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[GregLombardi]

Tapped cards in Arena is going to join Urza is Green, Unban SFM, and Is Cryptic Command Balanced? as a regular topic of conversation in these threads, isn't it?

I have warmed to it after playing. However, I still strongly disagree with it. I think its easy in Arena to miss key pieces of info, and I think that the tapping issue does in fact lead to this more often than not. Its a bit of a messy presentation.

I'm not saying the solution is easy...nor that they've done a bad job. At first I thought they had, but I think they've done good follow up work.

 

[Ashodin]

Closed beta info next week's stream. Finally.

 

[charlequin]

When we had the novels they allowed the writer to breathe and illustrate the world in words that made everything feel like it belonged.

With the novels we had some random freelance asshole who didn't know anything about the plotting or worldbuilding going on inside the creative team making up stories that had nothing to do with previous stories or the actual contents of the set.

Though the story today really REAAAAAAAAAALLY hints at it being a Mirari.

How so?

 

[FreedomFrisbee]

How so?

"I think it's something that's not supposed to be here," Jace said. "Something introduced to this world."

Stuff does seem to be lining up for a Mirari.

 

[Infinite Stars]

Shit.

It could have looked like shit.

Or it could look like Modo, but that would just be repeating what you said.

 

[Ashodin]

With the novels we had some random freelance asshole who didn't know anything about the plotting or worldbuilding going on inside the creative team making up stories that had nothing to do with previous stories or the actual contents of the set.



How so?

I explicitly posted that to bait you into posting

I WIN

 

[Joe Molotov]

Stuff does seem to be lining up for a Mirari.

Or Mono Green Urza.

 

[OnPoint]

I explicitly posted that to bait you into posting

I WIN

Butwhy.gif

 

[Ashodin]

Butwhy.gif

Not really, but I did figure that any post about the Weatherlight Saga would draw him out of hiding lol

Spoiler

Even though charlequin has a tendency to post in the thread only to say "ha I'm right!" on something

 

[Attleborotaco]

Need some help cutting cards from my Queen Marchesa EDH deck. Any help is appreciated.

Queen Marchesa

 

[Violet_0]

can we go back to discussing the current state of Jace's romantic relationships, please

 

[charlequin]

Not really, but I did figure that any post about the Weatherlight Saga would draw him out of hiding lol

Spoiler

Even though charlequin has a tendency to post in the thread only to say "ha I'm right!" on something

i definitely don't only post to say i'm right despite being right so often

 

[Ashodin]

i definitely don't only post to say i'm right despite being right so often

tendency doesn't mean all the time

*rib rib rib*

 

[cuc]

It hurts to be reminded that even in the new digital implementation of Magic, we are still getting Hexproof in place of the beautiful Shroud.

 

[ZealousD]

It hurts to be reminded that even in the new digital implementation of Magic, we are still getting Hexproof in place of the beautiful Shroud.

What does digital implementation have to do with the difference between Hexproof and Shroud?

 

[SigmasonicX]

What does digital implementation have to do with the difference between Hexproof and Shroud?

Shroud was replaced because players mistakenly thought they could target their own creatures with spells. Hexproof allows you to do that. I assume cuc means that players will accept shroud more if the interface makes it clear they can't target their own creatures, so it should come back.

Though I'm not convinced shroud is superior as an ability even if you disregard that.

 

[A Serious Man]

Chat is making fun of Arena for looking like Hearthstone

What else was it going to look like?

The chat during these streams has been remarkably dumb. A good portion of the community really don't understand what's going on here.

 

[ZealousD]

Shroud was replaced because players mistakenly thought they could target their own creatures with spells. Hexproof allows you to do that. I assume cuc means that players will accept shroud more if the interface makes it clear they can't target their own creatures, so it should come back.

Ah, well....

Hearthstone has shroud and people try to target their own shroud creatures all the time. I think this is less about paper vs digital and more that people have trouble realizing shroud is a drawback in a lot of cases.

 

[Tunoku]

The chat during these streams has been remarkably dumb. A good portion of the community really don't understand what's going on here.

Also, keep in mind that a bunch of viewers come from the popular HS streamers, so that stuff is to be expected.

 

[ZealousD]

Also, keep in mind that a bunch of viewers come from the popular HS streamers, so that stuff is to be expected.

Hearthstone players know what's happening. WotC/Hasbro is trying to compete more directly with Hearthstone.

It's many of the established Magic players who aren't seeing the value in Arena.

 

[A Serious Man]

Hearthstone players know what's happening. WotC/Hasbro is trying to compete more directly with Hearthstone.

It's many of the established Magic players who aren't seeing the value in Arena.

I think it's more this. A couple weeks ago the chat basically had a meltdown when they confirmed that the game wouldn't have trading, that's not something HS players would expect. They're a bunch of crusty MTGO vets who don't understand why it needs to be replaced.

 

[bigkrev]

Hearthstone players know what's happening. WotC/Hasbro is trying to compete more directly with Hearthstone.

It's many of the established Magic players who aren't seeing the value in Arena.

Directly porting the Hearthstone model- ~$1.50 booster packs, can disenchant cards for 1/5th of their value- really won't work for Magic, which puts out more than 3 times the amount of cards each year that Hearthstone does (HS is moving to 3 120ish card sets a year, Magic is moving to 4 250ish card sets a year), and requires a player to have 4x copies of a card to have a playset, while hearthstone only requires 2x copies (and only 1x of any "mythic").

They need to have a way to let people get 4x of Mythics to build standard decks without needing to spend thousands of dollars each time a new set comes out. Trading might not be the answer, but they need to have SOMETHING

 

[GregLombardi]

I think it's more this. A couple weeks ago the chat basically had a meltdown when they confirmed that the game wouldn't have trading, that's not something HS players would expect. They're a bunch of crusty MTGO vets who don't understand why it needs to be replaced.

I too agree with this sentiment. Magic Arena is a dream for the casual, and its very difficult to say that with a game as complicated as Magic.

It's interesting in that Arena may teach the world more about Magic: The Gathering than pros / old magic players ever have.

 

[A Serious Man]

Directly porting the Hearthstone model- ~$1.50 booster packs, can disenchant cards for 1/5th of their value- really won't work for Magic, which puts out more than 3 times the amount of cards each year that Hearthstone does (HS is moving to 3 120ish card sets a year, Magic is moving to 4 250ish card sets a year), and requires a player to have 4x copies of a card to have a playset, while hearthstone only requires 2x copies (and only 1x of any "mythic").

They need to have a way to let people get 4x of Mythics to build standard decks without needing to spend thousands of dollars each time a new set comes out.

They've been cagey on the in-game economy but have hinted that they're doing some new things. I could see them doing things like allowing the player to craft a playset instead of just an individual copy of a card, having flex slots (for example, each deck you create can have 10 cards in it you don't own) or rewarding players with specific cards of their choice for matchmaking victories and drafts.

 

[Justin]

I still think the best way to get people into the game is to make the core sets free and make draft/sealed events of the core sets free as well.

Didn't Duels stop giving duplicates of a given card if you already had a playset of it? That would be a good system to carry over.

 

[bigkrev]

Eternal Weekend starts tomorrow, and holy shit, look at this prize for the Old School Magic side tournament

 

[divisionbyzorro]

Eternal Weekend is my favorite weekend for Magic. I love watching high-level Vintage.

 

[ultron87]

I still think the best way to get people into the game is to make the core sets free and make draft/sealed events of the core sets free as well.

Didn't Duels stop giving duplicates of a given card if you already had a playset of it? That would be a good system to carry over.

That was out it worked, yeah. I kind of doubt they'll do that though, since that would mean there'd be a very easy to determine max amount of money you could spend to just get everything, and that limits their expected limitless F2P profits.

 

[Santiako]

Eternal Weekend starts tomorrow, and holy shit, look at this prize for the Old School Magic side tournament

That is fantastic.

 

[bigkrev]

Eternal Weekend is my favorite weekend for Magic. I love watching high-level Vintage.

It's great to watch commentators who don't care what people think, and seeing people who probably only play paper magic a few times a year make lots and lots of mistakes.

Last year, there was a match where a guy played a Chalice for 1, and his opponent used Steady Progress to proliferate an extra counter on it. He then cast multiple 2 drops into his own chalice, missing his own trigger, and Bob Maher on commentary was just loosing his mind more and more each time, calling into question the integrity of the judges when they just gave him multiple warnings.

 

[shrapnelmagnet]

Eternal Weekend starts tomorrow, and holy shit, look at this prize for the Old School Magic side tournament

First thought:

It's interesting in that Arena may teach the world more about Magic: The Gathering than pros / old magic players ever have.

For sure, but I'm not sure this is entirely new as a concept if we consider that many people were onboarded through the various Duels of the Planeswalkers games for the past few years. Anecdotally, I know that myself and a friend of mine know how to play "properly" solely due to it I hope Arena is an order of magnitude more successful than all of those products. I mean, if it full-on sucks or somehow negatively impacts the development of the game, then I guess not? But I don't think that this is going to be case.

 

[Poppy]

Ah, well....

Hearthstone has shroud and people try to target their own shroud creatures all the time. I think this is less about paper vs digital and more that people have trouble realizing shroud is a drawback in a lot of cases.

hearthstone is weird because its pseudo shroud, you can still target them with battlecry abilities

hs rules are strange

 

[Angry Grimace]

can we go back to discussing the current state of Jace's romantic relationships, please

I would be vaguely surprised if Jace suddenly gets all his memories back and immediately ditches his waifu.

 

[OnPoint]

I would be vaguely surprised if Jace suddenly gets all his memories back and immediately ditches his waifu.

Agreed. I think it will add a dynamic of tension but ultimately they will remain on good terms, if not flat out dating. They spent too much time humanizing Vraska (and realigning Jace) to just walk it back.

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

they spent too much time having Lili whip jace to not have a love triangle

 

[Poppy]

they spent too much time having Lili whip jace to not have a love triangle

im just picturing a card art that shows lili and vraska angrily glaring at each other while jace sheepishly tries to tell everyone to calm down in the background

it is simultaneously horrible and amazing

 

[red13th]

he hooked up with Liliana too didn't he? black magic women are fond of Jace

 

[SigmasonicX]

he hooked up with Liliana too didn't he? black magic women are fond of Jace

Ally colors. See Gideon.

 

[ZealousD]

im just picturing a card art that shows lili and vraska angrily glaring at each other while jace sheepishly tries to tell everyone to calm down in the background

it is simultaneously horrible and amazing

I betcha it's in the Unstable set with an Archie-like artstyle.

 

[Angry Grimace]

he hooked up with Liliana too didn't he? black magic women are fond of Jace

Several times, and it was off-handedly revealed in the Kaladesh story he'd been hooking up with her on the sly after the Gatewatch formed until Gideon "No Fun Allowed" Jura got upset that Jace was getting laid.

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

he hooked up with Liliana too didn't he? black magic women are fond of Jace

She honeypotted him but then dated his alter ego for awhile.

im just picturing a card art that shows lili and vraska angrily glaring at each other while jace sheepishly tries to tell everyone to calm down in the background

it is simultaneously horrible and amazing

Why not a tug of war between the two holding his arm with their entire body. Might as well go full camp.

 

[OnPoint]

Pirate Shipping is too good so I am not advocating we should change it, but man... I wish we could use The Love Boat in the thread title somehow

 

[DrArchon]

We do Liliana and Vraska have to fight over Jace? WotC's a progressive company. I see no reason why we can't have some polyamory in MTG.

 

[Justin]

This deck is hilarious
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=SCI9CBy2qH4

Creatures (10)
2 Kitesail Freebooter
2 Reckless Fireweaver
2 Champion of Wits
4 Rampaging Ferocidon

Planeswalkers (3)
3 Saheeli Rai

Spells (8)
2 Fatal Push
4 Opt
2 Censor

Artifacts (13)
4 Dowsing Dagger
4 Prophetic Prism
1 Hierophant's Chalice
4 Panharmonicon

Enchantments (4)
4 Trespasser's Curse

Lands (22)
3 Aether Hub
4 Canyon Slough
4 Dragonskull Summit
4 Fetid Pools
2 Inventors' Fair
2 Island
1 Mountain
2 Swamp

 

[charlequin]

That was out it worked, yeah. I kind of doubt they'll do that though, since that would mean there'd be a very easy to determine max amount of money you could spend to just get everything, and that limits their expected limitless F2P profits.

You can already effectively do this by just auto-dusting everything. CCGs aren't whale-driven, anyway, they're dolphin-driven so it's not really a big cost to have a ceiling on possible expenditures, especially if you have a second virtual ceiling for "premium" versions of cards.

he hooked up with Liliana too didn't he? black magic women are fond of Jace

everyone who's surprised that jace is into goth girls raise your hand pls

 

[Ashodin]

Several times, and it was off-handedly revealed in the Kaladesh story he'd been hooking up with her on the sly after the Gatewatch formed until Gideon "No Fun Allowed" Jura got upset that Jace was getting laid.

Can't fight monsters if you're having sex

 

[Poppy]

gideon is combat-sexual

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

wouldn't surprise me if Gideon made the gatewatch just to keep chandra close, creepy dude.

 

[Justin]

There is a lot going on in this Rosewatta Stone

 

[Ashodin]

We are all born of thick blood sugar