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Dragon Quest creator Yuji Hori is directly blaming American influence for both DQ3 Remake censorship and the change of Male/Female to Type 1/ Type 2
- Thread starter The Chairman
- Start date
- News
Interfectum
Member
Even if it bombs they will keep doing it. Listen to the excuses for Concord, The Acolyte, etc.... they will never admit it's because shitty west coast messaging being pushed in content is turning off costumers. it's always something else.
Rudius
Member
Then they can go full Ubislop
ByWatterson
Member
And who did that?
If it's done at the behest of the FCC, they can only control public airwaves (so not cable). But on cable/satellite and online, people can put out whatever they want, whenever they want.
In games, our Supreme Court went so far as to strike down a California law merely requiring ID for M-Rated games - in part BECAUSE it would result in self-censorship (see Brown v. Entertainment Merchants Association, 2011). Obscenity, which could be regulated in theory (but isn't in practice), is strictly defined as something that appeals to a strictly prurient (animal sexuality) interest AND has to lack all artistic merit AND be patently offensive to contemporary community standards in its graphic depictions of sex.
Outside of these parameters all "censorship" is the result of private contracts or market-based decisions. Square here is another example of self-censorship because of, in this case, bad market research. My entire point here is that government censorship in the gaming space is almost entirely unconstitutional and if this self-censorship is a dumb read of the market, which it is, it's entirely Square's fault, and not America's.
You and so many others here are stridently yelling about a topic you know zero about.
Zero.
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samoilaaa
Member
cmon dude , whos gonna stop buying from software games , or the next larian game , or the next spider man game , or the next naughty dog game
lets be honest here , these games are always gonna sell
All of this feels unreal , to be forced to accept that some people think they are other genders or no gender at all , to use plural pronouns on a single person , world has gone mad and its not going back to normal unless some cataclysmic event happens
the next the last of us can have a non binary protagonist and its gonna sell over 20 million copies because its naughty dog
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Rran
Member
It's a complicated subject but I'm glad Horii was candid in speaking out about it. The Type A/Type B thing is a solution in search of a problem, and has certainly caused more backlash than simply having a Male/Female selector.
I'm tired of DQ fans claiming that those who have a problem with all this aren't fans of the games. It's lame No True Scotsman gatekeeping, and people who are passionate about something tend to not want it messed with. It'd be like claiming people who didn't like The Last Jedi aren't really Star Wars fans or something.
I'm tired of DQ fans claiming that those who have a problem with all this aren't fans of the games. It's lame No True Scotsman gatekeeping, and people who are passionate about something tend to not want it messed with. It'd be like claiming people who didn't like The Last Jedi aren't really Star Wars fans or something.
It's a little unclear and can be read multiple ways, especially considering we're looking at a translation of his words. The other way you can read it is as a strict adherence to "decency," which could be used to describe the current covering up of characters in games, etc. It's not clear what time period he's referring to.
Rran
Member
People don't like that this is how it is and want it to change. And yes, sometimes changing culture involves speaking out directly and specifically on what the issue is. That's kind of how it got to this point in the first place.
Boycotts aren't always clear. Like if DQ3's remake bombed, Square might just see that as--once again--the franchise struggling in the US and not link it to all this other stuff.
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SmokedMeat
Gamer™
Here’s the deal; back in the days of Super Nintendo and even in the 32-bit generation Japan’s versions would sometimes feature graphics or artwork that had to be changed for Western Audiences. We’re talking pre internet, where games were put on physical media.
We now live in a time where games are all online and can easily be changed - and I’m supposed to believe they couldn’t have “Male” and “Female” options in the Japanese version of Dragon Quest? Western influence never affected Japanese games ever, but now they suddenly do? All during the easiest timeline to not be affected?
Bullshit. Don’t be a bitch making excuses, own up to it.
fart town usa
Member
I notice an absence of someone in here. A new member who accused others of being "culture war tourists..." by being upset at the changes in this remake.
Now that Yuki Naka himself has called out the nonsense, that poster is nowhere to be found.
Convenient!
Now that Yuki Naka himself has called out the nonsense, that poster is nowhere to be found.
Convenient!
Cyberpunkd
Member
Can you quote a study that links DEI initiatives with increased profits?
Can you quote if the fiduciary duty of Japanese companies is the same as their American counterparts?
fart town usa
Member
It's only a conspiracy if you're a low information voter and rely on the TV to tell you what to think. The rest of us have watched the footage of world leaders explaining their plans in great detail. They aren't shy about it.
Kacho
Gold Member
“Maximize sales” …lol cool trolling bro
Nostalgic Nightmare
Member
Right, you must be speaking of the "modern audience" that their decisions are based on - you know the ones who only exist on twitter and never buy shit. They may want to re-think their strategy about catering to .1% (and most of that comprised of puppet tactic accounts) if they truly want to maximize sales and profits because as you state the people who are tired of this are speaking with their wallets as the data shows, no one is forced to pay for pandering (their original attempts at games built on a foundation of this fail miserably) so the only way they can have any impact is to hijack and ruin existing franchises and censor artists. This is the exact tactic used across the entire entertainment industry not just video games, so no it's not some "conspiracy" it's actually happening and has been.
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Considering the sheer number of insane or ridiculous things that Elon Musk himself has either said or done lately, that doesn't mean much.
It's also not going to make any practical difference, because...since when do Japanese game developers listen to him? I'm glad the discussion is happening, sure, but Elon Musk jumping on a bandwagon for a little bit...that isn't some sort of gamechanger.
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GHound
Member
The lack of a PS4 version kind of flies in the face of his attempt.
NecrosaroIII
Ultimate DQ Fan
Make your own games. People rely too much for others to make entertainment, when they are capable of doing it themselves. If enough people start making the sort of content theywant instead of relying on games being made for them, then it would be drowned out.
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samoilaaa
Member
i would but i dont know how to code
NecrosaroIII
Ultimate DQ Fan
You could always learn? I say this as someone who makes their own indie games. It's the way. If we don't like what the companies are pushing on us, we need to fight back and make the sort of games we like.
Making a game isn't that hard.
samoilaaa
Member
i work 12 hours a day ( sometimes even 14 ) , i really dont have time to learn such a complicated thing as coding , i barely have enough time to cook , clean , go shopping , workout and maybe game for 1 or 2 hours
NecrosaroIII
Ultimate DQ Fan
I do too brother, in a shit field I hate (logistics). It's a field that drives me to madness. I also have other responsibilities as a married man. It's an outlit to ensure I remain sane.
Maybe it can be an outlit for you too.
Sojiro
Member
Don't get me wrong, I don't think that you are wrong about Elon in the slightest here, and I absolutely think he is just jumping on the bandwagon, but regardless of whether he actually gives a shit, all eyes are on him when he posts, and it's a fuck ton of eyes.
Feel Like I'm On 42
Member
It's always the money men making these decisions ...that's why this is on SquareEnix just as much as it is on the west.
Feel Like I'm On 42
Member
Capcom and now Squenix have bent the knee now and i expext more will come
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
Zacfoldor
Member
Do you know how much courage it takes to stand up and say something about stuff like this...sadly only for people to claim that standing up and calling it out isn't enough, instead what he should do is lead a revolution from within the company to get his personal way?Dragon Quest is a JP game made by JP people and they are well within their rights to control what they do with the IP. So maybe don't censor the game? Maybe make the game for the fans and not consultants and companies who aren't buying the product to begin with?
Hori is talking the talk but he sure isn't walking the walk. If he is so upset...so frustrated he would have as the IP creator stopped this from happening. This isn't a George Lucas where he sold the IP...he still has some say in what can happen and clearly regardless of spewing hot air he isn't doing much about it.
Pot meet Kettle.
If he cared he would delay the game and remove the censorship and restore Toriyama's vision but hmmm I don't think he will.
When people stand up against this stuff we should support them, not tear them down. When you do that it all becomes arbitrary and our side loses. We become the chronically unsatisfied who will just complain about anything that jumps in our heads without understanding it(and thus impossible to appease, so just keep going business as usual).
If they attack him because he hates DEI in his classic games and we hate him because, checks notes, he doesn't run the company all by himself, then we have moral bankruptcy my friend. Instead we should support and lift voices on our side within the industry.
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NotMyProblemAnymoreCunt
Biggest Trails Stan
Not to mention having a certain hatred towards Japanese Entertainment and are trying to sabotage their success (Which unfortunately looks like they are starting to succeed...)
MagiusNecros
Gilgamesh Fan Annoyance
Actions speak louder then words. And thus far the actions being taken is complacency in the censorship of Dragon Quest. What time will tell is how much Yuji Hori is willing to fight for Dragon Quest. In November we shall have our answer.
GrouchyGamer
Neo Member
Square/Enix, put the game back the way it was! Undo all of the DEI woke bullshit and never look back.
I'd love to pick up the remake but absolutely will not in the current state.
I'd love to pick up the remake but absolutely will not in the current state.
LiquidMetal14
hide your water-based mammals
Glad the little bastard said something. My pre-odor is still on but highly debating cancelling. Just not liking the DEI push for no reason.
Kacho
Gold Member
Rran
Member
Hearing the legendary Yuji Horii speak out about it makes me feel better about buying it, to be honest. Knowing that he puts a lot of passion into this series and is frustrated with the changes forced from the higher-ups.
NotMyProblemAnymoreCunt
Biggest Trails Stan
At least he is bringing attention to the issue and actually is making a difference by actually talking about what's going on.
I'm happy Musk tweeted about this. I'm iffy on Musk (Can't stand him simping for the turd), but this has been one of the many good thing he has done. I hope that now that he retweeted it, that cause lot more people to raise a stink and hopefully get the games censorship changed before the game releases or in a patch after the game releases
I admit the game does look good but man does the censorship turn me off from ever buying it
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Gamer_By_Proxy
Member
Kinda refreshing hearing someone hate on America over something true for once, not gonna lie.
Rhazer Fusion
Member
Glad to hear him speak out on this. Yeah, I’m really tired of this as well. Modern Western gaming is more about pushing a message, political ideologies and checking boxes over making enjoyable and great games. It’s reasons like this why I miss how gaming was in the 90’s and early 2000’s. The goal back then was to make the best game possible with talented, passionate people, not trying to appeal to weirdos and an imaginary audience.
TheThreadsThatBindUs
Member
Categorically false.
Look up the definition of focus testing and data analytics.
Social media analytics is a multi-billion dollar industry in itself. It wouldn't be so if it wasn't important. And in fact, analytics data is way more important than sales data as it can tell you who is using your product and how, rather than just how many people; as well as who is interested in your product and who isn't and why.
No. You're wrong.
Sales data is purely sales data. All it gives you is how many consumers (roughly) bought your product and at best where their purchases were made. It's important but not particularly meaningful info. for forecasting or predicting the performance of future games.
MayauMiao
Member
This is great, more awareness of the woke poisoning.
Dirk Benedict
Member
So, is silence, apparently. You can't win!
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Nostalgic Nightmare
Member
Not buying it would help bolster his position on this more ironically. The only way to stop this stuff is to not buy it and let them adjust to their real audience.
MayauMiao
Member
That would be like that Hoyoverse boycotters trying to protest due to "cultural appropriation and whitewashing" but at the same time still play the game. The result was more sales and Hoyoverse gave them the middle finger.
Rran
Member
I think it depends on what lesson Square-Enix would take from sales. They might just think (as they have in the past) that low sales simply means Dragon Quest is struggling once again to find a market in the west. I'm a fan of the series since the first game and that would suck.
PR troubles might be enough to scare S-E away from pulling this Type A/B thing again. They've already disabled comments on recent DQ3 videos and the rather active DQ official X account hasn't made any posts since this went down.
LMJ
Member
As always "America", they bomb left and right, killing innocent people but gender is a no, no. lol after all Kinder surprise is more dangerous than a fully loaded AR.
But of course how can I be so silly to forget that America is just a warmongering country with nothing good or important to offer to the world.
What an incredibly nearsighted and foolish statement.
You want to blame someone, blame the activists who are finding their ways into these various institutions and forcing this when they know for a fact that it is not selling, it hasn't sold with any og game thus far.
The only games that have seen success are sequels to successful games that they infest, but the problem there is then you end up poisoning the series itself, look at Star Wars.
We don't know how well Spider-Man 3 is going to sell or how well last of us three is going to sell because they got rid of a huge chunk of the audience of the first due to an overly progressive maybe it will do successfully we know the media will love it but then again they are filled to the brim with these activists.
These activists can't create on their own, as their creation is poison because they completely lack the understanding of what makes a relatable and good story.
They literally poison their own work, look at Goodbye Volcano High and dust born for example, each so filled with venomous idealism they don't even realize their own hypocrisy instead they find existing works and taint those all in the name of so-called sensitivity.
This isn't an America thing this is an activist thing just look to our good friends across the pond as they say and those stop oil chuckle fucks who are currently throwing crap on Priceless works of art, activism has no country it's just stupidity due to lack of actual adversity.
sono
Gold Member
Biological gender is that.
"Identifies as" and "attracted to" may not equate to biological gender.
Are the Americans ruling that in games offering a character selection screen that all three distinct characteristics are now mandatory choices irrespective of the type of the game or the software will be banned.
"Identifies as" and "attracted to" may not equate to biological gender.
Are the Americans ruling that in games offering a character selection screen that all three distinct characteristics are now mandatory choices irrespective of the type of the game or the software will be banned.
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SF Kosmo
Al Jazeera Special Reporter
American influence has created a lot of censorship even among products only released in Japan. Most obviously, nudity in broadcast anime is totally gone, where back in the 90s it was common and not considered a big deal. People probably don't realize a lot of this shift in standards comes from international pressure.
sigmaZ
Member
Just check out the Ranma remake.