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Fake
Member
Sonic Origins: Fans Don't Seem Happy About the Big Changes To Sonic 3's Soundtrack - IGN
Sonic fans aren't happy that Sonic Origins doesn't contain the original, authentic soundtrack for Sonic the Hedgehog 3.
Kiddo Cabbusses
Member
If I may nitpick this, Sonic Jam on Saturn cost full retail, doesn't have widescreen, and doesn't have Sonic CD. Also, it's music and sound wasn't 1:1 with the Genesis games, either, though for different reasons than Origins.
That said, I am really disappointed by Jun Senoue's renditions of the Sonic 3 Prototype music. They sound like he composed them on Windows MIDI with "Ultimate Megadrive Soundfont" rather than sounding like actual Sega Megadrive music. This is especially ridiculous when the "unfinished" prototype tracks are better able to blend in aesthetically with the rest of Sonic 3's music than Senoue's fake-ass FM synth. He needs to stick to guitars. Heck, I'd have rather he done these tracks in all guitars or even in Sonic 4's style (At least that sounded more like an FM synth than whatever these are) instead of how they currently sound.
The Anniversary Mode idea sounds nice but it's unfortunate that it seems to have adversely affected the rest of the package's design.
SpiceRacz
Member
Sonic Jam came out at a time when you couldn't buy these games in a single collection. The only collection I recall is Sonic Classics, which only had 1 & 2. Plus, there was a PC collection that had 3 & K. The Sonic games were common on Genesis, but buying all 4 still would have ran you $30+ in 1997. Sonic Jam was a great value when you consider what your options were at the time. In 2022, there's so many, arguably better, ways to play these games. To put it in perspective, I bought Sonic CD on Steam 9 years ago for less $3. I got Sonic 2 free through Amazon around the same time. And I don't think it's fair to say the inclusion of Sonic CD makes it any better than Jam. It doesn't elevate the collection that much, if at all.
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The last time Sonic 3 & Knuckles was ever officially released by SEGA was 15 days before Michael Jackson's death.
They couldn't figure out the rights for the music? How is it different than every other time they release Sonic 3? GTFO. Especially paying this price for such a small collection.
Yes, the three new tracks suck, I'm not defending them, they should have just used the prototype tracks directly without converting them to MIDI. But seeing an astounding amount of people shitting on the game for 3 tracks being replaced is kinda appalling, especially when its obvious nobody truly understands that this is far beyond a simple rights issue. There never was a "rights" settlement in the first place, thats the entire issue.
The story goes that MJ basically demo'd some tracks with SEGA during S3's production, but he didn't end up committing fully to anything. SEGA re-purposed some of his demo tracks, and he was fine with it, so there was an unofficial degree of acceptance. Once MJ died though, his estate has been notoriously bloodthirsty as shit, and would definitely sue the shit out of SEGA if they even tried to negotiate using the music in the first place, given that they released multiple full commercial products using MJ's work without ever crediting him at all, let alone settling a contract.
Its a situation where there literally is nothing SEGA can do about it. Bitching about the tracks being changed is ignorant. You wanna complain about bugs or that the actual replaced tracks suck? Sure. But at least GTFO if you don't know the situation. This isn't some Jet Set Radio/GTA type shit.
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Yep. I’m disappointed about the lack of those three tracks, but I can’t neglect getting the ability to play through Sonic 3 & Knuckles with widescreen support and all. I am ready day one, and am here for any other remasters Sega has prepped.
Operations66
Banned
I pretty much only look forward to remastered old great games now. Somehow the art of making games that are actually FUN got lost as the big woke corporations took over the industry. Just like they destroyed the music industry and the film industry, the giant greedy evil stupid corporations are ruining gaming. So Sonic Origins looks good to me.
I like the idea of putting remastered classic game series in one cool collection like this and Halo: MCC.
I like the idea of putting remastered classic game series in one cool collection like this and Halo: MCC.
SCB3
Member
Brad Buxer, the guy who made the music died a few years ago and his estate has been really hard to deal with in terms of licensing so SEGA just don't care enough to persue it I guess, probably would cost them more than it was worth it to them
They couldn't figure out the rights for the music? How is it different than every other time they release Sonic 3? GTFO. Especially paying this price for such a small collection.
I caved and bought the PS5 version, look Sonic 2 is my favorite game of all time so having yet another copy of it is like comfort food to me, plus getting the Whitehead versions on console was worth it
IbizaPocholo
NeoGAFs Kent Brockman
Brad Buxer is still around and did a video interview last month where he briefly brings up Sonic the Hedgehog 3. Doug Grigsby III passed away in 2021. Cirocco Jones, Bobby Brooks, Darryl Ross, and Geoff Grace appear to still be alive...?
This is what Cirocco Jones had to say about the music situation back in 2012. Multiple people within the Jackson/Buxer sound team may be unhappy with Sega.
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93xfan
Banned
I agree. Wonder if they’ve just gotten scared to touch the music and are worried that it would lead to the music industry try to sue for royalties for every past release.
They couldn't figure out the rights for the music? How is it different than every other time they release Sonic 3? GTFO. Especially paying this price for such a small collection.
I know nothing of how it works so I’m sorry if my hypothesis is based on ignorance
March Climber
Member
This should have been a Sonic Mega collection of all games pre-PS4/XBO gen. Yes, even the weird ones like 3D Blast and the game gear editions.
Kiddo Cabbusses
Member
Part of the hook of this collection was every game in this collection being re-coded from the ground up so they would have widescreen, visual enhancements, and bonus content. It's not just an emulators-n-ROMs package like Mega Collection is.
Imagine doing a complete re-coded port for every Game Gear game (Especially knowing that each of them has a different set of physics radically different from both the Megadrive games and each other, and there's a Metroidvania, a psuedo-shmup, two Kart racers and a isometric maze game in this set) and Spinball. Then imagine trying to figure out what version of Sonic 3D Blast you're gonna have in your collection in the first place, inevitably disappointing all the fans when you don't have the graphics and Special Stages of the Saturn version combined with all the gameplay tweaks Jon Burton did for his Director's Cut patch and widescreen support. After this, spend a long time figuring out if Art Alive and Wacky Worlds deserves to be in the collection just because Sonic appears in them. Then upset the fans by still not having a home version of SegaSonic the Hedgehog after years of telling fans you wanted to include it in a Sonic collection someday.
Okay, I'm going a bit far with this, but you get my drift. Most of those other games aren't nearly as universally liked as the main 3 or similar enough to them to just be thrown in like Sonic CD - the only possible exception to this being maybe Knuckles Chaotix, which may be it's own can of worms as that's one that's not even in Mega Collection or any latter-released Sonic compilation. (That said, Chaotix might be good DLC material if it is in fact possible.)
SCB3
Member
The only Sonic game I've not played but own (I don't have a working 32X unit) I'd love to see a port or remaster of it
SCB3
Member
Played about an hour of Sonic 1 as Knuckles, seems pretty good in Widescreen imo Knuckles is definitely harder to use in Sonic 1 so far as the Levels were not designed for him and there is a lack of climbing in most Zones
Also did he always have this delay when he landed after a glide?
Also did he always have this delay when he landed after a glide?
Spukc
always chasing the next thrill
You can play as him in s1? Hoh weird.
The OG lockon gaveyou that ball game.
Also.. this collection should have had all the 2d sonic games from master/Gamegear. As many people never played those
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SCB3
Member
Yea and Tails, its the Whitehead versions pretty much, before this collection were only on iOS and Android versions of Sonic 1, a reason at least to get this collection
SCB3
Member
I've finished Sonic 1 with all Emeralds as Knuckles, there was something bugging me though, Knuckles feels "Off" and I couldn't work out why until I went back and popped in the Original S&K cart, its his hitbox and this weird delay on landing after a glide
So go to the last level of Sonic 1 and Robotnik shoots down these slow moving Orbs, well Sonic can squeeze through them fine, Knuckles for some reason cannot fit even though it looks like he can, there were multiple times through the game where similar stuff like this occurs. Knuckles also cannot jump as high as Sonic so there are a few places you have to get creative to get past the level, I liked that though
So go to the last level of Sonic 1 and Robotnik shoots down these slow moving Orbs, well Sonic can squeeze through them fine, Knuckles for some reason cannot fit even though it looks like he can, there were multiple times through the game where similar stuff like this occurs. Knuckles also cannot jump as high as Sonic so there are a few places you have to get creative to get past the level, I liked that though
Fake
Member
Looks like the game is a mess on PC.
steamcommunity.com
Steam Community :: Sonic Origins
Sonic Origins - Feature ListAbout the GameThe Blue Blur is back with an expanded multi-game collection of classic Sonic the Hedgehog games - Sonic Origins Plus!Sonic Origins Plus features the four beloved classic titles in Sonic Origins – Sonic the Hedgehog, Sonic 2, Sonic 3 & Knuckles, and...
Belthazar
Member
They couldn't figure out the rights for the music? How is it different than every other time they release Sonic 3? GTFO. Especially paying this price for such a small collection.
Michael Jackson died exactly 15 days after the last rerelease using the original songs, it's kinda obvious it's the Michael Jackson estate that's getting in the way.
Kacho
Gold Member
So much talk about keyboard controls lol. How are people still doing this to themselves?Looks like the game is a mess on PC.
Steam Community :: Sonic Origins
Sonic Origins - Feature ListAbout the GameThe Blue Blur is back with an expanded multi-game collection of classic Sonic the Hedgehog games - Sonic Origins Plus!Sonic Origins Plus features the four beloved classic titles in Sonic Origins – Sonic the Hedgehog, Sonic 2, Sonic 3 & Knuckles, and...
Rayderism
Member
When these games first released back in the day, the only way to play them was on a CRT TV. Not having a CRT filter for this collection is almost criminal.
The widescreen versions are nice and all, but they should have had an option to play them using the original lives model instead of that coins deal. Being forced to play the 4:3 versions for the original lives model defeats the purpose of the widescreen mode, IMO.
The butchered music in Sonic 3......well, what can you really say? Sigh. Pretty much ruins the nostalgia for that game.
Personal opinion, but the cartoon animations really add nothing to the experience for me.
Definitely not the definitive edition of these games, that's for sure.
The widescreen versions are nice and all, but they should have had an option to play them using the original lives model instead of that coins deal. Being forced to play the 4:3 versions for the original lives model defeats the purpose of the widescreen mode, IMO.
The butchered music in Sonic 3......well, what can you really say? Sigh. Pretty much ruins the nostalgia for that game.
Personal opinion, but the cartoon animations really add nothing to the experience for me.
Definitely not the definitive edition of these games, that's for sure.
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Kokoloko85
Member
Without the true music. Im just gonna play the hacked megadrive mini version. Michael jackson estate can kiss my ass
GenericUser
Member
9 out of 10 scores for a bunch of roms. The absolute state of "game journalism". The new/old sonic 3 music is laughable. Avoid at all cost. Play Sonic 1 forever, Sonic 2 absolute and Sonic 3 A.I.R. instead.
Spukc
always chasing the next thrill
Kenshin775
Member
Going to play this after work. I wish it was 20 or even 30 bucks but I wasn't willing to wait until Black Friday for a deal. Seems like a decent amount of content.
nominedomine
Banned
No way, I honestly can't believe these scores after what they've showed.
edit: forget it, I was thinking of the new game
edit: forget it, I was thinking of the new game
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names are for friends
Member
This collection is complete garbo lol there's some sort of forced filtering that blurs together the pixels, and the only filtering option you get is an "anti-aliasing" filter that is clearly bilinear filtering and makes the image look blurry as shit. I think there's some sort of weird framerate issue with at least Sonic 1 & 2 as well; I noticed the VRR refresh reading on the TV was fluctuating like crazy so I turned off G-sync and lo and behold, the game has a consistent stutter like any other game that has framerate/refresh mismatch. This is on PC, idk if the consoles have that issue
Comparison screenshots:
https://u.cubeupload.com/arekkusu/202206231346361.jpg - Sonic Origins S3&K
https://u.cubeupload.com/arekkusu/202206231345061.jpg - emulated S3&K no filter
https://u.cubeupload.com/arekkusu/202206231404291.jpg - Sonic Origins S3&K w/ "anti-aliasing" turned on
https://u.cubeupload.com/arekkusu/202206231418211.jpg - emulated S3&K w/ bilinear filtering
Anyway I'd recommend using Sonic 1 Forever, Sonic 2 Absolute and Sonic 3 AIR over this unless you're a real hardcore Sega paypig
Comparison screenshots:
https://u.cubeupload.com/arekkusu/202206231346361.jpg - Sonic Origins S3&K
https://u.cubeupload.com/arekkusu/202206231345061.jpg - emulated S3&K no filter
https://u.cubeupload.com/arekkusu/202206231404291.jpg - Sonic Origins S3&K w/ "anti-aliasing" turned on
https://u.cubeupload.com/arekkusu/202206231418211.jpg - emulated S3&K w/ bilinear filtering
Anyway I'd recommend using Sonic 1 Forever, Sonic 2 Absolute and Sonic 3 AIR over this unless you're a real hardcore Sega paypig
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IbizaPocholo
NeoGAFs Kent Brockman
Celcius
°Temp. member
That was a good review. Basically he liked it but felt it was worth waiting for a sale before buying (and also mentioned the unfortunate music situation).
names are for friends
Member
Stealth of Headcannon comes out and says that:
- while the submitted build had some issues, Sega made major changes that introduced more
- they had a tight deadline and asked for delays, stuff was rushed
Crazy that gamers nowadays are so powerful we can get the devs to talk shit and trash the finished product on the day of release.
ManaByte
Banned
MJ died in 2009. The original Sonic 3 was on the DS Sonic collection in 2010 and the Sega Genesis collection released on Steam in volumes from 2010-2012.
Thabass
Member
Wouldn't be Sega and Sonic Team if a Sonic game didn't come out with bugs. They will never learn.
One of the bugs I noticed is an issue with the music not looping and it just ends. How the fuck do you make this bug happen? This is just one of the issues with glitching and straight-up weird issues with Sonic 3 too. I played all of Sonic 3 & Knuckles and it feels slightly different somehow. Like some of the physics changed a bit. Nothing crazy, but it's noticeable.
Sega get your head on straight, would you?
Tarin02543
Member
Gonna play my perfect 1:1 S3 copy on my Mister instead.
Why does the audio in this sound like it came from 15 different places? You have the remastered stuff for Sonic 1 and 2, console recordings with noise, low quality rips for the extra music they sell as DLC and rerips for Sonic CD that haven't been volume adjusted so it sounds too low compared to everything else. And THEN you have the terrible job at the Sonic 3 music replacements. It's a wonder how badly SEGA could mess this up but they've sure done that!
Saber
Gold Member
Thats Sega and Sonic Team in a nutshell.
Taxman good convertions of the classics are nothing in the wrong hands.
Taxman did well in not associate himself anymore with Sega, imagine what would happen if Sega pick Mania 2 by their hands and do this garbage. Actually, that old rumor about Mania 2 cancelation only makes more sense by the minute.
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keefged4
Member
I Platinumed this earlier today. Not worth the money imo. Mission mode is cool, but theres not enough of them. The "remixed" prototype music in 3&K is absolutely terrible. Didn't come across any bugs or glitches though, have to say. In regards to the image quality, it is poor - Looks like they are internally rendering the games themselves at 720p then blowing it up to 4k (on PS5 at least). Could have done so much more with this, extremely disappointing.