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[Mibu no ookami]

We have absolutely no data on piracy. It's basically impossible to count the money lost due to it, so I have no idea why you bring this up.

It's hard to quantify the damage that piracy does, so it's not really a problem? Hilarious.

Your point is that publishers make the smartest financial decisions? Yeah, I can't agree with you there. Jedi Survivor for instance had major issues on Steam and years after launch, the game was still plagued by performance issues. Wouldn't it have been smarter to invest in the proper QA to ensure it launched properly? Same for Cyberpunk that got delisted and lost millions because again, they rushed the game. You're postulating that they all take the best avenues to maximize profits and that's untrue.

No one is saying publishers are infallible, but if there was tangible evidence that putting out a more perfect port resulted in more day 1 sales, I'm sure more publishers would insist on it.

And FF XVI sucks on PlayStation too. Most games outside of UE5 are adequate on PC. Are they perfect? Far form that, but the argument I'm making is that they don't need to invest millions into optimizing them to get console-like efficiency. All they have to do is get rid of the stutters in UE5 games and you would barely hear about bad PC ports anymore.

But we're not talking about PS5, we're talking about PS5 Pro here and it seems like PS5 Pro is going to be better suited to run UE5 games than PC for quite some time. You think PC porting is more simple than it is. And if you actually read reviews on steam you would see people complain about games crashing, not loading, audio bugging out, bad KBM mapping, performance, MTX, lack of wide screen support, and a multitude of other things not related to stutter. In fact, I've rarely seen bad steam reviews due to stutter.

Someone doesn't know what a strawman is. You're proving my point. Here is what you said earlier:



As if stuttering was just one of many issues. The reality is that it is THE NUMBER 1 issue. Then you ask me to list UE5 games that don't have stuttering which was my point...stuttering on UE5 games is the major problem. Outside of that, most games on PC are fine. This leads back to my argument that devs not investing into PC because it isn't worth it doesn't make sense. Investing the money into not having stutterfests on PC wouldn't cost them millions of dollars, so why are we talking about piracy or PC games being cheaper as if those were the cause for devs not putting the money to have games that don't stutter? It doesn't cost that much to have the QA and engineering for stutter-free experiences.

I don't think it is the #1 issue on PC. Maybe it's the most common, but it isn't the most complained about.

Which is offset by the fact that they were a team of 4 dudes.

Did they? Because again, that's a tiny team and a lot of their time was spent porting the game to DX12 from scratch, something multiplat devs don't have to deal with. Not to mention that multiplat devs start development for the PC build very early on. They don't wait until the last 2 years and assign four guys and tell them go to work. If anything, the GOWR example proves that with proper care, a relatively small team can get rid of this problem. I also like how you conveniently ignored Hellblade 2, but I guess this wouldn't help your cause, would it?

Who said they started after the game finished? That's just the maximum amount of time they would have had and you have no idea how much santa monica helped them. If it was so easy, this wouldn't be a prevalent issue.

Get rid of UE stutters. 90% of the bad PC ports suddenly disappear. Get rid of all stutters? Probably 95% of your bad ports are not bad anymore.

This is a flat out lie.

 

[Radical_3d]

80% of the users download games instead. A disc drive is a waste for most users like myself with only digital libraries

They went with 2TB instead, a good move, I have zero need for a disc drive

You, sir, are destroying the medium.

 

[Gaiff]

It's hard to quantify the damage that piracy does, so it's not really a problem? Hilarious.

You can't quantify it, neither can I. It's a moot point. Not to mention that it's utterly irrelevant to the point being discussed. We cannot quantify piracy any more than we can quantify the money lost due to used games on consoles. I'll decide that used games are a bigger problem, but since neither of us can prove anything, why bother?

No one is saying publishers are infallible, but if there was tangible evidence that putting out a more perfect port resulted in more day 1 sales, I'm sure more publishers would insist on it.

Some do insist though. It's not like every PC port is bad. Most of them are fine. The main culprits are AAA UE5 games.

But we're not talking about PS5, we're talking about PS5 Pro here and it seems like PS5 Pro is going to be better suited to run UE5 games than PC for quite some time. You think PC porting is more simple than it is. And if you actually read reviews on steam you would see people complain about games crashing, not loading, audio bugging out, bad KBM mapping, performance, MTX, lack of wide screen support, and a multitude of other things not related to stutter. In fact, I've rarely seen bad steam reviews due to stutter.

If you wanna go the Steam review route, then Silent Hill 2 is a good port. So is FF XVI.

I don't think it is the #1 issue on PC. Maybe it's the most common, but it isn't the most complained about.

Lol, yes it is by far.

This is a flat out lie.

Please list bad PC ports that have issues unrelated to stutters. They also need to score a Mixed or below on Steam to be considered bad. That list isn't going to be very long, I can tell you that.

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

You, sir, are destroying the medium.

By not wanting to switch discs?

 

[Radical_3d]

By not wanting to switch discs?

 

[Gaiff]

By not wanting to switch discs?

You seriously disappoint me. I have a collection of PS4 discs I’ll never get rid of.

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

You seriously disappoint me. I have a collection of PS4 discs I’ll never get rid of.

I stopped buying physical discs during the ps3 era and my library from ps4 onward has fully moved over without me needing disc drives or switching discs

To each their own but I’m not ever going back nor will I ever get a disc drive

 

[Radical_3d]

You seriously disappoint me. I have a collection of PS4 discs I’ll never get rid of.

See? Even the PC shill has more values than you. Shame on you.

 

[Zathalus]

What's growing faster PS5 and PS5 Pro or PS5 and above spec'd PCs?

38% of PCs on Steam are 6700 XT/3060 and up. So around 71.4 million GPUs based on the latest Steam player counts for the past 4 years. That’s just for Steam.

 

[Bojji]

By not wanting to switch discs?

You know it's not about that? Physical games are the best things about consoles, last bastion of actually owning games. MS started killing it a while back and Sony is doing this right now as well.

You know that once they have 100% digital distribution it will only get worse for consumers? PS store is already a bad form of digital distribution compared to open market on PC.

 

[Gaiff]

I stopped buying physical discs during the ps3 era and my library from ps4 onward has fully moved over without me needing disc drives or switching discs

To each their own but I’m not ever going back nor will I ever get a disc drive

If physical games were still an option on PC, I'd still be buying them. The last physical game I bought for PC I think is a Borderlands 1 DVD.

The reason I'm fully digital on PC isn't because I want to, it's because I have no choice. I don't trust those big corporations one bit. Everything could go down to shit tomorrow and we'd lose our libraries and they'd simply be "tough luck buddy."

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

You know it's not about that? Physical games are the best things about consoles, last bastion of actually owning games. MS started killing it a while back and Sony is doing this right now as well.

You know that once they have 100% digital distribution it will only get worse for consumers? PS store is already a bad form of digital distribution compared to open market on PC.

You know that you still have the option to play discs on consoles right?

Like I said, to each their own, but it doesn’t make sense to force people to buy a disc drive with their console…everyone needs an SSD….not everyone needs a disc drive

 

[Mibu no ookami]

38% of PCs on Steam are 6700 XT/3060 and up. So around 71.4 million GPUs based on the latest Steam player counts for the past 4 years. That’s just for Steam.

And by the end of the year Sony will probably have sold 70 million PS5/Pros...

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

Everything could go down to shit tomorrow and we'd lose our libraries and they'd simply be "tough luck buddy."

I think this is an unwarranted fear. On console there’s always the risk of new hardware not being BC, but I don’t think Sony will ever go back on BC at this point

Nor do I think they’ll do something stupid like losing all access to your games, that would result in a class action law suit of epic proportions

 

[Gaiff]

I think this is an unwarranted fear. On console there’s always the risk of new hardware not being BC, but I don’t think Sony will ever go back on BC at this point

Nor do I think they’ll do something stupid like losing all access to your games, that would result in a class action law suit of epic proportions

R18 shut down and I lost my collection of digital Japanese porn, so yes, it's a warranted fear.

 

[FrankWza]

Whatever the case, the revenues lost from piracy are more than countered by the money generated by people buying the game.

That's some crazy logic that I hope isn't rationalization

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

R18 shut down and I lost my collection of digital Japanese porn, so yes, it's a warranted fear.

I don’t think Sony is shutting down anytime soon….

 

[FrankWza]

I think this is an unwarranted fear. On console there’s always the risk of new hardware not being BC, but I don’t think Sony will ever go back on BC at this point

Nor do I think they’ll do something stupid like losing all access to your games, that would result in a class action law suit of epic proportions

I thought PS5 would get PS3 disc BC. Huge mistake on their part. I still believe that they should be focused on makin this possible for the Pro or PS6.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

You can't quantify it, neither can I. It's a moot point. Not to mention that it's utterly irrelevant to the point being discussed. We cannot quantify piracy any more than we can quantify the money lost due to used games on consoles. I'll decide that used games are a bigger problem, but since neither of us can prove anything, why bother?

Some do insist though. It's not like every PC port is bad. Most of them are fine. The main culprits are AAA UE5 games.

If you wanna go the Steam review route, then Silent Hill 2 is a good port. So is FF XVI.

Lol, yes it is by far.

Please list bad PC ports that have issues unrelated to stutters. They also need to score a Mixed or below on Steam to be considered bad. That list isn't going to be very long, I can tell you that.

No matter what list I put together, you'll find a reason it doesn't count.

But I'll list out Tekken 8, Lords of the Fallen, ARK: Survival Ascended

 

[Zathalus]

R18 shut down and I lost my collection of digital Japanese porn, so yes, it's a warranted fear.

 

[Kangx]

Gamestop with the false advertisement

This spec would have been perfect. But then again cost would go up substantially due to die size and heat. Also, with this spec, going from the pro to the ps6 would further minimize the need for the ps6 for most casual gamers.

I think, the future of the console generation is more like a graphic cards tier when the ps6 release in 3 to 4 years. Consumers can choose which setting they will go for from low to ultra which corresponds to from the ps5 to the ps6.

I suspect the ps5 will last for a long time considering how cost keep going up and most casual gamers don't really care or notice fame drop and blurry compare to the higher end machines. The ps5 still is a capable machine for mass consumers when the ps6 launch in 4 years.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

I thought PS5 would get PS3 disc BC. Huge mistake on their part. I still believe that they should be focused on makin this possible for the Pro or PS6.

There is no market interest in PS3 emulation. It makes way more sense to remaster/remake games of interest.

 

[FrankWza]

There is no market interest in PS3 emulation. It makes way more sense to remaster/remake games of interest.

Just from a historical and compatibility standpoint. I would feel better as a PS customer if they added the ability to play my PS3 games on my PS5 Pro. That's where trophy support started and enough time has gone that they can still upgrade via remasters and remakes where they would still have a market for that. It's not a huge deal but it would be a nice gesture.

 

[SweetTooth]

There is no market interest in PS3 emulation. It makes way more sense to remaster/remake games of interest.

I disagree with you on that mate. PS3 library has lots of gems

 

[Gaiff]

No matter what list I put together, you'll find a reason it doesn't count.

But I'll list out Tekken 8

Complaints about monetization and microtransactions. Last I checked, they were the same on consoles? How is it a bad port?

, Lords of the Fallen,

On consoles too...

ARK: Survival Ascended

Terrible on consoles too...


I asked for bad PC ports. You can't just list a bunch of games with problems on consoles and PC and try to frame it as a PC problem.

I'll help you with a few examples:

The Last of Us Part I
Jedi Survivor
Arkham Knight (kinda old)
GTA IV (really old too)

Those are games that were awful only on PC but mostly fine on consoles.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Just from a historical and compatibility standpoint. I would feel better as a PS customer if they added the ability to play my PS3 games on my PS5 Pro. That's where trophy support started and enough time has gone that they can still upgrade via remasters and remakes where they would still have a market for that. It's not a huge deal but it would be a nice gesture.

I disagree with you on that mate. PS3 library has lots of gems

Have to separate your own personal feelings from the market realities.

I would LOVE a new Arc The Lad or a remake same with Legend of Dragoon... That doesn't mean there is a market for it.

 

[PaintTinJr]

The piracy point was more of a generalization addressing the other poster in the same post. I also disagree about the money to fund AAA games on Day 1. Look at the sales of games like BG3, Elden Ring, Palworld, or Cyberpunk on PC Day 1.

The entire Souls genre day one sales/profit on PC probably wouldn't fund what PlayStation spent making Demon's Souls, it's remake and Bloodborne, and the risk factor of devaluing the games by selling souls games in discount bundles won't be offset by the good sales of Elden Ring IMO. And I doubt any of the games like Starfield or PS5 ports would have sold well enough - even if day and date at full price - to fund those games by PC sales/profit.

Even Cyberpunk as a AA finished game needed console sales even after its lower production costs of being made in a country with lower cost of living and sub-AAA dev wages to make good money, and would have pushed CDPR financially if those PS4/PS4 sales didn't return.

Palworld as a AA game is the only one that we can say would have been fine, and it is currently in legal battles with Nintendo for copyright allegedly encroaching Pokemon and riding its success.

This is perfectly understandable. I'm not expecting PC games to be as well optimized as console games. Consoles have a huge advantage on that front. All I ask is games that don't stutter like hell. Surely, this is feasible and doesn't require millions of dollars in QA, does it?

The stutter is probably a Nvidia and AMD response issue, and related to marketing deal for devs, where wasting time waiting for 10mins a programmer and tester every time their PCs get a automated driver update versus testing with stutter is again a time and money issue that is cheaper to sort out at the end after release - if it sells at all - or make as a GPU mfr issue to solve with new drivers.

 

[Gaiff]

The entire Souls genre day one sales/profit on PC probably wouldn't fund what PlayStation spent making Demon's Souls, it's remake and Bloodborne, and the risk factor of devaluing the games by selling souls games in discount bundles won't be offset by the good sales of Elden Ring IMO. And I doubt any of the games like Starfield or PS5 ports would have sold well enough - even if day and date at full price - to fund those games by PC sales/profit.

Even Cyberpunk as a AA finished game needed console sales even after its lower production costs of being made in a country with lower cost of living and sub-AAA dev wages to make good money, and would have pushed CDPR financially if those PS4/PS4 sales didn't return.

But that's true for most games, even Sony's first-party. Assuming a AAA game cost $150M to develop, then it would need to sell 2.5M on its first day in one platform. The games that can do that are almost non-existent. Cyberpunk reportedly cost $315M to develop. This would have required day 1 sales in excess of 5 million to fund the game in 1 day.

The reality is that most AAA games cannot recoup their budget with the sales of a single platform in one day, so I'm not sure what you're trying to say. Elden Ring for instance sold more on PC than on PS5.

 

[Zathalus]

But that's true for most games, even Sony's first-party. Assuming a AAA game cost $150M to develop, then it would need to sell 2.5M on its first day in one platform. The games that can do that are almost non-existent. Cyberpunk reportedly cost $315M to develop. This would have required day 1 sales in excess of 5 million to fund the game in 1 day.

The reality is that most AAA games cannot recoup their budget with the sales of a single platform in one day, so I'm not sure what you're trying to say. Elden Ring for instance sold more on PC than on PS5.

I think Elden Ring concurrent user peak on day one was north of 700k on PC? So that is probably a few million day one sales right there. Mega hits like Elden Ring are certainly not the majority of games though.

 

[Gaiff]

I think Elden Ring concurrent user peak on day one was north of 700k on PC? So that is probably a few million day one sales right there. Mega hits like Elden Ring are certainly not the majority of games though.

952K. Cyberpunk was 850K on Steam alone, but there was a sizable chunk of GOG buyers, so it was likely over 1M total.

 

[Radical_3d]

Complaints about monetization and microtransactions. Last I checked, they were the same on consoles? How is it a bad port?

On consoles too...


Terrible on consoles too...


I asked for bad PC ports. You can't just list a bunch of games with problems on consoles and PC and try to frame it as a PC problem.

I'll help you with a few examples:

The Last of Us Part I
Jedi Survivor
Arkham Knight (kinda old)
GTA IV (really old too)

Those are games that were awful only on PC but mostly fine on consoles.

Probably the game outside of strategy and simulation that more PC-minded gamers like is Elden Ring. It still have stutters. In console there are frame drops, but in PC stutters, which can’t be solved with VRR. But that’s just, what? A mere 22 million copies sold?

 

[PaintTinJr]

But that's true for most games, even Sony's first-party. Assuming a AAA game cost $150M to develop, then it would need to sell 2.5M on its first day in one platform. The games that can do that are almost non-existent. Cyberpunk reportedly cost $315M to develop. This would have required day 1 sales in excess of 5 million to fund the game in 1 day.

The reality is that most AAA games cannot recoup their budget with the sales of a single platform in one day, so I'm not sure what you're trying to say. Elden Ring for instance sold more on PC than on PS5.

When I say day1, I obviously mean launch period until drops out of the top 10 or 20 per platform, not being so literal and AAA games on console do cover their costs in that period.

As for costs, the marketing budgets run to nearly the same as dev costs on big AAA games, a cost and risk that only console success will cover in 99% of situations. As for Elden ring, it has sold 10m on PC AFAIK of 23m, and though that is very impressive, we probably know that more revenue will have occurred from the 13m sales on the other platforms and the marketing rights with PlayStation made it an event launch that PC sales gained from -although maximum PC souls hunger from watching the Demon's Souls remaster exclusive to PS5 might have been the bigger contributor.

 

[Felessan]

I thought PS5 would get PS3 disc BC. Huge mistake on their part. I still believe that they should be focused on makin this possible for the Pro or PS6.

No one really care but a very small minority. Those games are too old.
If anything they will sell you games again via digital emulation. No disc supported.
Sony has a working PS2 emulator. Does PS5 support PS2 discs? You have an answer to your "PS3 support" question.

 

[Zathalus]

When I say day1, I obviously mean launch period until drops out of the top 10 or 20 per platform, not being so literal and AAA games on console do cover their costs in that period.

As for costs, the marketing budgets run to nearly the same as dev costs on big AAA games, a cost and risk that only console success will cover in 99% of situations. As for Elden ring, it has sold 10m on PC AFAIK of 23m, and though that is very impressive, we probably know that more revenue will have occurred from the 13m sales on the other platforms and the marketing rights with PlayStation made it an event launch that PC sales gained from -although maximum PC souls hunger from watching the Demon's Souls remaster exclusive to PS5 might have been the bigger contributor.

25 million as of June 2024. Analysts put it around 14-16 million sold on Steam.

 

[SlimySnake]

But these Sony games that are almost native 4k in Fidelity mode like LoU2 should be able to drop resolution to 1200-1440p then use PSSR to get back up to 4k and hit 60 fps or else what makes this console anything other than a disappointment? Going from performance mode>performance mode + pssr is a sad, sad result ...it's going to give you better image quality than the existing Perf mode but with graphics inferior to what we've been playing at 40 fps already ...

Btw are you sure LoU2 is using its Fidelity mode? I thought Oliver said that one was Performance ...some people trying to say Perf and Fidelity in LoU2 are the same settings outside of resolution but i don't believe that to be true either.

Why would Sony be so foolish as to make a system that doesn't have enough power to achieve LoU2 level vusuals in Fidelity at 60 fps using PSSR it's retarded for $800 console ..i can understand for current gen games this being difficult to achieve but not cross gen games running at native 4k ...

Either ps5 pro is weak or Sony wasn't lying when they said "75% of gamers choose Performance mode and we wanted to give them that but with better iq" ...completely out of touch with the fact that hardcore gamers buying the Pro don't want to have reduced settings.

Im telling you I know how Sony thinks. They think they can slap PSSR onto performance mode and call it a day and that people won't care ....look at the posts here- Sony's right.

TLOU2 has no changes between its performance and fidelity modes outside of resolution. PSSR will likely use 4k PSSR quality which reconstructs from 1440p. That should make it look better than native 4k in most scenarios.

As for why the PS5 Pro is weak. I dont know. Makes no sense. They got a GPU that has 64% more tflops but for whatever reason, it can only provide a 45% actual performance. The 16.2 tflops 6800 has 52% more tflops than the 10.6 tflops 6600xt, and it provides a performance boost of 54%.

It was said that the 6000 series relied heavily on infinite cache to improve performance and the PS5 simply cant afford to have that on its console sized chip. But I was told on this board that they wouldnt need it because consoles have direct access to the IO. Clearly, something is missing because AMD's own GPUs in the PC market are scaling 1:1 with tflops and yet Sony's lagging 20% behind in actual performance

Whatever the reason, the console isnt strong enough and there is not much you can do. If AMD had managed to add IPC gains like they did when going from PS4 to Pro then things might have been different. But they didnt.

The biggest increases are in PSSR and ray tracing performance so I'd ask you to wait and see how that turns out. It's disappointing that they are using performance modes in the games we do know of, but wait and see what happens at launch especially with UE5 and Ray tracing games. I did some performance benchmarks in the other thread going off of Massive's own ray tracing performance profiling, and you could be getting a 100% boost to performance in their games with way better image quality.

I wouldnt be surprised that adding those ray tracing cores and pssr AI tensor cores took up space and power away from the traditional CUs, hence the 45% figure. I do think it's the right choice because thats where the industry is going. Everything is going to be RT going forward and AI upscaling is way better than FSR. I just dont think the hardware in here is worth $699 but thats another topic. I wouldnt be surprised if Cerny designed this to be a $599 console with a disc drive and some asshole suit came in and imposed their own price on it to maximize their profit margins.

 

[Rocco Schiavone]

Can't wait for Bugagas video shitting on the PS5 Pro.

• Alex is producing his own video based on the Ratchet and Clank footage I grabbed at Sony. He actually supplied me with around 12-13 test scenes (some of which you'll see in Oliver's video) which are designed to stress test reconstruction, so we should have an early idea of how PSSR stacks up against FSR 2, XeSS and, inevitably, DLSS.

 

[SlimySnake]

Can't wait for Bugagas video shitting on the PS5 Pro.

• Alex is producing his own video based on the Ratchet and Clank footage I grabbed at Sony. He actually supplied me with around 12-13 test scenes (some of which you'll see in Oliver's video) which are designed to stress test reconstruction, so we should have an early idea of how PSSR stacks up against FSR 2, XeSS and, inevitably, DLSS.

you want fanboys like Alex to go hard on PSSR because unlike hardware which is static, AI upscaling CAN be improved. But if Sony doesnt see the criticism, they wont be inclined to fix it.

Im sure their devs know the shortcomings of PSSR, but the devs are not the ones making decisions. Their bosses will just sweep their concerns under the rug unless their is direct criticism from reviewers.

 

[PaintTinJr]

25 million as of June 2024. Analysts put it around 14-16 million sold on Steam.

CoPilot can only confirm over 10m, but even if it was 14 or 16m do you think it changes the revenue point I made? I don't.

 

[Gaiff]

When I say day1, I obviously mean launch period until drops out of the top 10 or 20 per platform, not being so literal and AAA games on console do cover their costs in that period.

Thought you literally meant day 1 as in the sales for the first day alone. If it's launch window, then it's a different story.

As for costs, the marketing budgets run to nearly the same as dev costs on big AAA games, a cost and risk that only console success will cover in 99% of situations. As for Elden ring, it has sold 10m on PC AFAIK of 23m, and though that is very impressive, we probably know that more revenue will have occurred from the 13m sales on the other platforms and the marketing rights with PlayStation made it an event launch that PC sales gained from -although maximum PC souls hunger from watching the Demon's Souls remaster exclusive to PS5 might have been the bigger contributor.

I do agree that Elden Ring more than likely made more money on consoles, but the reality of the market has changed. I don't believe most third-party devs are willing to release games only for consoles anymore unless they're Rockstar. PC these days has a market share that is much larger than Xbox and often sells as well as PlayStation when it comes to AAA games. I don't think a single console or PC sell enough to cover the cost of AAA games during their launch window. Only a handful of games such as Spider-Man or GOWR manage such a feat. Even HFW sold only 8.4M copies in its first year. With its budget, it would have likely needed to sell 5 million in its first few weeks to recoup the dev/marketing cost and I doubt this happened.

Anyway, we got majorly sidetracked. The point I was raising was that the publishers often make bad bets and opting to release games that stutter like hell on PC can backfire spectacularly such as in the case of Jedi Survivor, so I don't think that them not fixing the issues on PC is a case of "it's not worth it". I think it's a combination of ignorance + thinking PC gamers won't be bothered. The QA cost to fix those issues wouldn't have run them into the millions. Even assuming they would have needed another $500K of budget to do this, that's a paltry 8,400 copies at full price (or 10-12K with the Steam cut), and I'm 100% certain they lost way more than 10-12,000 copies by releasing one of the worst ports in the last decade.

 

[Crispy Gamer]

Can't wait for Bugagas video shitting on the PS5 Pro.

• Alex is producing his own video based on the Ratchet and Clank footage I grabbed at Sony. He actually supplied me with around 12-13 test scenes (some of which you'll see in Oliver's video) which are designed to stress test reconstruction, so we should have an early idea of how PSSR stacks up against FSR 2, XeSS and, inevitably, DLSS.

He need to actually go hands on because John even admitted it looked way better in person than the high-res video Sony supplied them. Apparently, everyone at DF has gone hands on except him for whatever reason.

 

[soulbait]

You, sir, are destroying the medium.

Yeah, look how destroyed PC gaming is due to digital only...

 

[owandeseis]

CoPilot can only confirm over 10m, but even if it was 14 or 16m do you think it changes the revenue point I made? I don't.

Considering Steam takes only around 20% of the sales of the big games like ER and there's no physical copies on PC, which offer much less revenue to developers, not so sure

 

[Zathalus]

CoPilot can only confirm over 10m, but even if it was 14 or 16m do you think it changes the revenue point I made? I don't.

I think the total revenue split between console and PC is likely close either way. I’d say most developers should not ignore either market and deliver the best experience on each, that’s the best way to maximise revenue. First party for Sony would be different as the goal there is more than just revenue, adding value to the brand is critical as well.

 

[Gaiff]

I think the total revenue split between console and PC is likely close either way. I’d say most developers should not ignore either market and deliver the best experience on each, that’s the best way to maximise revenue. First party for Sony would be different as the goal there is more than just revenue, adding value to the brand is critical as well.

This. PC has most often a much larger part of the sales total than Xbox which often gets below 20%. It's not the early 2000s where PC sales accounted for less than 5%. It often gets 30, 40 or sometimes even 50%. I don't think it's unreasonable to expect devs to make decent ports for a platform that accounts for such a large portion of their user base.

 

[Lysandros]

Apparently, everyone at DF has gone hands on except him for whatever reason.

That's very unfair, he gave Sony executives all the right reasons to love him through the years. They should have invited him as a guest of honor and gift him a special black leather covered PS5 PRO to suit his particular tastes in an official ceremony.

 

[ChiefDada]

the problem with the 45% boost to raw gpu power is that even if they use pssr, they dont have much else left to increase settings or resolution.

How did you come to this conclusion?

 

[Gaiff]

Just a bit over 3 weeks left. I recon DF will have concrete results maybe a week before the public.

 

[Crispy Gamer]

That's very unfair, he gave Sony executives all the right reasons to love him through the years. They should have invited him as a guest of honor and gift him a special black leather covered PS5 PRO to suit his particular tastes in an official ceremony.

Precisely why he shouldn't touch console comparisons but if he's going to do it then at least go hands on... they act as if he's the only one that can cover PC/console comparisons I would be very surprised if he actually used a 4070 (not super) instead of a 4090.

 

[Radical_3d]

Just a bit over 3 weeks left. I recon DF will have concrete results maybe a week before the public.

But I’m bored. I want content now!

 

[Crispy Gamer]

Just a bit over 3 weeks left. I recon DF will have concrete results maybe a week before the public.

With Tom Morgan, Oliver and Richard going hands on with the dev kit I think they already have tons of footage and a pretty good idea what to expect