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Media Create Sales: 13 - 19 Mar
- Thread starter cvxfreak
- Start date
A Link to the Past
Banned
Error2k4 said:
Should I really be listening to someone who thinks that Metroid Prime: Hunters and Mega Man: Powered Up are good?
Nah.
A Link to the Past said:
No. Fact is, Nintendogs is not the best game since Waverace that Nintendo is made. Get your head removed from your butt and stop acting like a dumbass. Nintendogs = good game (look @ reviews). MPH = good game (look @ reviews)
Stop throwing lame comments out as arguments. It doesn't help you.
A Link to the Past
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Kevtones said:
Hell, I can't help it if IGN and company are Drones for Nintendo franchises. MPH is a seven, at best.
A Link to the Past
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Error2k4 said:
I played Mega Man, and it sucks.
I doubt this will be any better.
A Link to the Past
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Error2k4 said:
Boohoo, Error can't accept the fact that he likes crap. Want a hug?
imastalker co.
Banned
look, i love all Wave Race, pretty sure i'll like Hunters when i pick it up, and Nintendogs is good for what it is.
you guys on the other hand, are some truly talented people when it comes to gaf.
oh, and that megaman looks pretty fuckin awesome. have you read up on the game at all?
you guys on the other hand, are some truly talented people when it comes to gaf.
oh, and that megaman looks pretty fuckin awesome. have you read up on the game at all?
A Link to the Past
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jj984jj said:
Get your own opinion, you sheep.
A Link to the Past
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Oblivion said:A Link to the Past, come on man, you seemed pretty decent. Just chill, brah.
Oh, and just to put in my own 50 Cent:
shitty non-games > shitty thug sims
Fixed.
Why should FF12 sell better than everything else? Why would it be a crime otherwise? We have no reason to think it's a great game. The demo was dissapointing. Famitsu gave it 40/40, but it also gave Nintendogs the same. Final Fantasy has been trite the last 4 games... The formula, the storylines..
A Link to the Past
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Peru said:
Stay on topic.
A Link to the Past
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Oblivion said:
Well, it's not bad. Not really that much of a game, but at least it's more of a game than Ms. Pac-Man.
lol, Link to the Past you are hillarious my man !!
About the whole FF XII vs AC stuff there is not a chance in a million years that FF XII will get close to AC. Read the 2nd post again, and someone said the same thing- in four weeks time it will be about 2.2m for FF XII and 2.4m for AC and in week 5 FF XII will be down below 50k and AC above 50k and the lead is just going to get larger and larger.
I don't think people quite realise just how immense the sales for AC really are. It's not even the LTD so far that's impressive, it's more the fact that we all know it's easily got another million in it yet, if not more. The legs that we are seeing for these games is bigger than just about anything else there has ever been in Japan. As I said before, even Mario Karts legs, believe it or not, are quite unprecidented.
The comment about Brain Training, I can see both of them also getting very close to 3m so yes, I think
BT + BT2 + GBT > DQ VIII + FF XII
And the revenue issue- this was raised in the other thread and I think it's dodgy territory. If you want to simple compare revenues across different games then you are assuming that your demand - price relationship is linear. That's the only way you can really use this argument. So you are saying that if AC was 2400 yen it would have sold 4.5m by now, if FF XII was 4000 yen it would have done 3.5m in it's first week which I think most of us would agree is simple not true.
Of course a lower price will mean more sales but it will definitely not be a linear thing like you are saying. I doubt FF XII sales would have been much lower had the game been 10000 yen or much higher if it was 6000 yen. The main flaw is that you are assuming that people who bought the game wouldn't have been willing to pay more for AC / BT etc, which I certainly don't agree with.
This lists by week after release and if you cycle through the weeks you see BT2 / AC / Tamogotchi near the top in weeks 8-15 doing the crazy sort of numbers they are and the likes of Nintendogs / BT / GBT climbing up around in weeks 25-40 showing the kind of legs the games have compared to others:
http://everythingandnothing.org.uk/vg/japwk.php?week=10
http://everythingandnothing.org.uk/vg/japwk.php?week=43
About the whole FF XII vs AC stuff there is not a chance in a million years that FF XII will get close to AC. Read the 2nd post again, and someone said the same thing- in four weeks time it will be about 2.2m for FF XII and 2.4m for AC and in week 5 FF XII will be down below 50k and AC above 50k and the lead is just going to get larger and larger.
I don't think people quite realise just how immense the sales for AC really are. It's not even the LTD so far that's impressive, it's more the fact that we all know it's easily got another million in it yet, if not more. The legs that we are seeing for these games is bigger than just about anything else there has ever been in Japan. As I said before, even Mario Karts legs, believe it or not, are quite unprecidented.
The comment about Brain Training, I can see both of them also getting very close to 3m so yes, I think
BT + BT2 + GBT > DQ VIII + FF XII
And the revenue issue- this was raised in the other thread and I think it's dodgy territory. If you want to simple compare revenues across different games then you are assuming that your demand - price relationship is linear. That's the only way you can really use this argument. So you are saying that if AC was 2400 yen it would have sold 4.5m by now, if FF XII was 4000 yen it would have done 3.5m in it's first week which I think most of us would agree is simple not true.
Of course a lower price will mean more sales but it will definitely not be a linear thing like you are saying. I doubt FF XII sales would have been much lower had the game been 10000 yen or much higher if it was 6000 yen. The main flaw is that you are assuming that people who bought the game wouldn't have been willing to pay more for AC / BT etc, which I certainly don't agree with.
This lists by week after release and if you cycle through the weeks you see BT2 / AC / Tamogotchi near the top in weeks 8-15 doing the crazy sort of numbers they are and the likes of Nintendogs / BT / GBT climbing up around in weeks 25-40 showing the kind of legs the games have compared to others:
http://everythingandnothing.org.uk/vg/japwk.php?week=10
http://everythingandnothing.org.uk/vg/japwk.php?week=43
ioi said:Lol, in there securing the topic
Well I'm not getting the site at the mo, but we have FF XII on 1,764,000
And I don't wanna keep blowing my own trumpet but I'm sure i said something like:
week 1 1750k
week 2 250k
week 3 100k
week 4 70k
and getting close-ish (2.2m ish) to AC before dropping below it and AC extending the lead again.
And pretty much idential to FF X
This 2 weeks FF XII will sell more. (400 -> 250 IMO) And I expect that this FF has good legs, so it can get very close to 3m. (IMO again)
Majmun
Member
More sales != more quality?
I know for sure that Animal Crossing isn't GOTY material. Unlike FFXII. Who cares wich one sells more?
Anyway...
Just like every other big RPG, I expect FFXII to slip down the chart very fast. Early adopters are always the biggest userbase of an FF title.
I know for sure that Animal Crossing isn't GOTY material. Unlike FFXII. Who cares wich one sells more?
Anyway...
Just like every other big RPG, I expect FFXII to slip down the chart very fast. Early adopters are always the biggest userbase of an FF title.
ioi said:
To ignore the revenue issue is to ignore the entire process of tracking sales altogether. All professionals take revenue into account, which is why NPD lists FIRST by dollars made THEN by actual units sold. If you want to completely ignore that issue, then you should just stop bothering with data collection. It's understandable that when it comes to Japanese games it's way harder to get these numbers, but to undermine it by shrugging it off just shows you're only trying to do a half-assed data collection job and whining about people not caring about all the "hard work" you put it. Guess what, we don't care. You're better off not doing it. No one is going to thank you for trying.
fly high ~ayunite~
Member
Just thinking about the two (?) Final Fantasy titles coming out on the DS this year..
Final Fantasy + DS = $$$$$$$ (replace with the yen symbol..etc..)
Final Fantasy + DS = $$$$$$$ (replace with the yen symbol..etc..)
D
Deleted member 1235
Unconfirmed Member
Amir0x said:
err, yes they can.
here:
IMO the world is flat
IMO NAMBLA is a good idea
IMO People on the bus want to look at my wang
saying "you can't tell me I'm wrong because it's MY OPINION" is just something stupid people say.
duckroll said:To ignore the revenue issue is to ignore the entire process of tracking sales altogether. All professionals take revenue into account, which is why NPD lists FIRST by dollars made THEN by actual units sold. If you want to completely ignore that issue, then you should just stop bothering with data collection. It's understandable that when it comes to Japanese games it's way harder to get these numbers, but to undermine it by shrugging it off just shows you're only trying to do a half-assed data collection job and whining about people not caring about all the "hard work" you put it. Guess what, we don't care. You're better off not doing it. No one is going to thank you for trying.
Have I done something to upset you?
I'm not saying we should ignore revenue but units sold is more of a reflection on how well a title has done than the amount of revenue it has generated in my opinion since the cost of the game (especially in Japan) seems to have a small effect on how much it sells so people are obviously willing to pay whatever to get the game, whether it is 4800 yen or 8000 yen.
If game A was 4000 yen and sold 2 million and game B was 8000 yen and sold a million are you saying both games are as successful as one another?
And on your other comment I don't expect people to "care" or "thank me" or anything else. I just find it annoying when I post data and immediately get accused of making it up or whatever, with no basis. That's the problem I have with some of the people on here. If you don't like my comments and opinions then that's fair enough, but to say that the data itself is wrong when it comes directly from the sources it does is just crazy!
ioi said:
When you still continue to claim and list SHIPMENT figures as TOTAL SALES, it's not crazy at all. Think about that.
Let's assume game A shipped 3 million and sold 2.5 million over 3 months. 5 years later, you then claim that total sales should be 3 million because those 500k would have been sold in these 5 years.
Here are the factors you have failed to include:
a) What if those 500k were sold at as low as 10 dollars each as clearance, years after the release?
b) With a market as large as Japan as well as many import stores internationally, is it that hard to believe that there might still be stock in various places, especially seeing as how the product is not considered "rare" or in-demand at this point?
It is not entirely the numbers that we are criticizing, merely how you are presenting real numbers in a totally naive and inconsequencial way which misinterpretates them based on your opinion which is affected by your lack of understanding of the factual numbers being presented.
Ok, so you've conceded about the revenue thing then?
No, no, no, no, no!! You're not listening.
What I'm saying is that the game hasn't sold 2.5m over 3 months, it has likely sold more like 2.9m and the tracking service have under-represented it.
Nobody actually knows how many copies of the game have been sold, that's the WHOLE POINT HERE. All we have are a number of conflicting reports from polling a proportion of retailers and extrapolating the figures up. THIS IS WHERE THE INACCURACIES LIE.
Why we have to bring the shipment debate up again is just beyond me, but hey. You obviously have no idea what you are talking about and think you do which is quite scary.
a) What if they were? They would still be included in the weekly tracking by Famitsu / MC etc so what difference would this make? I don't see how this is relevant at all.
b) So again you think that 500,000 copies of a game released 5 years ago could possibly be sitting on shop shelves now? WOW. Those publishers must be right dumbasses making 3m copies of a game they have no chance of selling. Who's gonna foot that bill, the retailers? They must be the stupid ones then. "Right, you know that Final Fantasy VII game we haven't sold a copy of for 6 months, let's go and order a couple of thousand in".
Nothing I present is naive. This is the entire point. The naive approach is "Media Create say that 1,764,266 copies of Final Fantasy XII were sold last week so that's how many were sold".
Rubbish. Utter garbage. Why do Dengeki think that 1.817m were sold? Why do Famitsu think that another number were sold? Because they are all WRONG.
They ESTIMATE the data from the sample of retailers that they cover and extrapolate up. Media Create may think they cover 50% of retailers and across those they sold 882,133 copies of FF XII so they just double it up and that's their number. Dengeki may only poll 30% but some of their retailers may have sold more than the "average" and so skew the number upwards a bit. The whole thing is a big guessing game. Obviously it is more involved than my trivial example, but you get the idea.
I don't understand what it is that you are trying to say really, that we should blindly take the numbers that one tracking service gives us as fact?
The only numbers that we know are "fact" are the publisher numbers. Maybe not for current games as there will obviously be a large difference between how many have been shipped and sold but for old games that have stopped selling then that is how many were made, and that is a far far more accurate picture of how many have been sold than any other data we have, until we get to a stage where a tracking service covers 100% of retailers and every single copy sold is know.
duckroll said:
No, no, no, no, no!! You're not listening.
What I'm saying is that the game hasn't sold 2.5m over 3 months, it has likely sold more like 2.9m and the tracking service have under-represented it.
Nobody actually knows how many copies of the game have been sold, that's the WHOLE POINT HERE. All we have are a number of conflicting reports from polling a proportion of retailers and extrapolating the figures up. THIS IS WHERE THE INACCURACIES LIE.
duckroll said:
Why we have to bring the shipment debate up again is just beyond me, but hey. You obviously have no idea what you are talking about and think you do which is quite scary.
a) What if they were? They would still be included in the weekly tracking by Famitsu / MC etc so what difference would this make? I don't see how this is relevant at all.
b) So again you think that 500,000 copies of a game released 5 years ago could possibly be sitting on shop shelves now? WOW. Those publishers must be right dumbasses making 3m copies of a game they have no chance of selling. Who's gonna foot that bill, the retailers? They must be the stupid ones then. "Right, you know that Final Fantasy VII game we haven't sold a copy of for 6 months, let's go and order a couple of thousand in".
Nothing I present is naive. This is the entire point. The naive approach is "Media Create say that 1,764,266 copies of Final Fantasy XII were sold last week so that's how many were sold".
Rubbish. Utter garbage. Why do Dengeki think that 1.817m were sold? Why do Famitsu think that another number were sold? Because they are all WRONG.
They ESTIMATE the data from the sample of retailers that they cover and extrapolate up. Media Create may think they cover 50% of retailers and across those they sold 882,133 copies of FF XII so they just double it up and that's their number. Dengeki may only poll 30% but some of their retailers may have sold more than the "average" and so skew the number upwards a bit. The whole thing is a big guessing game. Obviously it is more involved than my trivial example, but you get the idea.
I don't understand what it is that you are trying to say really, that we should blindly take the numbers that one tracking service gives us as fact?
The only numbers that we know are "fact" are the publisher numbers. Maybe not for current games as there will obviously be a large difference between how many have been shipped and sold but for old games that have stopped selling then that is how many were made, and that is a far far more accurate picture of how many have been sold than any other data we have, until we get to a stage where a tracking service covers 100% of retailers and every single copy sold is know.
duckroll said:
Hrm, what does that have to do with anything? One of the primary reasons so many titles have had such strong legs/sales for PS2 is the greatest hits program. Sure they're $20 and not $10, but the fact remains that games like Ace Combat 4 and even Gran Turismo 3 have had their sales inflated as much as 5 and 10 times over due to the lower price, but that doesn't prevent them from being listed as having sold x number of units.
Luigi's Mansion for GameCube is another title that's benefited greatly from this, but it's moving of 1.7 million (or whatever it is) copies seems a lot more impressive than a game that sells 750k units at full-price.
jarrod said:
I still can't believe that people think that sales would be better on the PSP. Outside of a handful of 3rd party games they have sold like shit on BOTH platforms. The PSP will not magically boost 3rd party sales in Japan as good games on that system have been bombing left and right. Its just that they don't appear in the top 50 so people think that no games are getting released on it.
If anybody had paid attention to the sales of GBA games and before anybody with a brain could tell you that besides a few high profile 3rd party games, $9.99 games at TRU, and licensed games nobody buys anything else besides 1st party games. Even thinking back to the Game Gear I didn't have much other than 1st party games.
Well japanese PSP software sales consitst of 70%+ third party sales (3.6 mill+ / 5.1 mil) and in the US its about the same as of Janaury 06(7.5~ mil / 11~ million)
The reason people think third parties cant sell on handhelds is becuase nintendo has been the only handheld force for the past 15 years, and we all know thrid party + nintendo = BOMB
PSP is proving that third parties can sell on handhelds, atleast outside of Japan.
The reason people think third parties cant sell on handhelds is becuase nintendo has been the only handheld force for the past 15 years, and we all know thrid party + nintendo = BOMB
PSP is proving that third parties can sell on handhelds, atleast outside of Japan.
Red Blaster
Member
This thread is AWESOME.
Frankfurter
Member
Monorojo said:
Yeah ... Tamagotchi DS says hi for the 1000th time.
Magicpaint
Member
Monorojo said:
And where are these monster PSP numbers? besides Monster Hunter Portable and in the west... EA and GTA? Exception to the rule as well?
Frankfurter
Member
Monorojo said:
Going by that logic the PS2 Final Fantasies, Dragon Quests, Gundams, GTAs etc. are also "exception to the rule" - every thursday is bombing day in Japan for a few (at the end of the year: a few dozen) PS2 games.
How about Japanese 3rd party sales as of April 2005?Monorojo said:
Not really, PSP has yet to even see a single 3rd party million seller in any one region while DS has one and GBA had more than Xbox and GameCube combined. Capcom, SEGA, THQ, Konami, Atari, Electronic Arts, Videndi Universal, Activision, Square Enix and Namco Bandai have all reported multiple million sellers on Nintendo handhelds since 2000 actually. On PlayStation handhelds, only Rockstar can claim a million seller, and then it was a fully featured exclusive in the biggest franchise this generation (which routinely breaks 10 million on PS2).Monorojo said:
Magicpaint
Member
RaijinFY said:
Slime Mori Mori 2 and Mushiking were very similar to their GBA counterparts though, infact the DS Mushiking was just a touch screen version of the game iirc. Factor in these and the numbers are at least decent. Not the Third Party = BOMB, that Mono so desperately wants to preach in every media create thread.
Are Sangoku Musou, Rockman, Rockman X, Katamari, Suikoden, Initial D, Metal Gear and Valkyrie Profile popular franchises? Why couldn't any of them break 200k on PSP? Hell, only 2 of them broke 100k and most can't even break 50k. :/RaijinFY said:
It's not like PSP's lacking in popular brands or a full release schedule, hell it's gotten a significantly better 3rd party push in Japan than any other non-FC/PS/GB platform in history. And yet, 3rd party sales continue to perpetually decline...
AdmiralViscen
Banned
jarrod said:
B-b-b-b-b-b-b-ut 70%! They have 70% share! Winnar!
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