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[HeWhoWalks]

My opinion.

Didn't XV sell like 10 million copies? Sure that was also on PC and XBox, but XBox yeah was probably only 20% of sales and PC not very much.

If you want to say that FF has become a niche franchise... then yeah it has.

I don't know what final unit total classifies a game/property as "niche", but considering FFVXI has a loooooong time to sell plenty more than the 3 million it did in one week, I'm not drawing any conclusions. What I know? Square was satisfied with what they got from the one platform where it would have sold the most regardless.

 

[Chukhopops]

And by that I mean willingly choosing an Xbox over a PlayStation on expectation of that being your fighting game hub. In no gen has Xbox ever had that type of presence for the genre, even the 360 era, where it was arguably the closest.

Incredibly dumb post, absolutely no one was playing SF4 on PS3 because of 50% more input lag and bad network. Even in Japan everyone played on 360 and all tournaments were played on 360 or PC.

Stick to what you know.

 

[Mr Moose]

My opinion.

Didn't XV sell like 10 million copies? Sure that was also on PC and XBox, but XBox yeah was probably only 20% of sales and PC not very much.

If you want to say that FF has become a niche franchise... then yeah it has.

In a month?

 

[Heisenberg007]

That title update!

 

[MasterCornholio]

That title update!

Rotten Apple Journalism

 

[skit_data]

The original thread title didn't meet the high end of my expectations, but it was still within my expectations.

 

[BlueLyria]

Takashi mochizuki lmao.

I believe this game has been a sucess and underperfomed on their expectations, because square have set these stupid high expectations on every game they release, it's ridiculous

 

[thicc_girls_are_teh_best]

My opinion.

Didn't XV sell like 10 million copies? Sure that was also on PC and XBox, but XBox yeah was probably only 20% of sales and PC not very much.

If you want to say that FF has become a niche franchise... then yeah it has.

Since when is 10 million lifetime sales niche? Maybe it depends on budgets & marketing, but even so, 10 million is nothing to sneeze at.

Truth is vast majority of AAA games do not break beyond 10 million in lifetime sales. People got too used looking at the exceptions (COD, Zelda, Spiderman, GOW, Mario Kart, Smash Bros. Pokemon, GTA5 etc.) and now think that is the rule.

That's because you don't understand Sony's communication strategy. Their aim is to create a context where SF = PS even though SF gets released on other consoles. They have worked like this since 1995 by the way.

What? They never did this. Back in '95 they got a timed deal for MK3, that's about it. Most console players of SF games went with Saturn because the 2D was slightly better. SF EX were side games by Arika and they defaulted to PS because the arcade version was made on PS-like hardware. The games were default PS-exclusive because Arika were a smaller dev, Capcom was busy with other games, and the N64 & Saturn would've required too much work in terms of ports.

This is why they bought EVO and forced tournaments on PS4 despite the abysmal port of USF4 (that had to go back to being played on 360 by the way). Back then people knew that 360 was the superior platform for fighting games, so they bought their place in that market.

So, nothing different by your logic to what Microsoft are trying to do in gaming as a whole. I.e they know the majority of customers, developers, and publishers prefer buying and working with PlayStation, so they can only "compete" by purchasing 3P publishers who have close partnerships with Sony, and hopefully force customers to buy Xboxes by foreclosing more and more games of acquired assets on PlayStation platforms.

...

With the notion SF = PS now implanted in people minds, they don't feel a need to pay for SF6 again, which is completely logical. People are going so skip Xbox anyway now, so why pay ? Casuals will buy the game so at least there's that for Capcom. Sony will only pay when they feel that the market might slightly shift again towards competition.

The game's already sold 2+ million copies, so obviously people think it's worth paying for. The question is: if the audience on Xbox were as big as people have constantly made it out to be, wouldn't the overall sales be even larger than they currently are?

Can't on the one hand say games like SFV should have released on Xbox because the audience was there to buy it, then claim SF6 has a low purchasing percentage on Xbox because of people being jaded over SFV. They complained, Capcom responded, they didn't buy. So, when the next game comes around, Capcom have less of an incentive to prioritize Xbox, and the cycle repeats all over again.

We've literally seen this happen with Square-Enix.

When your game is exclusive, you are not fighting against your main competitors on the platforms that you skip as well. So you are losing market share.

So Nintendo lost market share by making TOTK exclusive? Sony's lost market share making GOW Ragnarok and Spiderman exclusive? Aren't the Insomniac Spiderman games the best-selling iterations of that IP in gaming history?

Making exclusive a multiplatform series that is a main source of benefits is always super risky for a third party. I think that Capcom are paying the price, and Square Enix as well.

Mind you I did not once say SF6 sold badly; it's outperforming SFV launch-aligned, so your idea that Capcom are "paying a price" for SFV being console-exclusive to PS4 doesn't even have anything to stand on. I just mentioned SF6 because so many have been wanting to say FF XVI is a failure, yet it sold more copies in a shorter span of time on less platforms than one of the biggest multiplatform releases of the year.

There are SO many multiplat IPs with dwindling sales that the idea going exclusive for one installment hurts the next doesn't really hold up...except, ironically, in cases like Tomb Raider. Where going XBO-exclusive for Rise of the Tomb Raider, negatively impacted that game's release on PS4, which then negatively impacted its sequel. Ironically the only recent instances I can think of where a game's sequel performed worst than the previous one due to exclusivity, are when said previous installments were Xbox console exclusive :/

 

[Fbh]

My opinion.

Didn't XV sell like 10 million copies? Sure that was also on PC and XBox, but XBox yeah was probably only 20% of sales and PC not very much.

If you want to say that FF has become a niche franchise... then yeah it has.

XV sold 10 million after SIX years on the market, on 3 platforms instead of one and spending a considerable time of those 6 years in the $15 bargain bin.

Also selling 3 million copies in under a week is nowhere near "niche". Sure it's not as good as mega franchises like Pokemon, Zelda or God of War but it's still pretty good.
Again, Re4 Remake has sold 5 million in 4 months and it launched to a MUCH bigger audience. Is Resident Evil also a niche franchise now?

 

[MaxwellParrish]

Not as much as on Playstation,

But it's still an extra 1m copies minimum depending on the game.

No, it's not. A minimum of a million copies would be 25% of the sales on XBox, that is possible but is definitely a generous extimate, so far from " minimum"

 

[asdasdasdbb]

In a month?

FF7R's sales tanked hard after the initial launch. It sold 5 million in the first month but likely never got to 6, and that includes the PC version. XVI looks like it's headed to be the same.

The original PS4 version and the PS5 version were offered on PS+ at one point in separate months. I wonder how much Square got for that and how many people claimed it and played a meaningful amount.

 

[bender]

Feel The Penetration was the name of my high-school death metal band.

 

[MaxwellParrish]

FFXV sold 5 million units on it's first month across all platforms, not sure how much Sony paid for the exclusivity but it seems it wasnt worth it.

XBox represented around 10% of that sales

 

[cireza]

What? They never did this.

Oh I see. Where are these precious receipts to back all that you have said ? They don't exist.

So, nothing different by your logic to what Microsoft are trying to do in gaming as a whole.

Indeed. They eventually decided to go this route and I think this is the right choice for them. Sony buying their place in the market has been the norm for 25 years, no reason for this to be different for MS

The question is: if the audience on Xbox were as big as people have constantly made it out to be, wouldn't the overall sales be even larger than they currently are?

Pretty sur SF4 sold 0 copies on 360. It is up to Capcom to assess how much they lost with that Sony partnership.

So Nintendo lost market share by making TOTK exclusive?

When did Nintendo turn third party already ? Supposing first parties would release their games on more platforms, then of course they would sell more. But the same logic does not apply for them as they want to retain the player in their ecosystem to make more money. It is their interest to make them exclusive. It is in their interest to steal a third party series and make it exclusive. But this certainly isn't in the third party's interest on the long term.

Where going XBO-exclusive for Rise of the Tomb Raider, negatively impacted that game's release on PS4, which then negatively impacted its sequel.

Oh, so Sony good MS bad. Got it xD
At least you have a good grasp of what is happening with SF and FF.

 

[thicc_girls_are_teh_best]

Oh I see. Where are these precious receipts to back all that you have said ? They don't exist.

About the MK3 deal? You can read all about it online. About PlayStation being the home of SF? Believe it or not, Sony didn't have to do any deals with Capcom for that. Did you not read the leaked SoA documents? Sega themselves made Saturn so unattractive for most 3P that they simply chose not to support it, particularly in the West.

And IIRC even in the West the Saturn got certain Capcom fighters as exclusives like Children of the Atom. Can't recall PS1 getting that game and if so, it was a lot later and probably limited to PAL regions.

Indeed. They eventually decided to go this route and I think this is the right choice for them. Sony buying their place in the market has been the norm for 25 years, no reason for this to be different for MS

Except Sony didn't have to buy their way into being #1 in the market. Again, they bought Psygnosis who were 1/1666th of the total 1993 gaming market by revenue. ABK is 1/26th of today's gaming market by revenue. When they bought Psygnosis, the PS division didn't exist yet, all Sony had prior was the failed Sony Imagesoft label.

They bought SN Systems for devkit support but SN Systems still made devkits for the Saturn. Also, Sega purchased their own devkit maker a few years earlier, so that's not something Sony started. 90% of the 3P exclusives PS1 got were because the platform was big enough and easy enough to make games for, that 3P who were just learning to make 3D games decided not to bother putting up with the Saturn and N64. Even so, Saturn & N64 also got quite a few 3P exclusives that same gen, sometimes by default.

PS2 was a repeat of PS1, where 3P basically gave it exclusives by default due to market conditions and lack of presence of competitors, plus huge success on PS1. Capcom cancelled RE2 on Saturn because after 1.5 was canned, the Saturn was basically dead outside of Japan. Namco worked closely with Sony for new arcade hardware and PS1 dev support when companies like Sega & Nintendo did nowhere near as much collaboration with 3P at the time. Squaresoft & Enix chose PS1 because Nintendo still chose carts for N64, and Saturn was a huge mess between design & bad business decisions.

Sony bought Naughty Dog only after already working with them on the Crash Bandicoot games; prior to that ND made either much smaller/obscure microcomputer games or failed console games for the 3DO. Insomniac worked almost exclusively with PS systems for 20+ years outside of literally one IP (Sunset Overdrive, which bombed) before Sony acquired them. Bungie is the first publisher Sony purchased in almost 30 years and only in reaction to Microsoft aggressively buying Zenimax & ABK.

Sony earned their way to the top. Microsoft is desperately trying to buy their way to the top. Massive difference.

Pretty sur SF4 sold 0 copies on 360. It is up to Capcom to assess how much they lost with that Sony partnership.

Well they must've liked it because they chose Sony for comarketing of SF6.

When did Nintendo turn third party already ?

You didn't make it about 3P franchises specifically. But, I don't see why that matters.

Supposing first parties would release their games on more platforms, then of course they would sell more. But the same logic does not apply for them as they want to retain the player in their ecosystem to make more money. It is their interest to make them exclusive. It is in their interest to steal a third party series and make it exclusive. But this certainly isn't in the third party's interest on the long term.

You can't "steal" 3P games without the 3P agreeing to give them to you, lol. Although, 3P can definitely be hoodwinked into a deal they didn't agree to. That's exactly what's happened with Zenimax, just ask Pete Hines :/

Oh, so Sony good MS bad. Got it xD

Not my fault those are the facts.

At least you have a good grasp of what is happening with SF and FF.

That they're both selling strongly, have met expectations, and in SF6's case outpacing the previous entry launch-aligned even when the new platform of availability isn't contributing significantly to the sales boost?

Nice.

 

[Nubulax]

YoshiP should stay with the MMO. This game was a chore to play

Your right... he should stick to the Final Fantasy(and game) that ACTUALLY brings them in money month after month

 

[Unknown Soldier]

I think the turn based nonsense is mostly an excuse to complain in a somewhat believable critical way about a highly rated game. Especially as some of those same people use FF15 as the best performing FF, not turn based either. Some truly actually prefer turn based, I understand, but it reminds me of the "corridor racer" slights against another game as if there is something intrinsically wrong with what the game is. There isn't anything wrong with an action RPG, I bet they play a lot of those too.

Never tell any of those fake FF fans who never actually played any of the series that the only actual, really turn-based FF since quite literally the 1980's was FFX.

Active Time-Battle (ATB) was introduced in 1991 with FFXIV. ATB is NOT turn-based. It's played in real time, albeit with drilling through menus. But if you sit there in the last 30+ years of FF titles starting with IV and expect the enemies to wait for you to take your turn, your party is already dead. Enemies continue attacking even if you do nothing in ATB. It is NOT turn-based and never has been.

With the exception of FFX in 2001, every FF title since 1991 used a variation of ATB until FFXII introduced the FFXI-style MMO themed combat. Then the XIII trilogy went back to ATB, and then starting with XV we finally went to fully real-time combat with characters you manually control. Since then no FF title has gone back to ATB but it doesn't seem like SE really like ATB anymore after 30+ years of FF titles using it.

I've been playing FF7R Intergrade on my PS5 that one is kinda like Bethesda Fallout, you move Cloud and Co. around and whack things freely, but then when you hit X it opens a menu and you can select spells and skills while a really really slow motion version of the battle continues to play out. This is still not turn-based.

 

[captainpat]

A bit worrying when a game that sells over 3 million copies first week isn't good enough.

 

[adamsapple]

A bit worrying when a game that sells over 3 million copies first week isn't good enough.

First Square Enix earnings call ?

They do this with just about every game. Notoriously so with the Western studios they owned before selling them off a while ago.

 

[Kilau]

First Square Enix earnings call ?

They do this with just about every game. Notoriously so with the Western studios they owned before selling them off a while ago.

 

[lh032]

Ok can somebody tell me, whats the deal between Takashi and Sony? Did Sony upset him before?

 

[asdasdasdbb]

I've been playing FF7R Intergrade on my PS5 that one is kinda like Bethesda Fallout, you move Cloud and Co. around and whack things freely, but then when you hit X it opens a menu and you can select spells and skills while a really really slow motion version of the battle continues to play out. This is still not turn-based.

Square said FF7R had an option to play it turn-based. But this got dumbed down to what they call Classic Mode. I believe it's still there in Integrade.

 

[Vroadstar]

First, Phils salty balls in his throat, now, penetration?!!. Adamsapple sure likes being violated for his beloved xxx.

 

[UltimaKilo]

XV sold 10 million after SIX years on the market, on 3 platforms instead of one and spending a considerable time of those 6 years in the $15 bargain bin.

Also selling 3 million copies in under a week is nowhere near "niche". Sure it's not as good as mega franchises like Pokemon, Zelda or God of War but it's still pretty good.
Again, Re4 Remake has sold 5 million in 4 months and it launched to a MUCH bigger audience. Is Resident Evil also a niche franchise now?

This guy gets it. Eventually, it will release on PC and Xbox as well and gain another boost in lifetime sales. Unfortunately, this is not a title they can put on Nintendo’s machine with that monster install base, but we could eventually see it on Nintendo’s successor console.

The video game market is s large now, that sales of popular games don’t just flame out.

To play devil’s advocate: I don’t know SQE finances, but they have been in need of a runaway hit. DQ was a success, FF14 and the Octopath games as well.

 

[Self_Destructive]

It's a shame. We all know internally they are disappointed. "It sold in line within our range of expectations given PS5's install base"... which translates to "We're not breaking any records for our franchise "

 

[Heisenberg007]

Ok can somebody tell me, whats the deal between Takashi and Sony? Did Sony upset him before?

Sony tried touching his pee-pee, but they couldn't find it. Takashi has been mad ever since.

 

[Unknown?]

OP posted the false Bloomberg tweet hours ago in another thread and got corrected. He just wants to spread a negative spin for personal reasons. He has no interest in the facts.

He also thinks Windows is a good operating system!! Rofl

 

[ChiefDada]

First Square Enix earnings call ?

They do this with just about every game.

If only you applied this logic to Takashi and his takes on Playstation news.

 

[adamsapple]

He also thinks Windows is a good operating system!! Rofl

Me and around 96% of Steam users

 

[Unknown Soldier]

Square said FF7R had an option to play it turn-based. But this got dumbed down to what they call Classic Mode. I believe it's still there in Integrade.

I'm ok with the default combat in FF7R. It's miles away superior to 15, though it still falls short of the pure action spectacle of 16.

 

[ULTROS!]

In era, I learned of the term toxic positivity as in FFXVI has toxic positivity.

Meaning, the fans that like it defend it, spread good things about it to a toxic degree, and those who keep on trashing that the game flopped and are bashed and were rebutted with “it met expectations”.

Seriously, tf is wrong with the ff fan base and I’m a big ff fan.

I mean, the game ain’t perfect for me but it’s so much decent and complete compared to the previous FF entries.

 

[NoobSmog]

Seriously, tf is wrong with the ff fan base and I’m a big ff fan.

I mean, the game ain’t perfect for me but it’s so much decent and complete compared to the previous FF entries.

It's not the fanbase that are bashing the game, for the most part. This happens with every exclusive game for reasons you can probably guess.

As someone who has played every mainline entry, I really enjoyed it.

 

[The Last One]

In era, I learned

Impossible.