N30RYU
Member
Wasted in gamepass you mean?
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No Xbox fan should be hurt by Xbox expanding to more devices only the trolls & warriors will be hurt
- Thread starter onQ123
- Start date
Majormaxxx
Member
Does this need explaining? Is everyone here 13? I thought this place was filled with millennial geezers?
Radical_3d
Member
Funny how he didn’t respond to this.
SpecialAgentZ
Member
I hope this means the end of platform restricted multiplayer. Crossplay should be mandatory across platforms, with options for the player to filter the platforms they want to play with.
I know it's not happening anytime soon, but...
I know it's not happening anytime soon, but...
Why buy an Xbox to play Halo when I could buy a PS and play Halo and God of War?
Killjoy-NL
Member
But what if Sony is going to return to exclusivity again and only release GaaS on PC?
Crayon
Member
Then the ps fanboys would be very happy lol. The PC fanboys would be salty. But neither could ever be sure it won't happen again.
Crayon
Member
Day one releases might.
FeralEcho
Member
I feel you.I personally own all 3 consoles and don't even game on PC.
The Sum of Zero
Member
Yeah people are freaking out waaaaay too much.
DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
Tbh, I don't want to lose the consoles but as long as they move the full account over to xbox pc I'll be fine.
It was either this or scrap day one releases on gamespass. I’d have preferred the former as I find it value destructive, making the types of games I like (one and done single player stories) less viable. But the latter allows microsoft to remain viable.
For games I have mild interest in I’ll play on gamespass on seriesX, those I am actually interested in I’ll buy on ps5
win win, for both me and microsoft.
For games I have mild interest in I’ll play on gamespass on seriesX, those I am actually interested in I’ll buy on ps5
win win, for both me and microsoft.
YOU PC BRO?!
Gold Member
If the rumours are indeed true and Microsoft are going multiplatform then there is simply no point in owning an Xbox console. Phil Spencer will have officially ran the Xbox brand into the ground.
Lets recap some of the decisions that brought us here...
> Series console launch featured the worst 1st party software line-up in Xbox history
> Lack of identity, unassuming inoffensive box
> No new gamepad innovation
> Initial mandatory cross-gen support for new releases
> Worst console name of all time 'Series'
> Few compelling 1st party exclusives
> No console only exclusives
> Simultaneous release of titles on Xbox/PC
> No system selling software line-up, distinct lack of quality
> Hardware performance tiers i.e. Series S/Series X
> Underutilised next-gen hardware features i.e. SFS, DirectML, VRS2
> Adorably all digital future no-one wants, attempts to lock users into their ecosystem
> General lack of confidence and poor overall communication
Combined, each of these has contributed to the demise of Xbox. Apparently, Xbox and Microsoft brass are confused by the low console sales. The reality is that Microsoft couldn't have done more to push consumers away if they were trying. Its time for a leadership shakeup. Phil Spencer has failed more spectacularly than any of his predecessors.
Lets recap some of the decisions that brought us here...
> Series console launch featured the worst 1st party software line-up in Xbox history
> Lack of identity, unassuming inoffensive box
> No new gamepad innovation
> Initial mandatory cross-gen support for new releases
> Worst console name of all time 'Series'
> Few compelling 1st party exclusives
> No console only exclusives
> Simultaneous release of titles on Xbox/PC
> No system selling software line-up, distinct lack of quality
> Hardware performance tiers i.e. Series S/Series X
> Underutilised next-gen hardware features i.e. SFS, DirectML, VRS2
> Adorably all digital future no-one wants, attempts to lock users into their ecosystem
> General lack of confidence and poor overall communication
Combined, each of these has contributed to the demise of Xbox. Apparently, Xbox and Microsoft brass are confused by the low console sales. The reality is that Microsoft couldn't have done more to push consumers away if they were trying. Its time for a leadership shakeup. Phil Spencer has failed more spectacularly than any of his predecessors.
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MonkeyClaw36
Banned
So much nonsense in 2 sentences. Shill.
digoutyoursoul
Member
You fail to recognise the reasons why Xbox is in the position it’s in. No mention whatsoever of the management that has overseen all this.
And it’s pretty arrogant and disingenuous to claim it’s only trolls and warriors are disappointed.
I don’t think you are being sincere at all
I think you’re wrong.
I own both consoles but I prefer my Xbox for multiplats and I use my ps5 only for exclusives.
My issue is I’ve spent the last 5+ years building my digital library which I now see as pointless and a waste of money because now why wouldn’t I just main the PlayStation?
I own both consoles but I prefer my Xbox for multiplats and I use my ps5 only for exclusives.
My issue is I’ve spent the last 5+ years building my digital library which I now see as pointless and a waste of money because now why wouldn’t I just main the PlayStation?
Badlucktroll
Member
Surely this is a bit better than Sony and Nintendo defeated and a Microsoft monopoly in place
LiquidMetal14
hide your water-based mammals
With hurt long time
Mr.Phoenix
Member
I get that, but that wasn't the point of me saying that. Just pointing out that its one thing for things to be bad because Xbox is doing badly, and its another for them to be bad because well... its officially over. As bad as Xbox were doing, we cannot deny that their being there or around has kept Sony honest for the most part. And has forced them to do things that ultimately work for the consumer's best interest.
And that's the thing... do you really believe that's how it would go? A $600 PS3 was only "bad" because there was a $400 Xbox. If sony knows they are the only ones in the 4K market as far as consoles go, absolutely nothing stops them from making a $800 console, knowing fully well that in the first two years, they sell at best 10-15M of them, and let the price drop and as such its adoption improve over the next 3-4 years; if they are the only ones, what have they got to fear? A more Nintendo-like approach to software pricing meaning fewer discounts? Slower addition of games to PS+?
I think we would be remiss to not consider everything that there being an Xbox didn't just make Sony do, but prevented them from doing.
MonkeyClaw36
Banned
Please remove the mandatory cross gen since this also applies to PS5. It's not a corporate thing.
PaintTinJr
Member
What about the scenario where Epic (and middleware companies) want to save money and stop supporting potentially dead platform hardware, and other 3rd party publishers start focusing more on repairing their relationship with Nintendo and focus on PS5/Switch/2 and start dropping Xbox? meaning less games coming to xbox hardware in future.
And what about the gamers that are at the mercy of other socioeconomic issues and now can't even get a good value trade-in on their cheaper entry xbox to eat some of the cost of getting in late on the PlayStation platform?
Xbox doing a Sega comes at a huge cost to those that were previous stakeholders, and IMO they have every right be unhappy when the company that failed has been flush with $90b in publisher buyout money just 6months earlier, and yet it is them as stakeholders taking the big hit.
Freelance Yakuza
Member
I believe there is a valid concern that Xbox may abandon consoles, and in this scenario, people who have purchased games in the Microsoft Store should be concerned about their libraries.
Like, okay, the service will continue, but where will I play the games I've already bought in the next generation?
These people acquired the games believing that there will be a new Xbox that will be backward compatible.
Like, okay, the service will continue, but where will I play the games I've already bought in the next generation?
These people acquired the games believing that there will be a new Xbox that will be backward compatible.
RoboFu
One of the green rats
lol right.
people here care more about fanboy warring than their own families. " quiet Timmy !! .. state of play is own...
PaintTinJr
Member
The PS3 was sold at a huge loss at $600 as a result of timescales/yields/redesigns forced upon them by bottomless pit money Microsoft launching two consoles in a 3-4year span and the second of which was early requiring them to pay for unprecedented failures when they gave it a parity clock boost when the PS3 launched, and all while Xbox were losing billions on hardware subsidy to compete with PlayStation turning a profit on hardware after 20m sales each gen.
PlayStations are, or have been custom silicon since the start, trying to push gaming forward by providing features that normally existed only at beyond consumer grade price points. and yet you are framing it that it was their fault they didn't have time to get good yields for a dual Cell BE PS3 with a 2D GPU and 512MB of unified XDR memory, as was the original design, because they were competing against a company that had more time via relative infinite money, and got trapped dealing with Nvidia with everything else going wrong for them and had to charge $600, while still losing money.
D
Deleted member 848825
Unconfirmed Member
Positive spin on this shitshow? Really? OP, let me spell it out for you. If the continued mismanagement of Xbox, leads to even fewer console sales, then we run the risk of not even having a console in the future. So anyone with a digital library has every right to be concerned. And that's before we get onto the atrocious handling of this from a comms perspective. I saw all of this coming a mile off and stopped putting money into Xbox a couple of years ago. But other Xbox users with a digital library have every right to be disappointed in the Xbox management.
The only good that comes out of this, is having even less need to be part of Xbox's shitty business antics and being able to just go PS5 for everything.
The only good that comes out of this, is having even less need to be part of Xbox's shitty business antics and being able to just go PS5 for everything.
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Mr.Phoenix
Member
Again... think about it.
I don't know how you can read what I have said and arrive at this conclusion. You sure you are talking to me?
I am "framing" it like, competition is good. And it keeps people honest.
Ok, here is a scenario. The PS5 supposedly had a BOM of around $450 back in 2020. Probably means that at $500, Sony was at best just breaking even on every console sold. The only reason they come in at that break-even price, or even that loss-leading price point, is because they always had some other rival that would be doing the exact same thing. So what happens now, say the PS6 has a BOM of $600. Why would Sony sell it for $500? He3ll... why would they not sell it for $700. If they are the only ones there, and if even at $700 it would be impossible to build a PC of equivalent specs at that price? Like that's the whole point, they are willing to lose money on their hardware because they had to. Now, they may not have that problem anymore.
Or look at PS+ extra/premium, you think Sony ever does that if MS didn't do gamepass? I don't know about you, but for the $100ish I pay for PS+ Extra each year, I download more than 10 games on it each year, games that I would have otherwise had to pay for that would have cost more definately more than whatever PS+ cost me. Which thankfully means now I only have to spend $70 on the two or three best of the best games I simply cannot wait to play each year too.
Borowski_1
Member
BlackTron
Member
There aren't enough PS fans obsessed with Abby's arms to support Sony's business if their only console is $700. Even Spider-Man can't move that.
It would just pave the way for Nintendo to slay even harder with their strategy. Future handhelds won't be as humorously or noticeably crappy compared to consoles as Switch 1 was, which still held its own with the pittance it was given.
Zuzu
Member
I disagree and there is good reason for Xbots to be concerned. With Xbox releasing games on Playstation & Switch then there is far less incentive to buy Xbox consoles.
The reduction of Xbox console sales will most likely eventually lead to closing of their hardware division completely and the closing of the Xbox store and probably the closing of Gamepass. The consequences could be the loss of our digital libraries and the loss of the consoles themselves which have some perks over the PS5 & Switch that us Xbox fans like. Sony will also have far less competition and really no direct competition. This could have some pretty unsavoury consequences longterm.
Also without the Xbox hardware and accessories, Gamepass and the Xbox store Microsoft will sink or swim on how successful they are as a third party publisher. Their track record in delivering great games over the last few years is bad. Just remember: Halo Infinite, Crackdown 3, Redfall, Starfield, Forza Motorsport 2023, Halo 5, Master Chief Collection and the rather poor output of Rare etc. Even Gears of War 4 & 5 are a step down from past games in the series. Who knows if they'll be able to produce good enough games consistently to keep all those game studios afloat. We could see a lot of those studios axed over the next 10-15 years given the history of Xbox studio mismanagement.
People saying that no one made a big fuss over Xbox games being released on PC aren't thinking it through. First of all there has been a fuss made of Xbox games being released day & date on PC. I think it did devalue the console and the brand. But furthermore, PC is arguably a significantly different audience than the console audience. People who are console only players won't move to the PC for various reasons (and vice versa) and so releasing first party games on PC is not as directly detrimental to the console as releasing the games on the Playstation which is is the direct competitor to Xbox.
The reduction of Xbox console sales will most likely eventually lead to closing of their hardware division completely and the closing of the Xbox store and probably the closing of Gamepass. The consequences could be the loss of our digital libraries and the loss of the consoles themselves which have some perks over the PS5 & Switch that us Xbox fans like. Sony will also have far less competition and really no direct competition. This could have some pretty unsavoury consequences longterm.
Also without the Xbox hardware and accessories, Gamepass and the Xbox store Microsoft will sink or swim on how successful they are as a third party publisher. Their track record in delivering great games over the last few years is bad. Just remember: Halo Infinite, Crackdown 3, Redfall, Starfield, Forza Motorsport 2023, Halo 5, Master Chief Collection and the rather poor output of Rare etc. Even Gears of War 4 & 5 are a step down from past games in the series. Who knows if they'll be able to produce good enough games consistently to keep all those game studios afloat. We could see a lot of those studios axed over the next 10-15 years given the history of Xbox studio mismanagement.
People saying that no one made a big fuss over Xbox games being released on PC aren't thinking it through. First of all there has been a fuss made of Xbox games being released day & date on PC. I think it did devalue the console and the brand. But furthermore, PC is arguably a significantly different audience than the console audience. People who are console only players won't move to the PC for various reasons (and vice versa) and so releasing first party games on PC is not as directly detrimental to the console as releasing the games on the Playstation which is is the direct competitor to Xbox.
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SenkiDala
Member
But that's not the problem, that many franchises would die, of course they're doing the right move and of course games costs more and more and MS has been searching a way to make money without raising the prices of games (because gamers won't buy a 90$ game), costs of workers, raw material, manufacturing, transportation, electricity, everything rose +++, also the cost of making a AAA in 2002 isn't comparable to a AAA in 2024, we all know that.
Publishers try so many ways to make more money, DLCs (for the best and the worst), season pass, MS and Sony try sub services, but nothing seem to be enough to cover some dev costs. Sony can survive all these because they are leaders, by far, Nintendo too, but MS don't sell consoles, they have great consoles and had some nice exclusives, great other exclusives to come but nothing seem to sell Xbox consoles. Starfield had to be the game that unblocked all the situation for MS but it didn't, at all.
So they come to this extreme decision, that seem rough at first but that is indeed the only decision to make.
No no, the problem is not that, many of us here are hardcore gamers, in a sense that if we want Zelda we buy a Switch, if we want Horizon we buy a PS5 and if we want Halo we buy an Xbox.
But we must remember that most of the gaming market don't buy all consoles, 99,9% of gamers just get 1 console per gen, and if they want to go from PS to Xbox or Xbox to PS to they sell their console to buy the other.
And for many Xbox fans who decided to buy the Xbox, to chose this one and then decide to not get the PS5, they feel "betrayed", they chose the Xbox why ? For the exclusives to come, thinking "I want Starfield, HiFi Rush, Indy more than Spidey2, HFW, GT7" and now they figure out that if they bought the PS5 they'd have Starfield, HiFi Rush, Indy AND ALSO all the PS5 exclusives.
That obviously create quite the frustration. And good luck to MS to find the right words to explain this. Even if PS players need to way 1 or 2 years to get Indy or Starfield and more, they'll obviously rather wait than buying two 500$ consoles.
DryvBy
Member
That's why Xbox fans are worried. Understandably because consoles are now in ecosystems with digital libraries, friends lists, profile managements, achievements and tons of other crap.
I grew up when the Dreamcast died and it was very disappointing. It felt like I wasted my money but it also felt like the core reason I bought a Dreamcast (arcade games) wouldn't transfer to other platforms.
GulfCoastZilla
Member
Listen I’ve been a life long Xbox person, and I got a great 4-6 year of dirt cheap gaming through Gamepass that has saved me thousands of dollars, but this move WILL kill their hardware and I’m not spending a cent more in their ecosystem without knowing their is a solid non cloud based plan in place.
But also after ten years of missing the good games PlayStation has put out while hanging on the “the games are coming” promise Xbox has been giving for years at this point. It’s time to move on. XSX is being given to one of the kids to be a Fortnite machine, I just ordered a ps5 slim digital and I’m going to feel secure in my library staying there going forward. (Because let’s keep it real I haven’t purchased games thanks to Gamepass for years now, only COD)
But also after ten years of missing the good games PlayStation has put out while hanging on the “the games are coming” promise Xbox has been giving for years at this point. It’s time to move on. XSX is being given to one of the kids to be a Fortnite machine, I just ordered a ps5 slim digital and I’m going to feel secure in my library staying there going forward. (Because let’s keep it real I haven’t purchased games thanks to Gamepass for years now, only COD)
digoutyoursoul
Member
That’s what the hooker in full metal jacket said
SportsFan581
Member
Unfortunately, the buying public doesn't lack foresight to this degree. Regardless, it isn't up to Xbox users to decide how things go, we are as trapped in the tide as anyone else (Sony users as well).
I don't think this move would be a positive for anyone (Xbox or Sony users long-term), the knock-on effects would be far more negative than the positives brought forward by it. I think that Sony fans that are happy with this rumor have failed to take a close look at the state of things closer to home lately, and the primary reasoning/motivations behind most of the things they have liked best about PS in the past. But, clearly my opinion is different from the OPs. It is what it is.
At any rate, I'm just looking forward to enjoying Hellblade and the games talked about at the developer direct. I'll certainly be adding plenty of points to the old gamer score in 2024.
I don't think this move would be a positive for anyone (Xbox or Sony users long-term), the knock-on effects would be far more negative than the positives brought forward by it. I think that Sony fans that are happy with this rumor have failed to take a close look at the state of things closer to home lately, and the primary reasoning/motivations behind most of the things they have liked best about PS in the past. But, clearly my opinion is different from the OPs. It is what it is.
At any rate, I'm just looking forward to enjoying Hellblade and the games talked about at the developer direct. I'll certainly be adding plenty of points to the old gamer score in 2024.
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DarthPutin
Member
I find it a bit hypocritical and holier-than-thou to shame people for being a little pissed and upset. 1st of all, Sony and Nintendo fans would not like it either (as evidenced by initial drama around PC ports).
Secondly, platform holders spent a lof of time conditioning their customers to see exclusive games as their USP, a reason to pick their platform over others. Even purely coldly and practically thinking, if you can buy PS5 and get PS5 games + most of XBOX games, vs. buying XBOX and ONLY getting XBOX games, money-conscious customer has every right not to be too happy about not having all the information beforehand. Maybe you just bought another console just for Starfield, and now a month later it's coming to PS5 you already had?..
For XBOX fans who waited for years for the Promised Land of new exclusives every quarter, to have those exclusives go to other consoles right at the cusp of it has a certain bitter age, lets be real. And it were platform holders who started using exclusives, their own or money-hatted, to attract customers, so they might as well deal with fallout.
Now, if you're DISTRAUGHT or something, you might need to reconsider your priorities and take a break, but why would people be happy about picking 500 USD console with less exclusives?
We'll see what MS will announce, I guess. How many games they will port and how long is exlusive period.
People in XBOX threads are also worried that lessened demand for consoles might lead to loss of 3d party support. Not sure how realistic it is, at least in a short term, but maybe?..
Secondly, platform holders spent a lof of time conditioning their customers to see exclusive games as their USP, a reason to pick their platform over others. Even purely coldly and practically thinking, if you can buy PS5 and get PS5 games + most of XBOX games, vs. buying XBOX and ONLY getting XBOX games, money-conscious customer has every right not to be too happy about not having all the information beforehand. Maybe you just bought another console just for Starfield, and now a month later it's coming to PS5 you already had?..
For XBOX fans who waited for years for the Promised Land of new exclusives every quarter, to have those exclusives go to other consoles right at the cusp of it has a certain bitter age, lets be real. And it were platform holders who started using exclusives, their own or money-hatted, to attract customers, so they might as well deal with fallout.
Now, if you're DISTRAUGHT or something, you might need to reconsider your priorities and take a break, but why would people be happy about picking 500 USD console with less exclusives?
We'll see what MS will announce, I guess. How many games they will port and how long is exlusive period.
People in XBOX threads are also worried that lessened demand for consoles might lead to loss of 3d party support. Not sure how realistic it is, at least in a short term, but maybe?..
daclynk
Member
Why? It's my favorite console and sure I was bummed out as well. But my Dreamcasts (I've got 3 lol) still all work. I've got countless accessoires and they all still work (DDR, Fishing Rod, Guns etc.) Absolutely nothing is lost.
Except for Power Stone, I can't recall any DC bangers that did not eventually get an Xbox or PS release. If anything, they did a good job making sure that those titles were available on newer consoles even after the DC's downfall.
Consoles (even more so now) are completely irrelevant outside of a preferred UI or controller or ... design i guess?
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daclynk
Member
Laptop1991
Member
I agree with the OP, games should always come first and be of a higher quality than we are getting nowadays.
Miyazaki’s Slave
Gold Member
No company owes anyone backwards compatibility. It is in their best interest, yes, they can build a strong user base that continues to come back with future hardware releases, but it is not owed or implied.
All the hardware that I have acquired in the last 40 years of my life still works and so do my games (except pole position....you can die in a fire pole position). So you should still be able to access the content you purchased on the device you purchased it for.
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lefty1117
Gold Member
Well, for me the value in xbox has been the entire ecosystem, the backwards compatibility, interoperability with PC, etc. Personally I like the console hardware and the controller is great, but if "Xbox" is going to exist on other devices with my same access to all my stuff, I'm good with that.
