Support NeoGAF

[Men_in_Boxes]

If the market was asking for them, the completion rate of single player games would not be so low. The market does not have an option. If you want to play the new God of War game, then you have to suffer through the tedious parts. Do you understand that people can play games, enjoy part of them and still acknowledge they are bloated because there is no other option?

That's like saying "The state lottery is a failure because most people don't win."

Traditional SP games are deemed success or failure based on their purchase rates, not their completion rates. The market enjoys BUYING God of War Ragnarok (success), but the market is blind to how quickly they bore of God of War Ragnarok (irrelevant).

The market clearly wants to spend money on bigger, larger, longer games. The top 10 best selling SP games every year show this.

That's not the point I'm making. Remasters take time and money. That time and money could be spent on supporting development of the missing games and therefore expedite delivery. Again, wrong and not even the same point. Are you saying that if those people and resources were moved to support the development of a new ip, it would not be quicker than if they were not?

It's slightly more complicated than you realize. The smaller teams that work on Remasters are often not capable of meaningfully working on new projects. Their time is more effectively spent on Remasters.

No, its not too early. If your main creative is away from the studio then it will obviously affect development, decision making etc. I don't care if the show was successful. This discussion is about if taking away the lead creative impact the ability and pace of making a game.

How many hours did Niel Druckman spend on The Last of Us TV show?

We have such little information that it's just as easy to fabricate a narrative suggesting his work on the HBO show improved Naughty Dogs next game. It's way too early to be making such judgements.

Again, wrong. If Naughty Dog employees were being used to create Factions, and they were taken away from working on the single player ip, then the single player ip would take longer. Do you disagree with the logic?

What is the cancellation rates of projects in pre production in the games industry? How many people worked on Factions 2? Will the lessons learned on Factions 2 be used to improve games built at Naughty Dog going forward? If we can't answer such basic and important questions like that then coming to a hard conclusion is absurd.

If you're going to invent shit talking points then I'm not bothering replying to you again.

I think it's important to correct illogical thinking. Echo chambers of irrational thought can be cured through adversarial discussion. Educational and fun. Win win.

 

[R3EUIL]

I've heard a lot of nonsense around here. Do you remember that PlayStation, from 2013 to 2016, released almost nothing significant compared to 2021-2014? since the beginning of the generation, people have complained about these long game developments, but it seems obvious that games take time, especially big games with good technical quality. I also don't understand the comparisons with Fromsoft, it's literally the worst example: it's the same games with a few improvements and a lot of filler content, basically a glorified Ubisoft.

 

[Ass of Can Whooping]

And what are Playstation Studios?
They have more studios and more people.
This excuse doesn't work

Are you even aware of how many games they've released in the last 5 years?

 

[nial]

And what are Playstation Studios?

A global operation that oversees three different divisions across America, Japan and UK. These can have their own internal studio departments (Team Asobi and XDEV for SIE JP, Santa Monica Studio, San Diego Studio, Bend Studio and XDEV for SIE CA, and XDEV for SIEE), and development subsidiaries (Polyphony Digital, Naughty Dog, Guerrilla Games, etc. You name them).
Capcom does not function like this, at all.

They have more studios and more people.
This excuse doesn't work

And they release more games as well?
Just counting internally-developed titles:
Days Gone (2019)
Blood & Truth (2019)
Concrete Genie (2019)
Dreams (2020)
The Last of Us Part II (2020)
Ghost of Tsushima (2020)
Demon's Souls (2020)
Spider-Man Miles Morales (2020)
Ratchet & Clank: Rift Apart (2021)
Horizon Forbidden West (2022)
Gran Turismo 7 (2022)
The Last of Us Part I (2022)
God of War Ragnarök (2022)
Horizon: Call of the Mountain (2023)
Spider-Man 2 (2023)
Concord (2024)
+ the yearly MLB The Show games.

 

[R3EUIL]

That's like saying "The state lottery is a failure because most people don't win."

Traditional SP games are deemed success or failure based on their purchase rates, not their completion rates. The market enjoys BUYING God of War Ragnarok (success), but the market is blind to how quickly they bore of God of War Ragnarok (irrelevant).

The market clearly wants to spend money on bigger, larger, longer games. The top 10 best selling SP games every year show this.

It's slightly more complicated than you realize. The smaller teams that work on Remasters are often not capable of meaningfully working on new projects. Their time is more effectively spent on Remasters.

How many hours did Niel Druckman spend on The Last of Us TV show?

We have such little information that it's just as easy to fabricate a narrative suggesting his work on the HBO show improved Naughty Dogs next game. It's way too early to be making such judgements.

What is the cancellation rates of projects in pre production in the games industry? How many people worked on Factions 2? Will the lessons learned on Factions 2 be used to improve games built at Naughty Dog going forward? If we can't answer such basic and important questions like that then coming to a hard conclusion is absurd.

I think it's important to correct illogical thinking. Echo chambers of irrational thought can be cured through adversarial discussion. Educational and fun. Win win.

And well, the fact that Sony games have a high completion rate shows that they manage to hold the player until the end, anything beyond that is just anecdotes and not supported by the evidence. By the way, one thing I've always found funny: people complain about huge, filler games, but most of the most acclaimed modern single-player games are hundreds of hours long (BG3, Elden Ring, Tears of Kingdom).

 

[FeralEcho]

SOTE is still just an expansion, and what about 2020 and 2021?
Again, I'm not speaking about their quality, but there used to be a time when From Software was publishing a bigger quantity and variety of games on a yearly basis. That is not today.
Not even bothering with the rest of the post.

Just an expansion you say yet it'll be 5+ times larger than Hellblade 2 which they worked on for over 5 years? I'd rather have expansions of games than full games from lazy devs then thanks.

And for your info this is From Software since 2010 throughout 2024 since you purposefully seem to ignore anything outside of 2020 and 2021 when they were cooking one of the largest games in current gaming:


Dark Souls 2011

Dark Souls Prepare to die edition with expansion 2012

Armored Core 5 2012

Armored Core Verdict Day 2013

Dark Souls 2 2014

Dark Souls 2 Scholar of the First Sin expansion and remaster 2014

Bloodborne 2015

The Old Hunters expansion 2015

Dark Souls 3 2016

Dark Souls 3 two expansions 2017

Derracine 2018

Sekiro 2019

Elden Ring 2022

Armored Core 6 2023

Shadow of the Erdree expansion 2024

That's the release schedule of From Software throughout the years,as you can see outside of the 2 years you purposefully chose to exemplify they haven't missed a single year,in some actually having more than 1 release actually. What's more,in the two years they had an absent release they created one of the greatest,largest games of this entire generation.

Now lets take a look at Ninja Theory

Enslaved Odyssey to the west 2010

DmC Devil May Cry 2013
DLC with Vergil 2013

Remastered DMC version 2015

Hellblade 2017

Bleeding Edge 2020

Hellblade 2 2024


Gee I wonder why western studios take so long to make games...

Oh no Scooby it's a fucking mystery!

Maybe if western studios actually had the work ethic of the japanese they wouldn't have to scrape the bottom of the barrel looking for excuses cuz they have become too fat and lazy to work!

 

[digital_ghost]

Lego Horizon

My hurt feet are ready

---

 

[64bitmodels]

Nintendo's not releasing a new Zelda or Mario or Metroid every few years. They supplement with spin offs and stuff and they're good with that,

Yeah and all we ask is that Sony do the same. Is it that much to ask?

 

[64bitmodels]

Just an expansion you say yet it'll be 5+ times larger than Hellblade 2 which they worked on for over 5 years? I'd rather have expansions of games than full games from lazy devs then thanks.

And for your info this is From Software since 2010 throughout 2024 since you purposefully seem to ignore anything outside of 2020 and 2021 when they were cooking one of the largest games in current gaming:


Dark Souls 2011

Dark Souls Prepare to die edition with expansion 2012

Armored Core 5 2012

Armored Core Verdict Day 2013

Dark Souls 2 2014

Dark Souls 2 Scholar of the First Sin expansion and remaster 2014

Bloodborne 2015

The Old Hunters expansion 2015

Dark Souls 3 2016

Dark Souls 3 two expansions 2017

Derracine 2018

Sekiro 2019

Elden Ring 2022

Armored Core 6 2023

Shadow of the Erdree expansion 2024

That's the release schedule of From Software throughout the years,as you can see outside of the 2 years you purposefully chose to exemplify they haven't missed a single year,in some actually having more than 1 release actually. What's more,in the two years they had an absent release they created one of the greatest,largest games of this entire generation.

Now lets take a look at Ninja Theory

Enslaved Odyssey to the west 2010

DmC Devil May Cry 2013
DLC with Vergil 2013

Remastered DMC version 2015

Hellblade 2017

Bleeding Edge 2020

Hellblade 2 2024


Gee I wonder why western studios take so long to make games...

Oh no Scooby it's a fucking mystery!

Maybe if western studios actually had the work ethic of the japanese they wouldn't have to scrape the bottom of the barrel looking for excuses cuz they have become too fat and lazy to work!

2 of the 4 screenshots are literally people converting and taking notes. Game development isn't all about just staring at a computer, devs need to think about game design and story elements too

 

[64bitmodels]

They make much games than the other publishers. I'd rather wait 5-6 years between franchises for quality rather than churning out the shit MS does.

Microsoft is literally about example of the worst of both worlds where the games take long and come out mediocre. They are not the example to be used here

 

[64bitmodels]

Sony studios should pay attention to our lord.

Delayed games certainly don't reach the quality of skyrim, because delayed games tend to be good, something skyrim is not

 

[SHA]

A unified console must be considered, or the consumers will move to something else which doesn't benefit either sides, one for losing a customer and second for being a noob and lacking clues on what buy from the store.

 

[nial]

Yeah and all we ask is that Sony do the same. Is it that much to ask?

Do we? Honestly most of those spin-offs suck, and well, look at the response LEGO Horizon got, lol.

post

You're forcing this East vs. West thing way too much, and I'm not defending fucking Ninja Theory, but you're still comparing the production infrastructure of a publisher like FromSoft to that of a simple studio like NT.
And yes, FS did manage to release games on a yearly basis up to 2016, but this is when they pivoted to produce big games only, and we're now seeing the results of that; nothing *new* in 2020-2021 and 2024-2025.
Not even blaming them, they've had enormous success these past few years, but I don't find them to be the best example of that particular narrative.

 

[64bitmodels]

Do we? Honestly most of those spin-offs suck, and well, look at the response LEGO Horizon got, lol.

Ok then smaller AA franchises. Doesn't have to be spinoffs.

 

[R3EUIL]

Just an expansion you say yet it'll be 5+ times larger than Hellblade 2 which they worked on for over 5 years? I'd rather have expansions of games than full games from lazy devs then thanks.

And for your info this is From Software since 2010 throughout 2024 since you purposefully seem to ignore anything outside of 2020 and 2021 when they were cooking one of the largest games in current gaming:


Dark Souls 2011

Dark Souls Prepare to die edition with expansion 2012

Armored Core 5 2012

Armored Core Verdict Day 2013

Dark Souls 2 2014

Dark Souls 2 Scholar of the First Sin expansion and remaster 2014

Bloodborne 2015

The Old Hunters expansion 2015

Dark Souls 3 2016

Dark Souls 3 two expansions 2017

Derracine 2018

Sekiro 2019

Elden Ring 2022

Armored Core 6 2023

Shadow of the Erdree expansion 2024

That's the release schedule of From Software throughout the years,as you can see outside of the 2 years you purposefully chose to exemplify they haven't missed a single year,in some actually having more than 1 release actually. What's more,in the two years they had an absent release they created one of the greatest,largest games of this entire generation.

Now lets take a look at Ninja Theory

Enslaved Odyssey to the west 2010

DmC Devil May Cry 2013
DLC with Vergil 2013

Remastered DMC version 2015

Hellblade 2017

Bleeding Edge 2020

Hellblade 2 2024


Gee I wonder why western studios take so long to make games...

Oh no Scooby it's a fucking mystery!

Maybe if western studios actually had the work ethic of the japanese they wouldn't have to scrape the bottom of the barrel looking for excuses cuz they have become too fat and lazy to work!

This comparison makes no sense, Ninja Theory was a very small company with around 20 employees before it was taken over by Microsoft, From Software had around 300 when it launched Elden Ring. I think you need to get this idea of using From Software as a yardstick for game delivery out of your heads

 

[balls of snow]

Sony is clearly struggling to get releases out at a consistent cadence. You dont put like 3 of the your biggest guns in 2022 and then poof into nothingness for 2 years. Seems they are positioning Astro Bot and Concord to be the reasons to buy a ps5 pro this year. All good for me considering Dragon Age (heavily rumored) and Ac Shadows comes out on time at the end of the year to push the pro.
But next year, Sony better bring out Ghost 2, DS 2 and Marathon. Its been long enough.

 

[nial]

Ok then smaller AA franchises. Doesn't have to be spinoffs.

People here will still not care even when we do get them. Compare the amount of replies of the 'Astro Bot announcement in 15 days' thread to that of the 'Neil Druckmann says something' one.

 

[Astray]

State of Plays are pretty much that.

They're not steady enough, Nintendo makes almost twice the amount, and it's not like they cost a ton either.

 

[TGO]

Just counting internally-developed titles:
Days Gone (2019)
Blood & Truth (2019)
Concrete Genie (2019)
Dreams (2020)
The Last of Us Part II (2020)
Ghost of Tsushima (2020)
Demon's Souls (2020)
Spider-Man Miles Morales (2020)
Ratchet & Clank: Rift Apart (2021)
Horizon Forbidden West (2022)
Gran Turismo 7 (2022)
The Last of Us Part I (2022)
God of War Ragnarök (2022)
Horizon: Call of the Mountain (2023)
Spider-Man 2 (2023)
Concord (2024)
+ the yearly MLB The Show games.

And if you go back further it's consistent up to 2022.
Now where are we at?
It was concerning two years ago when you guys said the same damn thing.
It's pretty much dead now and that is the problem.

 

[tmlDan]

Meanwhile From Software putting out absolute classics on a yearly basis. Maybe don't make 200 hour open world games that all look and play the same?

id rather not play the same game over again and over again for 15 years, thanks.

You souls fanboys annoy me

 

[TGO]

id rather not play the same game over again and over again for 15 years, thanks.

You souls fanboys annoy me

I do actually agree with this, the Souls games are getting boring now.

 

[feynoob]

Delayed games certainly don't reach the quality of skyrim, because delayed games tend to be good, something skyrim is not

Skyrim is soo good that a bad release gets a high 96.

 

[nial]

They're not steady enough, Nintendo makes almost twice the amount, and it's not like they cost a ton either.

Nintendo makes like 2/3 per year from what I remember, but I will give you the partner and indie ones. Still, indies manage to have big a presence on SoPs.

And if you go back further it's consistent up to 2022.
Now where are we at?
It was concerning two years ago when you guys said the same damn thing.
It's pretty much dead now and that is the problem.

Stop jumping the gun, they still haven't revealed their full 2024 schedule (we're 99% getting Astro Bot this year), and it will remain the same when we end up comparing their 2025-2027 output.
Not even considering the fact that SIE still produces a lot of externally-developed games, something Capcom doesn't do at all. They're simply a much bigger publisher in general.

 

[JerryinSoCal]

Yearly basis? It's not the 90's/2000's anymore, all From Software makes these days are BIG games every 3-4 years (no mention of their quality, Armored Core 6 was 2023 GOTY).

They also don't spend time on creating an actual story that goes along with their games. I still couldn't tell you jack shit about what Elden Ring was supposed to be about lol.

 

[TGO]

Stop jumping the gun, they still haven't revealed their full 2024 schedule (we're 99% getting Astro Bot this year), and it will remain the same when we end up comparing their 2025-2027 output.
Not even considering the fact that SIE still produces a lot of externally-developed games, something Capcom doesn't do at all. They're simply a much bigger publisher in general.

You're right, Sony will have a showcase before the end of the month to announce games releasing this holiday season and some reveals for next year.....

 

[64bitmodels]

Skyrim is soo good that a bad release gets a high 96.

Skyrim is so good that you need mods to make it playable

 

[Rockman33]

Xbox releases one 1st party game a year- They are the worst!

Sony doesn’t release any 1st party games this year- Just wait, games take a long time!

 

[R3EUIL]

Sony is clearly struggling to get releases out at a consistent cadence. You dont put like 3 of the your biggest guns in 2022 and then poof into nothingness for 2 years. Seems they are positioning Astro Bot and Concord to be the reasons to buy a ps5 pro this year. All good for me considering Dragon Age (heavily rumored) and Ac Shadows comes out on time at the end of the year to push the pro.
But next year, Sony better bring out Ghost 2, DS 2 and Marathon. Its been long enough.

Well, on average, Sony usually releases 2 First Parties a year (I'm referring to games where it owns the IP), but I think its recent pivot to GASS has postponed many games and many of them have already been canceled. But now that Sony knows more or less what to do, each of the big PlayStation studios will deliver at least two games by the end of the generation, many of them being new IPs, the medium-sized studios like Bend and Housemarque will deliver bigger games, the GAAS studios are a mystery, but if they succeed, they'll be a great addition to the PlayStation catalog (most of them are of different genres and gameplays, i.e. they'll appeal to everyone).

 

[nial]

You're right, Sony will have a showcase before the end of the month to announce games releasing this holiday season and some reveals for next year.....

Can't wait for you to drive the hype train soon, choo choo!

 

[nial]

Xbox releases one 1st party game a year- They are the worst!

Sony doesn’t release any 1st party games this year- Just wait, games take a long time!

Nothing funnier than seeing Xbox fans getting cocky over... nothing.

 

[MagiusNecros]

They also don't spend time on creating an actual story that goes along with their games. I still couldn't tell you jack shit about what Elden Ring was supposed to be about lol.

Once you understand it you realize that once again the story is bad. Only DS1 and Bloodborne were any good when it comes to story. And even then it wasn't that special since it ultimately is a poor man's BERSERK with great setpieces and amounts to little more then a Isekai experience where every NPC knows everything and you the player know nothing about anything.

 

[digital_ghost]

They're not steady enough, Nintendo makes almost twice the amount, and it's not like they cost a ton either.

Probably because Nintendo and others can make switch games alot cheaper than it costs to make ps5 games.

 

[ByWatterson]

It's cute that people here don't want AI to help speed things up and shrink budgets.

 

[Astray]

Probably because Nintendo and others can make switch games alot cheaper than it costs to make ps5 games.

Then the correct course of action is to make games of varying sizes and budgets and scopes. Not everything has to be of massive scope.

Making a smaller game that sells 1-2 mil is fine.

 

[digital_ghost]

Then the correct course of action is to make games of varying sizes and budgets and scopes. Not everything has to be of massive scope.

Making a smaller game that sells 1-2 mil is fine.

I agree. I wish Sony would do that, but people have been asking Sony to make cheaper to produce games at least since ps4, maybe ps3.

 

[feynoob]

Skyrim is so good that you need mods to make it playable

That is how great it is. You can make your own Skyrim game. Godd Howard has done it

 

[TheUndeadGamer]

I would rather get something like this

This is sweet but also sad. It made me cry . Thank you for sharing that.

 

[DForce]

Xbox releases one 1st party game a year- They are the worst!

Sony doesn’t release any 1st party games this year- Just wait, games take a long time!

2018 - God of War, Spider-Man
2019 - Days Gone
2020 - The Last of Us Part II, Ghost of Tsushima, Spider-Man: Miles Morales, Demon Souls, Sackboy
2021 - Ratchet & Clank: Rift Apart, Returnal
2022 - Horizon Forbidden West, God of War Ragnarok, Gran Turismo 7
2023 - Marvel's Spider-Man 2

2018 - Sea of Thieves, Forza Horizon 4, State of Decay 2
2019 - Gears 5, Crackdown 3
2020 - Grounded
2021 - Forza Horizon 5, Halo Infinite, Psychonauts 2
2023 - Starfield, Redfall, Hi-Fi Rush, Forza Motorsports

It's not 100% complete but you get the picture.

Xbox lacked big titles for two generations in a row. Microsoft didn't have nearly the same output and that's why they're criticized for it.

 

[Rockman33]

Nothing funnier than seeing Xbox fans getting cocky over... nothing.

How is that cocky?

 

[Angry_Megalodon]

Bullshit.

Say that to From, Kojima, Mihoyo and studios that are focused on working their asses off instead of attacking fans on Twitter and wasting time and money with random crap.

 

[Rockman33]

2018 - God of War, Spider-Man
2019 - Days Gone
2020 - The Last of Us Part II, Ghost of Tsushima, Spider-Man: Miles Morales, Demon Souls, Sackboy
2021 - Ratchet & Clank: Rift Apart, Returnal
2022 - Horizon Forbidden West, God of War Ragnarok, Gran Turismo 7
2023 - Marvel's Spider-Man 2

2018 - Sea of Thieves, Forza Horizon 4, State of Decay 2
2019 - Gears 5, Crackdown 3
2020 - Grounded
2021 - Forza Horizon 5, Halo Infinite, Psychonauts 2
2023 - Starfield, Redfall, Hi-Fi Rush, Forza Motorsports

It's not 100% complete but you get the picture.

Xbox lacked big titles for two generations in a row. Microsoft didn't have nearly the same output and that's why they're criticized for it.

I absolutely agree Microsoft should have been criticized for their severe lack of 1st party games. What I’m trying to point out is Sony is clearly in a slump of 1st party releases last year and this year. And they should be criticized and judged accordingly.

They will have only released Spiderman 2 in a 2 year window, that’s terrible.
(MLB the show as well but I don’t really count that, considering it’s multi plat and also on gamepass day 1, same thing with COD moving forward. )

In that same window Microsoft will have released 8.

 

[DForce]

I absolutely agree Microsoft should have been criticized for their severe lack of 1st party games. What I’m trying to point out is Sony is clearly in a slump of 1st party releases last year and this year. And they should be criticized and judged accordingly.

They will have only released Spiderman 2 in a 2 year window, that’s terrible.
(MLB the show as well but I don’t really count that, considering it’s multi plat and also on gamepass day 1, same thing with COD moving forward. )

In that same window Microsoft will have released 8.

People have criticized PlayStation for a year due to their lack of first-party titles, but they're not going to receive the same level of criticism because Microsoft has struggled to put games out for more than 5 years.

 

[S0ULZB0URNE]

imagine how many years Naughty Dog will take to make a 25 hours game....

Edited

 

[gow3isben]

Xbox releases one 1st party game a year- They are the worst!

Sony doesn’t release any 1st party games this year- Just wait, games take a long time!

XBOX shilling seems so retro now lol

 

[XXL]

Figured I'd post this here since it's from Shinobi.

On the other forum Shinobi is saying that he has heard that major 3rd party publishers games are selling 3-5x more on PlayStation compared to Xbox. He also mentioned that people he spoke to gave him the impression that Game Pass is the reason for this delta.

Here is one of the quotes

As an example, just based on conversations I've had with folks at a couple major third party publishers, some games that I know about that came out over the last couple years, have sold exponentially less on Xbox than other platforms. Not just due to a smaller install base, I'm talking 3, 4, 5x less than PS5. It was kind of eye opening, but it shows you if big third parties are experiencing that, I can only imagine how much less of an audience a studio reaches if they just stick to Xbox/PC.

Here is the Game Pass part

The sentiment was that it feels like GP has kind of gotten a lot of the userbase used to not buying games. To be clear it's from some people I've talked to at a couple publishers, so not an all-encompassing study or anything. But that's the way it was framed to me.

These are just snippets from a much larger comment, I can post the whole thing if anyone wants me to.

 

[Sanepar]

Bend released a game 5 years ago. Nd, sp, bp last games are from 2020. Really they can't even show a trailer in 4-5 years? This looks like more as dev hell.

 

[T0minator]

Bend released a game 5 years ago. Nd, sp, bp last games are from 2020. Really they can't even show a trailer in 4-5 years? This looks like more as dev hell.

No offense but it's normal not seeing a game for 4-5yrs it's not "dev hell"

It's completely normal.

Gears 5 2019
State of decay 2018
Days Gone 2019
TLOU2 2020
GoT 2020
Astro Bot 2020

Still no gameplay...all of those studios will show something within a year from now.

They don't want to announce games too early anymore. Xbox and Playstation both made that mistake at the beginning of this generation

 

[tommib]

Where the hell is Bluepoint in all of this?

 

[T0minator]

Helldivers 2 - Co-op PvE
Stellar Blade - Action Adventure
Concord - FPS PvP
Astro Bot - Platformer

Possibly another release within this year.

All their other studios are working games to release starting next year. Bend Studios will probably be the first to release something next year

That's pretty good. Nintendo, Xbox, and PlayStation will all have one of their best years in awhile next year

 

[Tiago Rodrigues]

Bend released a game 5 years ago. Nd, sp, bp last games are from 2020. Really they can't even show a trailer in 4-5 years? This looks like more as dev hell.

Bend is literally making a new IP. Even something like Horizon Zero Dawn started its development in 2011 and was released in 2017 and that was the previous gen. Imagine how long a new IP takes to make now, lol. Naughty Dog had it's big game canceled recently and are doing a new IP. All others not having a game announced in 5 years is pretty standard considering Sony doesn't announce games years in advance anymore.

Y'all complain games take long to make and don't need to have top-notch visuals but when something releases looking worse than say TLOU2 we get multiple topics on how games aren't looking any better than 5 years ago. Or when indie games are announced at State of Plays, conferences, etc they are considered bathroom breaks between the big AAA games shown.

Developers just can't win nowadays.

Meanwhile Sony seems to be doing quite a great work in making sure they have multiple releases not done by their teams.

I don't even get the obsession of games needing to be made by their own teams. Helldivers 2 is a Sony IP. Death Stranding 2 is a Sony IP. Sackboy is a Sony IP. Bloodborne and Demon Souls as well. All games and IPs funded and made by outside partners.

Horizon Forbidden West was a crossgen sequel from a game that released in 2017...and it took half a decade to make guys.

Imagine a current-only new IP being done nowadays.

Sony's studios will probably start to release more games starting late next year. Between now and then we'll get stuff like Silent Hill 2 Remake, Death Stranding 2, Until Dawn remake, and it's not like their studios won't be releasing stuff, there's the new Astrobot game rumored, there's Concord as well. And this is stuff we know it's coming...