. I'm proposing Mister Magician from the 1975 magic set Mister Magician Coin & Stick!

Thowing Hanafuda cards check
Grabbing with the Ultra Hand check
Getting freaky with the Love Tester check.
The possibilities are endless.

Or they should make it so there's a small chance Luigi pulls out a Chiritori for his final smash.

 

[Axass]

Or they should make it so there's a small chance Luigi pulls out a Chiritori for his final smash.

They made vacuum cleaners as well? Nintendo never stops surprising me.

 

[balladofwindfishes]

It's quite the opposite and I think that's part of the reason why he's been put in at the last moment as a clone.

Ike more popular than Marth? Am I reading this right?

Any particular reason for this surprising popularity?

 

[Axass]

Ike more popular than Marth? Am I reading this right?

Any particular reason for this surprising popularity?

I've got no clue, this was posted in a SmashGAF thread long ago, it's not mine. Also looking at the actual points, it doesn't seem like they polled a lot of people.

 

[FSLink]

Don't forget that one of the reasons Dr. Mario was added in Melee was due to the music, I'm sure they wanted to put Dark Pit's theme in.

 

[Karsticles]

The game needs more villains. We have...two? We lost Mewtwo and Wolf, but are getting the former back. No Ridley. As someone who only plays villains, my options are limited.

 

[balladofwindfishes]

Don't forget that one of the reasons Dr. Mario was added in Melee was due to the music, I'm sure they wanted to put Dark Pit's theme in.

Doc has quite an interesting history in Smash for just being a clone lol

- Mentioned on Mario's profile in Smash 64
- Added to Melee because Wario was too unique to be a clone and because his music was too awesome to pass up. "Black Market Doctor" Mario is coined as a thing.
- Cut from Brawl late in development, only mentioned as a sticker. Still gets a song remix because Doc's music is out of this world. Bonus: Is the first alt costume revealed for Project M.
- First character ever re-added to Smash after being cut previously (with Mewtwo's tears). Unlike the other clones, was added to appease Melee fans (and not disappoint seeing a vet turn into a costume) and because he was too unique with pills and his down special. And the popularity of Black Market Doctor Mario roleplay... seriously. I'm left wondering if de-cloning of Doc was actually what got the ball rolling for DP and Lucina. Also has a cut stage, and yet another music remix because why not?

We know more about why Doc is in Smash than we do most other characters. In fact we know more about most clones than we do most characters, I guess because Sakurai feels like he needs to justify them.

And Doc's music really is bombing (probably the best and most complicated on the NES). So it's totally worth an entire character just for that (even if a character isn't really required for a music theme and wasn't even in Melee, unless Balloon Fighter and Mach Rider are secretly characters nobody has unlocked yet).

The game needs more villains. We have...two? We lost Mewtwo and Wolf, but are getting the former back. No Ridley. As someone who only plays villains, my options are limited.

Also Bowser Jr + Koopalings were added.

Too bad the Fire Emblem villains aren't more memorable. There's also Dark Samus and Ganon, who would be good fits.

The issue with Nintendo villains is they're either re-used every game (Bowser), or aren't seen ever again and aren't terribly memorable after the game (Fire Emblem), or just won't work as fighters (Ridley). Or one off Zelda villains, which could work, but Zelda has other characters that need to get in before Vaati and Girahim

Cutting Wolf was silly though. It's like there's a tradition they have to cut one non-clone villain every single game. That leaves Jr to be cut in 5

 

[BGBW]

Talking of Dr Mario music. It's a shame the awesome title screen music didn't get an arrangement this time and instead it was another Chill mix.

I suppose there's also the more obscure Dr Mario 64 tunes like Que Que and Cube (renamed to Sneeze and Cough in RX) but I guess they're not quite as beloved as the original melodies.

 

[WrenchNinja]

Ike more popular than Marth? Am I reading this right?

Any particular reason for this surprising popularity?

Ike is shipping bait with Soren and popular for that.

 

[balladofwindfishes]

Talking of Dr Mario music. It's a shame the awesome title screen music didn't get an arrangement this time and instead it was another Chill mix.

I suppose there's also the more obscure Dr Mario 64 tunes like Que Que and Cube (renamed to Sneeze and Cough in RX) but I guess they're not quite as beloved as the original melodies.

I would have liked a straight rip of Fever from the NES game. It's so catchy, and the Melee remix is crazy good, but the NES one is good just from a complexity level, for an NES song.

And I feel Smash really needs more chiptune rips. Stuff like NES Temple theme, 1-1, Punch Out Theme. Basically, everything from the Famicom Medley, but separated out into individual songs for the proper stages.

 

[Shotgun Kiss]

They haven't added a new Zelda rep since melee (Toon Link is basically Young Link's replacement), I think that series deserved someone new.
I think Metroid could've used a new rep...but I don't know who would "fit" the bill.

We haven't had a new F-Zero rep since the original Smash Bros.

F-Zero might not be a huge Nintendo franchise, but considering it was worthy of being in the first Smash Bros, I'd say it deserves a second character. I'd say Samurai Goroh as a second F-Zero character is as deserving as Wolf as a third Starfox character.

It would also give the series more (much-needed) villain representation. For that reason we should also get Wolf back. Ridley would also be nice, but I'm not frothing at the mouth for him, and at least we have two Metroid characters.

Right now, the only villains are:

Bowser
Bowser Jr./Koopa Kids (it's cool that the Koopa Kids are there, but they're still just reskins)
Ganondorf
King Dedede (and this is a stretch, as King Dedede sometimes helps Kirby)

 

[balladofwindfishes]

How about on the flip side, a series that's represented amazingly.

Mega Man

Everything about Megaman in this game is done with love, care and respect for this classic series. Megaman moves, acts and feels like an NES character, his animations often frame perfect to their counterparts on the NES. I had such a smile on my face when I slow walked and Megaman did that awkward one legged shuffle I was sure was some kind of visual bug on the NES. I honestly did not expect that level of detail to translate into Smash. And stuff like his ground dodge being his hurt animation, everything about him just comes together in a package so accurate to his game counterpart, it's not really seen on anyone else but Kirby, a character Sakurai himself created.

His custom moves show a huge cross section of the history of the series and are the most complex and unique customs of characters without entirely new moves (IE, Mii and Palutena).

His stage, while Yellow Devil is annoying, is nicely detailed, and looks fantastic visually. The music is amazing. A large amount of original music and amazingly well put together medleys that perfectly represent the series.

His series has tons of beautifully modeled trophies, pretty much the only series with trophies that aren't just ripped models.

And his Final Smash is just pure hype.

The attention to detail and love given to Megaman in this game should be commended. It's like they saw he was in a rut and decided to go all out to treat Megaman as he should be treated. I so wish Nintendo had this IP. They seem to really know and appreciate it, and I bet they could do a lot of really good work with it.

 

[TDLink]

The game needs more villains. We have...two? We lost Mewtwo and Wolf, but are getting the former back. No Ridley. As someone who only plays villains, my options are limited.

I agree there should be more but for now we do at least have more than 2:

• Bowser
• Bowser Jr./Koopalings
• Ganondorf
• King Dedede
• Wario (Sort of)
• Meta-Knight (Sort of)
• Mewtwo (Coming Soon)

My most desired one is Hades from Kid Icarus Uprising, but with Dark Pit already giving that series 3 characters it unfortunately seems unlikely.

 

[A Link to the Past]

Mewtwo is more opponent than villain. Ideally, as far as opponents, villains, and otherwise rotten characters, I'd love to see overall

Bowser
Bowser Jr.
King K. Rool
Wario
Captain Syrup
Mewtwo
Ganondorf
Ganon
King Dedede
Meta Knight
Dark Samus
King Hippo
Wolf
Samurai Goroh
Medusa

I don't necessarily need all of them, but some of them? Plz!

Also speaking of Medusa, I used to support her before Uprising came out. Looking back, while Palutena's role was much larger than Medusa's, I think I'd still rather have had Medusa instead. We don't have a dark magic character like her, and in large part Palutena had a lot of moves that for the most part didn't set her apart.

 

[balladofwindfishes]

But Mewtwo is an abomination of nature, despises humanity, has no soul or heart, and the final boss of Red/Blue and Pokemon Stadium. From the Pokemon Wiki

It is said to have the most savage heart among all Pokémon, lack compassion, and strike fear into its enemy with cold, glowing eyes. Because it was engineered to be the ultimate in battle, it can only think of defeating its foes.

Sounds like a villain to me.

He's generally considered as much of a villain as Pokemon could have in Smash (since Giovanni isn't going to go out there and fight any time soon).