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[Men_in_Boxes]

Interesting that this thread is being recreated a month later...

Laura Fryer: Culture Killed Concord

Former Microsoft Games Studios executive producer Laura Fryer Concord failed because the culture of the studio made them unable or unwilling to see and fix its problems. Sadly, reality-driven game development isn't a new story and confounds many game developers.The Overwatch model was a...

www.neogaf.com

More people talk about concord than actually played the game...

She's kind of grifting at this point for views.

The entire business model is based on attention, which leads to junk food media.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

I agree. I respect Fryer, and her take is absolutely reasonable, and under normal professional circumstances, it's actually the approach I use myself. I always weigh up my worth versus the feedback I feel needs to be expressed and pick my battles. However, the sheer depth of failure in Concord tells me that these weren't normal professional circumstances. Individual developers clearly couldn't apply even a reasonable approach. That's a broken feedback loop, and in my experience, that comes from the top down. Once that kind of culture is in, I've have never seen it ripped out. The broken feedback loop seems to be becoming a mainstay of modern game development.

Good Lord. Accusing Fryer of grifting tells me you either didn't watch both videos - both of which have excellent insight build from her extensive industry experience - or you don't know what a "grift" actually is.

Grifting is telling someone what they want to hear, especially in how you frame it.

Fryer did not work at Firewalk. She is speculating and extrapolating based on rumors spread online.

To make a SECOND video on Concord is clearly for views... hence the term grifting.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

The entire business model is based on attention, which leads to junk food media.

I think she generally makes high quality videos and in depth analysis, but she specifically aims to draw as much media attention as she can by focusing on what she think will create the most discourse based on negative emotions at the time.

Evidence:

Look at her previous video before the last two Concord videos. 6.3 views in 3 months compared with this one 6.7 views in one day. She knows by focusing on Concord, she will get people to spread the video across social media.

Her previous video why studios fail... only 9.4K views.

Her concord video got 200K views so she followed it up with another one.

All of her videos are negative in concept. It's her entire schtick.

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

I think she generally makes high quality videos and in depth analysis, but she specifically aims to draw as much media attention as she can by focusing on what she think will create the most discourse based on negative emotions at the time.

Evidence:

Look at her previous video before the last two Concord videos. 6.3 views in 3 months compared with this one 6.7 views in one day. She knows by focusing on Concord, she will get people to spread the video across social media.

Her previous video why studios fail... only 9.4K views.

Her concord video got 200K views so she followed it up with another one.

All of her videos are negative in concept. It's her entire schtick.

She's like Jason Schreier in that she packages up her schlock in a more intelligent way, but it's all schlock.

 

[ZehDon]

Grifting is telling someone what they want to hear, especially in how you frame it.

Fryer did not work at Firewalk. She is speculating and extrapolating based on rumors spread online.

To make a SECOND video on Concord is clearly for views... hence the term grifting.

She never claimed to, nor did she frame her response to require such knowledge. When I can't be bothered to watch the videos, I don't post in threads about said videos. I find this approach yields good results for all involved.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

She's like Jason Schreier in that she packages up her schlock in a more intelligent way, but it's all schlock.

This is a great comparison.

Gaming needs to reject these people across the spectrum.

We just had one of the best years in gaming and one of the best back to back years in gaming, but the narrative online is that gaming is in a bad spot and that there are no games...

It's people like these that shift gaming to a negative place.

Concord failed... who cares. It's literally one game. I've never seen so many people talk about a game they didn't play or care to play. Like more people talk about this game than Suicide Squad or Star Wars Outlaws...

 

[Mibu no ookami]

She never claimed to, nor did she frame her response to require such knowledge. When I can't be bothered to watch the videos, I don't post in threads about said videos. I find this approach yields good results for all involved.

I watched her first video and I thought it was a decent video. I don't see a need for a follow video based on the same game which has no additional knowledge about. If she just created a new video about navigating toxic positivity she knows it wouldn't get any traction so she throws Concord in there...

 

[ZehDon]

I watched her first video and I thought it was a decent video. I don't see a need for a follow video based on the same game which has no additional knowledge about. If she just created a new video about navigating toxic positivity she knows it wouldn't get any traction so she throws Concord in there...

Then perhaps go post the threads about the videos you did bother to watch, then?

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Then perhaps go post the threads about the videos you did bother to watch, then?

Or or or I can call her out as a grifter who makes all negative videos, gets no views unless she is taking shots at big companies who would no longer hire her.

 

[KURDISTAN YPG]

even at this rate, you would think a ceo of company would step in say" hold up man" but dawm this shit is order of order, just ignore everyting and do what you want see how long you breath in life with that attitude

 

[Loomy]

Is toxic positivity the same as lying?

It's building a bubble around yourself and lying to yourself and asking the people who work for you to lie to themselves too. So...yes? lol

 

[Mibu no ookami]

even at this rate, you would think a ceo of company would step in say" hold up man" but dawm this shit is order of order, just ignore everyting and do what you want see how long you breath in life with that attitude

The reality is that it is more complex than that.

People will say they want work in a collaborate space and then when something fails they'll tell you it was because it was designed by committee.

There are both success stories and failures when CEO and directors step in and say we're doing it this way. There is no perfect formula to game development and hindsight artists will tell you after the fact why a game failed without actually having been there.

 

[M1chl]

Toxic positivity absolutely plagues West bound internet, its not just these companies who loves to suck their own dick, its plaguing forums, youtube, you name it. Always "love" when someone soyraging sentence "whats up with negativity??" Well maybe it sucks.

> What do you actually do in this game
>> Whats up with this concern, devs clearly shown what you will be doing, stop being so negative

> Game bombs because there is not much to do, so many people sacrificing their hard earned money to endless pit of fake ass positivity aka hype

There is obviously opposite effect present, like with Silent Hill 2 Remake, because people didn't like what they had to offer and unfairly ridiculed game just because devs didn't made soy soap opera with lot of booms. But I much prefer second scenario to be honest. Its entertaining and it does not reeks of this:

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Toxic positivity absolutely plagues West bound internet, its not just these companies who loves to suck their own dick, its plaguing forums, youtube, you name it. Always "love" when someone soyraging sentence "whats up with negativity??" Well maybe it sucks.

> What do you actually do in this game
>> Whats up with this concern, devs clearly shown what you will be doing, stop being so negative

> Game bombs because there is not much to do, so many people sacrificing their hard earned money to endless pit of fake ass positivity aka hype

There is obviously opposite effect present, like with Silent Hill 2 Remake, because people didn't like what they had to offer and unfairly ridiculed game just because devs didn't made soy soap opera with lot of booms. But I much prefer second scenario to be honest. Its entertaining and it does not reeks of this:

I'm not saying everything has to be sunshine and lollipops, but this is not an accurate read of the industry today, but rather your worldview.

The reality is I've never seen gaming more negative than it is today and that's saying something.

 

[M1chl]

I'm not saying everything has to be sunshine and lollipops, but this is not an accurate read of the industry today, but rather your worldview.

The reality is I've never seen gaming more negative than it is today and that's saying something.

Does it really needs to be said, that I am writing that as my personal opinion, rather than making universally true statement?

tld;dr IMHO

 

[BbMajor7th]

Not had a chance to watch the video yet, but another major component in toxic positivity is the belief that everyone's ideas are equally valid.

The modern corporate space will politely let just about anyone waffle on with bad ideas about things they don't understand for fear of seeming bullying or high-handed, even when it's wasting time and steering things off course.

The problem is that everyone thinks they're smart these days and it's become the height of bad manners to point out that most people are average and a small number of people are operating in a space the average person will never reach.

People aren't comfortable with that anymore - they don't admire smart people, they feel threatened by them and will use emotional ploys to shut them down, rather than doing the truly smart thing of recognising the limits of their own intelligence.

Meanwhile, managers will encourage smart employees to be more 'diplomatic' or 'work on their communication skills' or 'pick their fights more carefully', because being right all the time makes other people uncomfortable.

 

[Shake Your Rump]

Interesting that this thread is being recreated a month later...

Laura Fryer: Culture Killed Concord

Former Microsoft Games Studios executive producer Laura Fryer Concord failed because the culture of the studio made them unable or unwilling to see and fix its problems. Sadly, reality-driven game development isn't a new story and confounds many game developers.The Overwatch model was a...

www.neogaf.com

More people talk about concord than actually played the game...

She's kind of grifting at this point for views.

You didn’t watch either video? These are two separate essays. Well worth the time to watch.

 

[StueyDuck]

Hmm so I watched the video...

It's full of corporate speak and doesn't really say much or put forward a solution.

Basically you should have a work culture of speaking up... but only when you can, and only when you can take rejection, but you should be open to ideas, but stay true to your own vision. It's a bit of corporate word salad.

I understand the point she is trying to make, but there's also so much contradictory statements she makes that it ends up in the same feedback loop.

And honestly I don't think it really targets the issue of toxic positivity... just how to be a good pm.

Toxic positivity has its own can of worms and it's not just as simple as never say no or never believe in failure.

 

[PeteBull]

Hmm so I watched the video...

It's full of corporate speak and doesn't really say much or put forward a solution.

Basically you should have a work culture of speaking up... but only when you can, and only when you can take rejection, but you should be open to ideas, but stay true to your own vision. It's a bit of corporate word salad.

I understand the point she is trying to make, but there's also so much contradictory statements she makes that it ends up in the same feedback loop.

And honestly I don't think it really targets the issue of toxic positivity... just how to be a good pm.

Toxic positivity has its own can of worms and it's not just as simple as never say no or never believe in failure.

In other words its basically cathering to women's way of talking and thinking, thats what u get when companies do DEI hires, as a result u gotta tip-top around ppls feelings pretending u care to not hurt them.
Truth is- making games is competetive business and to survive in it u have to have thick skin on top of taking critique on a daily basis, otherwise u cant improve urself nor game u working on and results of all that is-we can see mediocre games being launched all the time nowadays, big budget games with 5+years of devtime at that.

My pov is- fk those feelings, in this kind of business we gotta use logic instead, game's quality should always be top priority, if some1 cant handle the truth and becomes emotional(aka unable to think logically/work) they can always go become housewife/nanny/daycare teacher etc.
Go work a job in an environment u dont have to compete against the other devs from all parts of the world for players aka ur customers money

 

[Angry_Megalodon]

I love the language manipulation of adding "positive" to a malpractice every time this behavior is made by "the good guys". Same as "positive discrimination", this culture is unacceptable, no matter how they want to sugarcoat it. "Toxic positivity" means no room for argument or candid discussions, just acceptance of the ideas of the ones in charge or else you will be fired/mobbed.

People using or condoning this language are bullshitters and should not be trusted. Firewalk has an extremely toxic environment and needs to be called out without further explanations about how this toxicity is any different from others.

 

[Astray]

I watched her first video and I thought it was a decent video. I don't see a need for a follow video based on the same game which has no additional knowledge about. If she just created a new video about navigating toxic positivity she knows it wouldn't get any traction so she throws Concord in there...

Having watched the video, the Concord mention in the title is very spurious and the game itself is barely mentioned in the video.

This video is more geared towards people who work in a dev studio, feel pressured not to give criticism, and want to be able to deliver their feedback in a way that doesn't wreck their career. From that perspective, this video is good.

However, I'd argue that she'd have a better time finding reach for this material in a LinkedIn post.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Having watched the video, the Concord mention in the title is very spurious and the game itself is barely mentioned in the video.

This video is more geared towards people who work in a dev studio, feel pressured not to give criticism, and want to be able to deliver their feedback in a way that doesn't wreck their career. From that perspective, this video is good.

However, I'd argue that she'd have a better time finding reach for this material in a LinkedIn post.

There is a reason why she isn't pushing this on LinkedIn.

Hindsight bias doesn't work in the real world. As someone who has conducted After Action Reviews both in the military and in tech, I can tell the difference.

She's looking for youtube views... Again... look at her entire channel.

 

[adamsapple]

There's a lot more going on in PlayStation news, what's the point in pissing on the corpse of Concord?

It was labeled as the "Future of the PlayStation Brand", worth discussing what Sony modeled its long-term future ambitions after.

 

[Wildebeest]

I watched her first video and I thought it was a decent video. I don't see a need for a follow video based on the same game which has no additional knowledge about. If she just created a new video about navigating toxic positivity she knows it wouldn't get any traction so she throws Concord in there...

You are being disingenuous. The video title wasn't about Concord and the question was about another game, about "this is vegas", which the questioner worked on. Concord was used as a more recent example of how descriptions of "company culture" can be very different from person to person, using the example of Concords companies statements about its culture on its website compared to what staff said about the culture informally after Concord was released. This is actually a very insightful observation, similar to things I have heard from anthropology.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

You are being disingenuous. The video title wasn't about Concord and the question was about another game, about "this is vegas", which she and the questioner worked on. Concord was used as a more recent example of how descriptions of "company culture" can be very different from person to person, using the example of Concords companies statements about its culture on its website compared to what staff said about the culture informally after Concord was released. This is actually a very insightful observation, similar to things I have heard from anthropology.

The video title isn't about concord, but the thumbnail clearly is.

The only reason Concord is mentioned is to drum up views.

Can you tell me what hindsight bias is?

 

[Wildebeest]

The video title isn't about concord, but the thumbnail clearly is.

The only reason Concord is mentioned is to drum up views.

Can you tell me what hindsight bias is?

Concord is a current game. It perfectly makes sense to bring it up to show that this isn't something that is just new or old but ongoing.

Naturally I know what hindsight bias is but could just as easily look it up again, so what is the point in asking me? Do you think good or bad management has no predictive power over the success of a project? If so, then pardon my language, but what's the fucking point of having any managers or leaders at all?

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Concord is a current game. It perfectly makes sense to bring it up to show that this isn't something that is just new or old but ongoing.

Naturally I know what hindsight bias is but could just as easily look it up again, so what is the point in asking me? Do you think good or bad management has no predictive power over the success of a project? If so, then pardon my language, but what's the fucking point of having any managers or leaders at all?

As a manager I try to see all potential pitfalls and address how to avoid them or contingencies, but agile will teach you that you know the least about a project at the start of a project compared to half way through a project or at the end of a project, yet at the beginning of a project you're making most of your plans.

Hindsight bias is looking at a project that didn't go well (especially one that you weren't a part of) and simply but assertively claiming that if you followed these tenants the project wouldn't have failed.

These are broad strokes and unproductive. It isn't how an after action review would go. You couldn't do a proper after action review without having key knowledge of how decisions were made and when they were made.

The perfect example I like to bring up is what came out publicly from Concord, which one guy complained that the art design was designed by committee, this is a massive misnomer.

I can tell you that companies like this are all kumbaya and the employees will say they want to work in collaborative spaces. That can work and it can fail. It's not inherently a bad thing, but to say after the fact that the result is what it is because it was designed by a committee is inherently an excuse.

People like to dog pile on a game like Concord without knowing many of the actual facts of development, but I can tell you as a manager there are multiple leadership style that work and the same leadership style doesn't work with different employees or maybe even on different projects.

When someone like her comes along and is all answers after the fact, you should ask yourself why she isn't in gaming anymore. It's been nearly a decade since she even shipped a game.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Another example I would give is Testuya Nomura who has a mountain of say into character design and what he did to Final Fantasy after FFX was largely to destroy the franchise.

Every character had to become the same archetype. Stoic, brooding and emo. They also were made to look like Gackt.

Lightning
Noctis
Clive

 

[EverydayBeast]

The official ruling on Concord is labeled as failure and it will be great to see Concord 2.

 

[mckmas8808]

Is toxic positivity the same as lying?

YES!

"Toxic positivity" is an excellent description.

Also, Concord is a fantastic example of marketing myopia:

- Shortsightedness
- Product-focused, not customer-focused
- Missing the point
- Ignoring the competition

It should be included in business books as the first example.

Completely agree with all points above!

She has a nice video, but I’m sure Concorde could have succeeded with a different skin. There is a character that wears a bucket on their head.

No it couldn't. They game WASN'T GOOD! People need to stop lying about this very point. There is no "skin" that could have made this game good.

 

[Wildebeest]

As a manager I try to see all potential pitfalls and address how to avoid them or contingencies, but agile will teach you that you know the least about a project at the start of a project compared to half way through a project or at the end of a project, yet at the beginning of a project you're making most of your plans.

Hindsight bias is looking at a project that didn't go well (especially one that you weren't a part of) and simply but assertively claiming that if you followed these tenants the project wouldn't have failed.

These are broad strokes and unproductive. It isn't how an after action review would go. You couldn't do a proper after action review without having key knowledge of how decisions were made and when they were made.

The perfect example I like to bring up is what came out publicly from Concord, which one guy complained that the art design was designed by committee, this is a massive misnomer.

I can tell you that companies like this are all kumbaya and the employees will say they want to work in collaborative spaces. That can work and it can fail. It's not inherently a bad thing, but to say after the fact that the result is what it is because it was designed by a committee is inherently an excuse.

People like to dog pile on a game like Concord without knowing many of the actual facts of development, but I can tell you as a manager there are multiple leadership style that work and the same leadership style doesn't work with different employees or maybe even on different projects.

When someone like her comes along and is all answers after the fact, you should ask yourself why she isn't in gaming anymore. It's been nearly a decade since she even shipped a game.

The question was "how do you approach managers with ideas which could seem political and be a career risk". I don't see what agile has to do with it. Having people being scared to bring up ideas, at any point, in case they are not popular is not "agile". I really don't see how this video is attempting to be an exhaustive post-mortem on Concord development, no matter how you try to criticise it for failing to do that. There was a thumbnail? So what.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

The question was "how do you approach managers with ideas which could seem political and be a career risk". I don't see what agile has to do with it. Having people being scared to bring up ideas, at any point, in case they are not popular is not "agile". I really don't see how this video is attempting to be an exhaustive post-mortem on Concord development, no matter how you try to criticise it for failing to do that. There was a thumbnail? So what.

Maybe I wasn't clear enough.

What I'm saying is her coming in after the fact with no real knowledge of what happened on the game but clearly using the game to promote the video and suggesting it was about politics is absolutely grifting for views.

Again, look at every video she has posted on her channel. It's clear as day what she is doing and where she is having success and not having success.

 

[Gambit2483]

As long as you have feminists in both positions of power and in large amounts of your workforce Toxic Positivity will ALWAYS be an issue.

They simple cannot handle the stress and criticism of game development. They will do everything they can to shield themselves from having their feelings hurt when they (inevitably) come up with a bad idea or create an environment where production quality decreases.

Everyone will be constantly walking on eggshells in fear of being reported to HR. There's a reason Western games are getting shittier and shittier from prior generations. Just look at the teams that are now making them.

 

[Plague Doctor]

"Toxic positivity" is an excellent description.

Also, Concord is a fantastic example of marketing myopia:

- Shortsightedness
- Product-focused, not customer-focused
- Missing the point
- Ignoring the competition

It should be included in business books as the first example.

All this.

What's the most ponderous aspect is that Sony bet the farm on this (hyperbole for impact as Sony can easily weather this epic failure, but they did invest a lot). Was there no one in corporate that took a look at it or at the very least the reception of the two betas and pushed on them?

The financial loss isn't the core issue. How it even made it to completion in the state it did and the failures in leadership is the core issue. Project this size and budget need a critical asshole at the top of the foodchain or in that strata.

They acquired the fucking studio and let them run amuck with seemingly no oversight because if we got this with oversight, what the fuck is happening internally at Sony?

Edit: And there can be games made from the pure artistic vision of a proven director with an impressive track record. This was not a proven director and with the amount invested into it, it had to appeal to the most general of general audiences to even move the needle.

 

[DonkeyPunchJr]

As long as you have feminists in both positions of power and in large amounts of your workforce Toxic Positivity will ALWAYS be an issue.

They simple cannot handle the stress and criticism of game development. They will do everything they can to shield themselves from having their feelings hurt when they (inevitably) come up with a bad idea or create an environment where production quality decreases.

Everyone will be constantly walking on eggshells in fear of being reported to HR. There's a reason Western games are getting shittier and shittier from prior generations. Just look at the teams that are now making them.

Something has got to give when literally nobody is buying the product. Companies won’t keep on flushing money down the toilet indefinitely. Eventually these devs will go bankrupt or get euthanized by their parent companies.

 

[Gambit2483]

Something has got to give when literally nobody is buying the product. Companies won’t keep on flushing money down the toilet indefinitely. devs will go bankrupt or get euthanized by their parent companies.

The ones who are smart and decide that their livelihood and multi million dollar company is worth more than political messaging will begin purging the "trouble" and non skilled employees, starting with management positions. They basically have to subtly begin a campaign of getting rid of the rot.

They have to have company wide talks on "Toxic positivity" and how it will no longer be tolerated and that people have to learn how to take honest productive criticism.

That's at least a start but if rumors are true about CD Project Red these companies are actually double downing on hiring people based on factors other than their skill level/capabilities.

Edit:


I don't necessarily agree with this channels overall platform/viewpoints but this is a pretty decent video that goes into the current problem of today's Videogame studios and their decline in quality products over the past several years.

 

[delfrickintree]

winjer i did not read any of this thread, and i believe its time for you to ask for a temp ban. I've done it before.. it helps

juat bro to bro advice

 

[winjer]

winjer i did not read any of this thread, and i believe its time for you to ask for a temp ban. I've done it before.. it helps

juat bro to bro advice

Are you joking or just crazy...

 

[Last Hearth]

Is toxic positivity the same as lying?

Toxic positivity is telling the emperor his new clothes are beautiful.

 

[proandrad]

As long as you have feminists in both positions of power and in large amounts of your workforce Toxic Positivity will ALWAYS be an issue.

They simple cannot handle the stress and criticism of game development. They will do everything they can to shield themselves from having their feelings hurt when they (inevitably) come up with a bad idea or create an environment where production quality decreases.

Everyone will be constantly walking on eggshells in fear of being reported to HR. There's a reason Western games are getting shittier and shittier from prior generations. Just look at the teams that are now making them.

That’s a pretty hot take. So your first solution to fix companies hiring based on personal beliefs and ideology is to start firing only the ones you dislike? How about hiring the most qualified person for each position and keeping personal beliefs and ideologies out of the hiring process.

 

[RickMasters]

Why is this still being talked about? They can’t just let sleeping dogs lay…… the game sucked. We know. Moving on….. jeez!

 

[John Bilbo]

Toxic positivity is telling the emperor his new clothes are beautiful.

 

[FunkMiller]

Why is this still being talked about? They can’t just let sleeping dogs lay…… the game sucked. We know. Moving on….. jeez!

Because it’s very, very funny. A big corporation pissing billions down the drain due to their idiotic business practises is a fantastic story.

 

[chokotoureiki]

Because it’s very, very funny. A big corporation pissing billions down the drain due to their idiotic business practises is a fantastic story.

Leftwing nutjobs ruin everything basically.

 

[Gambit2483]

That’s a pretty hot take. So your first solution to fix companies hiring based on personal beliefs and ideology is to start firing only the ones you dislike? How about hiring the most qualified person for each position and keeping personal beliefs and ideologies out of the hiring process.

I didn't say anything about disliking people. If you have employees that run to HR to put in complaints because someone "didn't use a smiley face at the end of an email" or "used an exclamation point" (reported to have actually happened against a male dev employee) then you might want to have a talk with those employees because they are in fact creating a harmful unproductive environment.

In other words employees that are creating these Toxic positive work spaces need to be talked to and if necessary ultimately let go because they are a major detriment to the workspace productivity and creativity where people are constantly afraid of unintentionally upsetting or hurting people's feelings (over stupid shit).

And agreed, people should be hired based on skill level and not because a studio wants to artifically manufacture the office demographics (i.e. let's hire her with 2 years experience instead of him with 10 years experience for our 150mil budget game, only because of her genetics), unfortunately that's apparently not what's been happening in the industry these past several years.

 

[Feel Like I'm On 42]

The real problem with Concord is Sony. Today's Sony is making risky moves in the eyes of their customers, prioritizing profitability over the brand's good reputation.

The ridiculous number of remasters priced at €10, which could’ve just been simple patches (like TLOU, Spiderman, etc.), and the completely unnecessary remakes like Until Dawn, are damaging the IPs along the way.

They're pushing so hard for live service games, forcing their best teams to make one, losing talent, time, and focus in the process. Then they release a PS5 Pro without basic things like a stand or a disc drive, seriously?

Spending 400 million on a game as simple as Concord, when your competitors are offering better and free games in this genre, is absurd and concerning. It shows arrogance and a disconnect from the market and what your customers actually want.

Chances are Concord has suffered from "positive toxicity" in its development, especially in the artistic side, just like many other games. But the real issue lies with the ones footing the bill and commissioning the project: Sony.

This is what I wanted to say but you said it perfectly ...it's SONY right now. Ever since the PS5 released they've been a different company, a worse company. I could list many things but they've all been said. I'll add a couple things though:

-they're no longer the graphics kings. They've been "cashing in" this generation, not updating their studios engines to keep up with the latest techniques, focused on cross gen for very longtime and have coasted based on the reputation they garnered during PS3 and PS4 eras. Even publishers like Ubisoft have surpassed Sony on graphics this gen!
-greed manifesting with GaaS and more and more PC focus to the detriment of resources that would've gone into Playstation games (and generation defining single player games at that) in previous generations.
-not giving ps5 owners an inch another example of the greed we've seen. Raised prices of games ...ok fine that was bound to happen but then they turn around with $10 "directors cuts" aka PS5 versions of their games
- ps5 pros price along with lack of disc drive. The console is overpriced AND ....here's the thing that's really bothering me...Pro is supposed to be about not having to sacrifice graphics for framerate right? So why is EVERY Sony game only seemingly using Performance mode to update, a sacrifice/compromise on their $780 (w/disc) console?? They seem to be so arrogant or just spread SO THIN that they're not putting in the effort to even deliver on their own marketing!

It's that same mentality as charging extra for patches ...sometimes you gotta do a little something extra for your customers for a change. Yes, businesses exist to make money, but with Sony this gen it feels like it's all take take take. Jesus man at least have a bit of hustle on your $780 console! Imagine how PC owners would react to some of the decisions Sony has been making all gen long...they wouldn't tolerate it. Console gamers are so used to this treatment nobody even thinks "hey you can do better than THIS sony"

 

[SkylineRKR]

west=/= not world.

Yes, many western games and developers fail and a DEI culture where feedback isn't appreciated is seeping in. So they go ahead, sycophants are afraid to criticize their forced inclusion ideas and bad art direction and consumers dismiss it. They are hell bent on destroying their legacy with uglifiying characters and appealing to no one for reasons.

But look at this year, and look at the games that came out and were actually good. The year started with Like a Dragon, FFVII Rebirth, Tekken 8 and Dragons Dogma 2. I liked all of these, despite some disappointment in how Bamco handles T8 right now. Then Stellar Blade, Visions of Mana, Wukong, Astro Bot, Granblue Fantasy, Unicorn Overlord, Metaphor and Silent Hill 2 which was western developed but supervised by Japan. Those are al very solid games, 4 new IP in fact.

And while western studios struggle, Helldivers 2 and Space Marines were well received and actually 2 of the games that didn't deal with the DEI infection.

 

[delfrickintree]

west=/= not world.

Yes, many western games and developers fail and a DEI culture where feedback isn't appreciated is seeping in. So they go ahead, sycophants are afraid to criticize their forced inclusion ideas and bad art direction and consumers dismiss it. They are hell bent on destroying their legacy with uglifiying characters and appealing to no one for reasons.

But look at this year, and look at the games that came out and were actually good. The year started with Like a Dragon, FFVII Rebirth, Tekken 8 and Dragons Dogma 2. I liked all of these, despite some disappointment in how Bamco handles T8 right now. Then Stellar Blade, Visions of Mana, Wukong, Astro Bot, Granblue Fantasy, Unicorn Overlord, Metaphor and Silent Hill 2 which was western developed but supervised by Japan. Those are al very solid games, 4 new IP in fact.

And while western studios struggle, Helldivers 2 and Space Marines were well received and actually 2 of the games that didn't deal with the DEI infection.

*draws a giant penis over your face at the start of the meeting*

 

[thicc_girls_are_teh_best]

I don’t think the problem is “toxic positivity”as such, I think Sony is being run by very incompetent and out of touch people who don’t understand the market, or audience, or have a vision for the future or the present for that matter. So, we are going to see many more Concords as long as these people are in place. Heck we already saw a mini one with the unnecessary and crappy until dawn remake.

Sadly I feel you're right at this point.

This is a great comparison.

Gaming needs to reject these people across the spectrum.

We just had one of the best years in gaming and one of the best back to back years in gaming, but the narrative online is that gaming is in a bad spot and that there are no games...

It's people like these that shift gaming to a negative place.

Concord failed... who cares. It's literally one game. I've never seen so many people talk about a game they didn't play or care to play. Like more people talk about this game than Suicide Squad or Star Wars Outlaws...

You know who you should be blaming for it, then? Sony.

People like this video's creator fill a vacuum in the online enthusiast gaming space...the same one Sony let Microsoft run with virtually unopposed, the same one Sony basically stopped really having a voice in. They let the mainstream games media, a lot of whom were already partial to Xbox and coopted by Microsoft over the years due to astroturfing, control gaming discussion online for the most part. It got really bad during 2022-2023 when the ABK acquisition proceedings were happening.

Sony stopped doing PlayStation Experience, dropped out of E3, eventually stopped doing PlayStation Showcases, and never put people from the brand out to represent it in gaming spaces online the way Microsoft did with Phil Spencer, Aaron Greenberg, or later on Matt Booty & Sarah Bond. They never boosted content creators or rizzed them the way Microsoft did Parris, Destin, Ryan, Jez, Colteastwood, Tassi or Grubb, etc. I'm not saying these were net benefits Microsoft did; their astroturfing was terrible and it's led to why there's so much negativity in gaming discourse today. That's why I named the people I did just a moment ago.

But at least Microsoft engaged in some level with the games media & enthusiast communities with relatable people who became faces for the brand. Sony were kind of doing that for a bit with Andrew House, Shu Yoshida, Jack Tretton etc. in the earlier PS4 era but then pulled back as those guys either left or went to lower-profile areas of SIE. Since a lot of Microsoft's efforts were aimed squarely at attacking PlayStation (usually with FUD and bad faith arguments), SIE should've been more proactive but they never were.

So yeah, Sony are ultimately the reason why content like this video exist today and why it's so popular. This content fills a void, and if Sony don't want to take charge over the narrative & optics of something like Concord, then opportunists will. You can't blame people for seeing a void and filling it in while making some money along the way.

It was labeled as the "Future of the PlayStation Brand", worth discussing what Sony modeled its long-term future ambitions after.

TBF that's just hearsay from someone in the media. It'd be nice to see an internal memo or audio leak showing those actual words were used, but I wouldn't expect it.

But if games like Concord really are what SIE are pushing a majority of their investments in, then yes, they're screwed.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Sadly I feel you're right at this point.



You know who you should be blaming for it, then? Sony.

People like this video's creator fill a vacuum in the online enthusiast gaming space...the same one Sony let Microsoft run with virtually unopposed, the same one Sony basically stopped really having a voice in. They let the mainstream games media, a lot of whom were already partial to Xbox and coopted by Microsoft over the years due to astroturfing, control gaming discussion online for the most part. It got really bad during 2022-2023 when the ABK acquisition proceedings were happening.

Sony stopped doing PlayStation Experience, dropped out of E3, eventually stopped doing PlayStation Showcases, and never put people from the brand out to represent it in gaming spaces online the way Microsoft did with Phil Spencer, Aaron Greenberg, or later on Matt Booty & Sarah Bond. They never boosted content creators or rizzed them the way Microsoft did Parris, Destin, Ryan, Jez, Colteastwood, Tassi or Grubb, etc. I'm not saying these were net benefits Microsoft did; their astroturfing was terrible and it's led to why there's so much negativity in gaming discourse today. That's why I named the people I did just a moment ago.

But at least Microsoft engaged in some level with the games media & enthusiast communities with relatable people who became faces for the brand. Sony were kind of doing that for a bit with Andrew House, Shu Yoshida, Jack Tretton etc. in the earlier PS4 era but then pulled back as those guys either left or went to lower-profile areas of SIE. Since a lot of Microsoft's efforts were aimed squarely at attacking PlayStation (usually with FUD and bad faith arguments), SIE should've been more proactive but they never were.

So yeah, Sony are ultimately the reason why content like this video exist today and why it's so popular. This content fills a void, and if Sony don't want to take charge over the narrative & optics of something like Concord, then opportunists will. You can't blame people for seeing a void and filling it in while making some money along the way.



TBF that's just hearsay from someone in the media. It'd be nice to see an internal memo or audio leak showing those actual words were used, but I wouldn't expect it.

But if games like Concord really are what SIE are pushing a majority of their investments in, then yes, they're screwed.

Skimmed your long-winded ramble, No it's not Sony's fault. It's not about a vacuum. It's about negativity selling across the internet. It's not exclusive to video games.