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[Clear]

It's even worse than arrogant Sony. No one from the original ps1 and ps2 days are in charge anymore.

Shocking! After 30 years you'd expect everyone to still be there!

/s

 

[RoboFu]

Shocking! After 30 years you'd expect everyone to still be there!

/s

Everyone saying "arrogant somy ". If it is ... it's a new arrogant somy. Not the same one. For better or worse... so far it's been worse.

 

[yurinka]

They cancelled most GAAS games,

No, they didn't.

Out of the '12 IPs with GaaS' plan, they already have 6 of them in the market (4 of which are highly successful), plus have over 6 more under development. They'll have their dozen IPs with Gaas, but will take longer than initially expected (they dropped their initial March 2026 milestone).

They canceled 3 or 4 more that were under production, plus didn't greenlight (which doesn't mean to cancel, because you can't cancel something that didn't start) a few pitches that never reached full production.

 

[Dorago]

The only games played on their system are COD, Madden, and Fortnite and if MS made the COD only console they'd go out of business?

They should do this too because Sony deserves to lose for chasing all of these anti social trends.

 

[DeepEnigma]

The only games played on their system are COD, Madden, and Fortnite and if MS made the COD only console they'd go out of business?

They should do this too because Sony deserves to lose for chasing all of these anti social trends.

 

[SneakersSO]

I think S SneakersSO commented on this a while back and said basically some analyst went to all the companies and pushed them to get into GAAS and how it was the future.

Yeah, this isn't a new thing. Most businesses will contract consultants to give them analysis and trends, thoughts on where things might be going in the 5-10 year time frame. Several folks, even Mat from NPD, have said they have done this with folks including Sony.

When many of these decisions were being made, like in the 2017-2020 timeframe, GaaS' ceiling and some of its market factors were these nebulous ideas. All the industry knew was that it was driving a ton of revenue growth. SIE helped launch 2 major GaaS titles (Rocket League and Fall Guys) by including them as PS+ titles in their launch months. The other big piece of advice being given was that there would be greater returns in titles by driving up budgets and hiring.

The thing to note is most of this was coming from Western analysts. Its fair to say that many of the issues facing the current games industry are nearly all isolated to the Western game dev industry, especially North America. Korea, China, Japan, both their devs and pubs, are coasting on simply chasing fiscally responsible budgets, reusing assets and building on gameplay frameworks that work. Yes, the games are taking longer to get out, but the team sizes haven't exploded, and instead, most of the most successful publishers in those regions merely made more teams, which is hiring more, but when each team can ship a game, each team becomes a revenue stream onto themselves, instead of all budget increases being used to bolster a single revenue stream.

SIE started their pivot away from the GaaS/Western investment approach to game dev last year. They put the decision making control of SIE as a portfolio back into Japan's hands. This is an overall great thing for SIE, and while some of the results of the pivot away won't start getting felt until next year at the earliest, each subsequent year will get noticeably better for them. Just a shame they burned 3 years of output at this alter.

 

[yurinka]

This whole gen from a first party gen has been remasters other than a handful of Sony first person exclusives. From a first party perspective it has been weak in comparison to the previous generations.

No.

• This gen they got many first party non remaster/remakes with great MC.
• Sony has been the company with the biggest amount of games that won GOTY awards in 2022 and 2024.
• Sony broke sales records with first party games released in 2020, 2022, 2023 and 2024.
• A Sony first party game was the one that won more awards in 2020 and 2024.

 

[Clear]

No.

• This gen they got many first party non remaster/remakes with great MC.
• Sony has been the company with the biggest amount of games that won GOTY awards in 2022 and 2024.
• Sony broke sales records with first party games released in 2020, 2022, 2023 and 2024.
• A Sony first party game was the one that won more awards in 2020 and 2024.

Honestly I'm through with giving these nonsensical complainers time of day. Its just comedy at this point.

Example; I saw a vid on YT earlier today claiming that Sony haven't released a major third party game since 2023, despite Astrobot winning multiple GOTY awards!

Its like if Sony releases the same titles, over and over they get slammed for doing the same game. If they do anything different its either unwanted or otherwise discounted for some random reason!

 

[PurePlatinum]

I understand that it's disappointing, and yeah I'm very curious about what a lot of the studios are working on/ the status of "in-trouble" projects like Wolverine, Horizon Online, Fairgames$...etc.

I think Sony is happy with having games every year in the GOTY conversation, and so far they haven't really missed out on that. First party isn't supposed to be making money on software sales...it's suppose to give people a reason to pick your console over the competition so they come spend all their Fortnite bucks with you instead of MSFT.

And right now, they don't seem to need those games at all. Why rush the release/announcements of your first party games when you are succeeding largely on remasters of 5+ year old games.

 

[bundylove]

Because that platform is dead market-wise. PSVR2 sales just aren't there, and I mainly blame SIE for that. They decided to make it PC-compatible as a last-ditch effort, but I doubt that's done anything long-term. That said, I hope they take another stab at VR, but if they do it needs to be a scalable technology that can offer "good enough" performance at the low end while also offering high-end performance at the premium end.

There is no reason to not have a cheap $99/$149 entry VR headset to accompany a mid-tier option or a $499+ premium feature-rich variant. It's the only way to get VR and other MR adoption growth (well, that and making VR a standard inclusion in the SKU offering, but that is probably two generations away from happening).

Any time Team Asobi would spend making PSVR2 content for Astro Bot means less content tuned for the base PS5 and PS5 Pro. Those are the high priorities, not PSVR2; besides Asobi isn't a massive studio so there's only so much they can do at once.



We can say the same thing about most Mario or Sonic games, but for some reason this "it's just DLC" comment only seems to always apply to Sony games. Is GT7 just DLC for GT6? Is TLOU2 just DLC to TLOU? Is Helldivers 2 just DLC to Helldivers?

Astro Bot is its own thing and builds off of what Astro's Playroom did, which built off from Rescue Mission. They are distinct offerings; no reason to downplay the new game calling it 'DLC'. Also if that were truly the case, I think a lot more people and media would have felt similar, and the game wouldn't be getting so much recognition.



What about the actual games SIE published during those four years? Do they stop counting?

Also Saros is Housemarques' second game; their first came out in 2021. Saros is more ambitious than Returnal, so why is getting a reveal trailer four years later somehow a bad thing or cause for concern? AAA games take at LEAST five years to make nowadays, they don't just magically come out from thin air.

For studios like ND, we already know why it's taken them longer. They were working on a GAAS that was cancelled, which took up some resources. But they were working on Intergalatic in some form during that which is why it'll come out around 2026-2027. It is what it is. If we get some official word that Balrog's new space game is cancelled, or GT8 isn't happening, or Wolverine's been cancelled etc., I think then is when we can have some actual major concerns about their 1P pipeline.

As-is, the only titles that've been cancelled have been GAAS, and some studios weren't large enough to withstand a cancellation while having another project in deep production. The two main studios that seem most affected are Bluepoint and Bend, because we probably won't get new games from them this gen. That's 100% SIE's fault and they deserve to be criticized for it, but I've already done my criticism.

Right now it seems like they've realized that mistake, and have been course-correcting. But that course-correcting will take a bit of time.



This actually, literally makes zero sense. The platform with FAR FEWER games and not much major 1P or 3P support, somehow has more bangers than the system which has both?

Okay, you have to accept you are in a very small minority with that take. Literally just dozens of you; you're entitled to it sure, but safe to say the vast majority wouldn't agree.



Then why did you buy a PS5 Pro? You knew it was coming months ahead of release, and it's not like that much suddenly changed with SIE between then and now in terms of 1P releases, or their services, or their hardware quality. 1P releases were light in quantity last year aside two major hits; services have been consistent in quality (tho got a price hike) aside the recent outage (which you got reimbursed for), and your PS5s are working just as well today as they were when you bought them, provided you do even the bare minimum in using them properly.

What changed in five months to make you go from throwing down $700+ on a PS5 Pro to feeling like Sony are ripping you off of your time & money?



Well any successful company is going to do this. But you're going to have to clarify what you mean here, because it could mean anything.



So you're implying SIE aren't in it for the care of the craft anymore, when they're the only platform holder trying to address technical issues with custom solutions (PSSR), and putting forth a well-balanced 1P library (in most respects) between cinematic games (GOWR, Spiderman 2 etc.), platformers (Astro Bot), racing sims (GT7 continued support), sports (MLB The Show), co-op live service shooters (Helldivers 2) and working with 3P to bring fresh new IP to the market (Stellar Blade, Rise of the Ronin) as well as sequels to games they basically helped bring to life (Death Stranding 2)?

Look, I've long complained about their GAAS gambit. I was saying eons ago that I didn't like how GAAS was getting most of their funding, and worried it was going to throw some studios off-track. Didn't like they had so many in development, especially if they were turning out into games like Concord. I've been saying their PC strategy could have long-term ramifications since they've ported almost all of their current-gen offerings to Steam, conditioning users there who would have bought a console for 1P to just wait out for an eventual port and buy on Steam instead. How that could also convince some high-spending enthusiasts to consider switching to PC later on especially if they already dabble in PC gaming as-is.

Well going by recent events it'd seem like SIE are finally starting to consider this perspective too. Multiple GAAS projects cancelled. Zero mention of new PC ports at the recent SOP, or even in blog posts. Rumors of Demon's Souls remake & GT7 PC (Steam) ports cancelled. Realizing that PC gamers really only showed up big time for a single game over the past two years (Helldivers 2). It'd seem SIE have the data now to make these adjustments, so they are learning. Also outright mentioning they want to make more AA games like Astro Bot, among other things. It took a while, but they're finally making some much-needed changes.



Oh please, now you're just exaggerating. Almost no one but Xbox fanboys hated the start of this gen for PS5. Great reveal, great showcases, solid SOPs, great exclusives off the rip (Demon's Souls remake, Rift Apart, Kena etc.), strong 3P exclusives (FF VII Remake Interlude, etc.), outperforming the "more powerful" Series X in most multiplats, etc. The only true sour point early on was the lack of availability for the system, that's why certain games like GT7 & GOWR likely had to be cross-gen (I say this now; back in 2021 tho I know I most likely said it was a conspiracy and SIE wanted to make GT7 cross-gen the whole time xD).

Ironically, things only started getting off-course around the time Microsoft wanted to buy ABK. I think the combination of that, and it instantly wiping $20 billion off Sony's market cap, made them scramble and push harder with GAAS than they needed to. That's why they bought Jade Raymond's studio and Firewalk, among others. That's why they signed deals for stuff like Foamstars of all things. That's probably why they put studios like Bluepoint and Bend on GAAS that are now cancelled. That's when they started pulling back on showcases and SOPs. That's why we got that terrible 2023 PS Showcase. That's why we saw them go so gung-ho on profits and started increasing the cost of PS+. That's why we started seeing more and more frequent PC ports and remasters.

Now, I'm not absolving SIE from their role in those things happening. I'm just saying, we can probably trace a connective thread for those things occurring, to a point of origin, a single event that likely triggered a chain of misinformed choices on SIE's part. And I think that point of origin is Microsoft buying ABK. There was TONS on uncertainty in the industry what that would cause, and apparently even Microsoft weren't sure because what we're seeing from Xbox today is definitely NOT what they were wanting to happen when they first made the offer to buy ABK. We've got enough leaked internal emails to prove it.

But even through those dour periods, it's not like SIE completely shit the bed. They kept putting out games, and 1P-wise last year actually turned out to be among their best despite being very light on the AAA cinematic games they're heavily known for. PSVR2 might've been let down by them commercially, but it's a fantastic piece of kit. PS Portal and PS5 Pro released. They've been working with more Asian studios and studios globally in the Hero Project stuff. They've been changing course on two of the bigger oofs this gen (PC strategy, GAAS). They've been entering more partnerships and business alliances with various studios & publishers, the latest being Kadokawa & From Software.



But you've discounted the ones released :/



So this is more about your personal tastes not being satisfied? Well, I won't say that shouldn't matter: it should. There are definitely some games I'd like to see return, some genres I'd love to see come back, that likely won't ever come back at the level they were at their prime.

But I haven't given up hope, either. Surprisingly some of those HAVE come back via re-releases (HOTD, Panzer Dragoon, Tomba, Lunar etc.); there are neat games coming out with the spirit of classics (Crow County, quite a few indie 3D platformers, etc.), quite a few Japanese studios are bringing back IP I had low expectations of returning (Shinobi, Jet Set Radio, Virtua Fighter, Crazy Taxi, Ninja Gaiden, Onimusha etc.), Asian studios in Korea & China are stepping up a ton (Tales of Annihilation, Stellar Blade, Black Myth Wukong etc.), we've got the Switch 2 launch coming up, SIE are fixing some mistakes and seem interested returning to AA, even MS have a few interesting things from the stuff they bought (new DOOM, still interested in Perfect Dark) etc....

Honestly I think if you aren't mostly focused on Western AAA (aside stuff like GTA6 or Witcher 4) I'd say things are looking quite strong.



Well isn't that what companies like Valve are looking to address? Make PC gaming more approachable and easier in general? Maybe if you're lucking whatever MS are doing for the next Xbox appeals to you in that regard.

If it's more about the culture of PC gaming...just ignore that part?

thats a long read lol.

I appreciate your time and effort you put into your reply. Realy.

But i feel there is a disconnect between what i am alluding to vs what you read into it.

I feel there could be a reasonable ,healthy debate regarding this topic in real life. Face to face. Not here though.

For example , my mindset and yours differ extreamly. Based on experience and life style. Which you would have to factor into the equation.

I dont know how much clearer i could be when i tell you i know everything playstation since the very beginning and that my opinion is shaped based on the past 30 years.
Just turned 45 today so i am an old shit.

I was always there at every release. I spent over a 1000 bucks to import a japanese ps2. I imported soo many japanese games that i started to learn the language just to understand what is going on.
Everything you wrote about is all known to me.
I have an unhealthy passionate relationship with sony. But i am realistic.

Therefor my dissapointment is valid. To me.

Maybe its burnout maybe i've seen it all , maybe my business is taking my last energy and there is nothing left for me to be happy for.

In these winter months, minus 21 celcius today, i just want to play all day but frankly if it wouldnt be for tomb raider remake i wouldnt know what to get into.

Anyways.

 

[RickMasters]

People fail to understand why we are not getting the same first party output that we are used to.
Games don't take 2 years to develop anymore. They take 6+ years and that is a whole console generation.
Development times must be cut down to 3 years tops.

I think that’s why we need more AA games. 5-6 years to make a game is also why we end up with so much cross-gen stuff, so late into a consoles cycle. I don’t think that is gonna change with big AAA games that require so much resources and time to make.

 

[playbignbox]

It's not Sony being arrogant, it's Sony being lazy and uncreative.

 

[Majima Everywhere System]

Nintendo is going to crush Sony.

Sony was on top making movie games, and guess what? There are about 4 people left with the attention span to sit through a movie.

 

[Astray]

SIE started their pivot away from the GaaS/Western investment approach to game dev last year. They put the decision making control of SIE as a portfolio back into Japan's hands. This is an overall great thing for SIE, and while some of the results of the pivot away won't start getting felt until next year at the earliest, each subsequent year will get noticeably better for them. Just a shame they burned 3 years of output at this alter.

Best news I've heard all month. Thanks.

 

[firegamer273]

the main problem with sony is they only want to make movie games and dont even wanna touch their old ip's . creatively bankrupt at its best .

 

[Feel Like I'm On 42]

I'm going to get attacked for this but it's all true and needs to be said.

Why do I think Sony sucks right now? Call it arrogance, lack of respect, whatever ...PS5 Pro. The way they're handling it says it all. We just had a State of Play, the first one since the Pro released and not a single thing was said about the console nor any announcement of improvements, fixes to PSSR, or newly announced patches. Nothing to assure the fans who spent all that $ hoping to finally get a premium console experience, that we are being taken care of.

Support and effort from Sony has been a joke. Almost none of Cerny's promises are actually happening like not having to sacrifice Quality mode fidelity and framerate, the "3x RT improvement", and a "great" ai upscaling solution that solves the problems that base PS5 had with games.

Despite what Sony fanboys want to believe PSSR has been full of issues relating to shimmering, noise, and aliasing ...it works well in some games but when it comes to advanced games using heavy RT features PSSR has been a failure. Silent Hill 2, Dragons Dogma 2, AW2, SW Outlaws, and Hogwarts Legacy are all examples of games that have either equal or worse iq than base PS5. Games like Rise of the Ronin can't get Quality mode running close to 60 fps and thats without RT. Most patches for Pro are glorified Performance mode with PSSR tagged on. How is any of this "eliminating the need to choose between Quality and Performance modes" Sony? This is only true for literally a few games

We should never get any games on an $800 machine that look worse than PS5 and in fact all games should be looking and running better with no exceptions. Where is Sony to remedy this situation? Why aren't they doing what Nvidia does and actually working with developers who are struggling? There's no sense of urgency or assurance that things are moving in the right direction.

Sony hasn't even updated a bunch of their OWN exclusives! GoT, Gow 2018, astrobot, Returnal, UC4 remaster, Death Stranding. Lego horizon, etc. Between their low effort on Pro and having to see PC get port after port that are superior on that platform it really feels like Sony doesn't give a shit. We have to pay $70 a year to play online gsmes on top of the premium price of the console. They should be doing better for their customers. That's not to mention the absurd GaaS push that happened despite everyone shouting from the heavens "what the hell are you doing Sony? Stick to what made your platform great during the ps2/ps3/ps4!" but alas it all fell on deaf ears. They seem to be catering more to PC gamers now than people who adopted the most expensive console ever made. How could that not be seen as arrogant?

 

[Three]

Sony's not in trouble, but their customers certainly are. Sony's making three times the profits of the PlayStation 4 era because they're milking their customers for everything they're worth, and it'll only get worse as Sony needs to continue to deliver growth to its shareholders in a market space that isn't growing. Once Microsoft finishes its transition into a third party publisher, there's nothing left for Sony to eat to give the illusion of growth. After that, they'll have to squeeze their customers harder than ever. I don't lose sleep for an industry with an "arrogant Sony", I lose sleep for an industry with "only Sony".

Nonsense, their margin isn't even their highest it's ever been. It's due to increased revenue from new customers. Milking would imply greater margin, not increased overall revenue. The later is just growth. Nobody is in trouble despite everybody's "concern".

 

[Fabieter]

for a game two years away, I thought we were over this, announcing games years in advance with a fucking CGI trailer is useless.

Yes everyone claimed they aint doing early announcements anymore which is a lie it seems.

 

[Darkkahn]

Please someone tell me that Sony isn't doomed!