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[flyinpiranha]

I still believe the Wii and DS are total gimmicks. I believed it then, and after playing them, I believe it even more now.

I'm not saying they don't have any good games, but their supposed selling point is a straight up gimmick, and so is the 3D hand-held.


I admit I was wrong about how well they would sell. It still amazes me how many people bought a Wii. Then again, American Idol is the most popular show on TV, so it shouldn't have been surprising.


And this isn't an anti-Nintendo post. Kinect is a stupid gimmick, too.

So when does a new idea stop becoming a gimmick?

 

[Boney]

So when does a new idea stop becoming a gimmick?

When it uses traditional controls.. duh.
Analog sticks are gimmicks.

 

[Rainier]

When it uses traditional controls.. duh.
Analog sticks are gimmicks.

Pfff, especially if you're staring at a colour screen.

 

[Jason's Ultimatum]

What drove the 360 to become at the top for the month? Either way, AMAZING.

 

[Fuzzy]

Not sure if anyone's brought this up yet, but how are Kinect sales going to be counted in the first place? I assume NPD will track sales of stand-alone Kinect units, but they're not going to track 360+Kinect bundles as separate from 360, are they? I don't think they've ever distinguished hardware bundles before. Kind of like how there's no NPD distinction between 360 Arcade and other 360 units now. People will have to guess these numbers based on press releases and the like.

They track everything separately and those that subscribe to or have access to the subscription can see everything listed separately. When NPD releases the numbers in their free press release they combine everything.

 

[RedStep]

What drove the 360 to become at the top for the month? Either way, AMAZING.

My sources indicate that it was existing owners replacing their broken/unwanted systems.

 

[Fuzzy]

My sources indicate that it was existing owners replacing their broken/unwanted systems.

That's why the PS2 was the top console last gen.

 

[imtehman]

That's why the PS2 was the top console last gen.

it all makes sense now!

 

[X26]

yikes, software sales were terribad

 

[[Nintex]]

That only works for the iPhone, iPod, iPad... because it's usually an existing customer upgrading. Sony, Microsoft and even Nintendo wish they had the kind of loyal fans that Apple has. Hell, if on launch day of the Xbox slim we learned that you can't hold the controller in a comfortable position, or else the game resets itself, would we expect it to still not only sell out but be hard to find in stores weeks later?

Not really, Nintendo released the GBA and people couldn't see shit. Everyone applauded and lined up for the upgraded model afterwards.

 

[DMeisterJ]

I always assumed people were just joking when using that line of logic, because it's clearly not logical at all.

No, some people are dead serious with that 'logic'

 

[CadetMahoney]

Man these juniors are like one gigantic hive mind spewing this re-buying 360s argument.

I miss the npd thread from a few months ago when this piffle was being banned left and right in the npd thread.

I remember that. The attach rate pretty much steamrolls that argument.

There seems to be a lot of damage control in this thread.

I almost tried to look for scroll bar thinking it's a utube.

 

[yankeehater]

My sources indicate that it was existing owners replacing their broken/unwanted systems.

My theory is that MS is buying the consoles themselves and then dumping them into a big ditch.

 

[Branduil]

what's the story behind this?

 

[RedStep]

My theory is that MS is buying the consoles themselves and then dumping them into a big ditch.

 

[CadetMahoney]

what's the story behind this?

It looks like someone got e-pwned by fire just after someone else made a quick attempt at pwnage recovery.

 

[CrunchinJelly]

Not really, Nintendo released the GBA and people couldn't see shit. Everyone applauded and lined up for the upgraded model afterwards.

To be fair, they did a similar thing with the DS.

But that was more of a complete re-invention of the system.

 

[Gravijah]

To be fair, they did a similar thing with the DS.

But that was more of a complete re-invention of the system.

Hey, I can see on my phat!

 

[CrunchinJelly]

Hey, I can see on my phat!

I meant they completely re-invented the system with a new design, which made the original look like shit tbh.

 

[Gravijah]

I meant they completely re-invented the system with a new design, which made the original look like shit tbh.

-cries and runs away- YOU DIDN'T HAVE TO BE SO HURTFUL

 

[Sydle]

My theory is that MS is buying the consoles themselves and then dumping them into a big ditch.

Are they buying, on average, 8-9 games per each of those consoles they're dumping to keep the software attach rate up?

 

[kinggroin]

paco, it was a flippin' joke.

 

[user_nat]

Are they buying, on average, 8-9 games per each of those consoles they're dumping to keep the software attach rate up?

Nah, they are buying ~15 games per dumped console. The actual attach rate is about 2.

 

[yankeehater]

Are they buying, on average, 8-9 games per each of those consoles they're dumping to keep the software attach rate up?

The attach rate is a number and 105% of people know that numbers are lies and cant be trusted. Also MS is mean, they have more money then I do so I dont like them, and no one else should either.

 

[Psychotext]

Doesn't the non-standard shape/lack of decline of the 360's curve make that metric very tough to baseline?

That's a fair point... I wonder what that "curve" will look like when all is said and done. Assuming Kinect doesn't turn the 360 into the Wii (the Wii of the early days anyway) I guess they'll be looking at solid sales for the next two years before it drops off a cliff.

 

[RedStep]

The attach rate is a number and 105% of people know that numbers are lies and cant be trusted. Also MS is mean, they have more money then I do so I dont like them, and no one else should either.

This sounds wrong, but I don't know enough about numbers to dispute it.

 

[yankeehater]

This sounds wrong, but I don't know enough about numbers to dispute it.

Dont feel bad no one does. Number how do they work?

 

[Jive Turkey]

what's the story behind this?

It was a Russian fire safety demonstration that went horribly (not really) wrong.

The dude in red is a fireman and as he lights the pyre the accelerant he was using spills and ignites. He's fine and the spectators were fine dispite him throwing the accelerant all over the place whien his fireproof suit caught fire.

 

[AlteredBeast]

This thread delivered many times over. Bravo everyone!

 

[velvet_nitemare]

I think that looking at Wii Sports Resort numbers and the install bases, 10 million in a year would be classed as a success.

:lol

 

[Maxwell House]

Yeah the 360 has always been ahead of the PS3 in the US, although there was a period here and there where, when similarly priced (Prior to the 299 landscape), the PS3 actually outsold the 360 on a semi regular basis. I wouldn't be surprised if, WW, this month is in the favor of the 360 on account of the new model, but the PS3, has been and probably will continue to, gain ground WW. In the end both peices of hardware have been successful. it's a shame that Sony can't get their price of entry as low as Microsoft can, as that's been hamstringing not just the PS3, but the HD ecosystem for a while.

We really have no current data to say that the increased 360 sales from this month are canceling out the rest of the world. We have to make due with quarterly reports and scraps of info here and there.

Saying it is or isn't, for this month, is just wishful thinking.

With the slim launch I really doubt the ps3 is outselling the 360 anymore worldwide. The slim came out in Europe July 16th and from all accounts has been received very well. I expect that the 360 is outselling the ps3 in both north americaand Europe now and will continue to do so the rest of 2010. The 360 has Halo and kinect coming out this fall which should ratchet up sales even more.

 

[DR2K]

With the slim launch I really doubt the ps3 is outselling the 360 anymore worldwide. The slim came out in Europe July 16th and from all accounts has been received very well. I expect that the 360 is outselling the ps3 in both north americaand Europe now and will continue to do so the rest of 2010. The 360 has Halo and kinect coming out this fall which should ratchet up sales even more.

The one game that's going to drive 360 sales is neither the Kinect stuff or halo, it'll be CoD.

 

[Brimstone]

What do you think of 3D TV? Personally, I think that's a gimmick that's destined to fail. I love my PS3, but as I already wear glasses Sony better make any 3D game playable for me.

3D TV isn't a gimmick. The TV is capable of showing 120 frames. How those frames are used will be up to game developers.


They can do "stereoscopic 3d" by generating 60 frames for each eye, and the user wears shutter glasses


or

TEMPORAL UPSAMPLING, where the GPU generates 60 real frames, then interpolates 60 fake frames based off of the 60 real frames. So in essence you get 120 pseudo frames per second.

http://www.mpi-inf.mpg.de/resources/3DTemporalUpsampling/3DTemporalUpsampling.pdf



or

A company like Capcom can make Street Fighter 2 run at 120 frames per second. The animation and controls would be much more crisp.


or

Instead of split-screen for a first person shooter, each person puts on pair of shutter glasses, and plays the game while each sees their own view on the full size of the screen.

 

[Maxwell House]

That doesn't matter. The majority of the repeat buyers end up selling/trading in their old systems which in turn are resold to new consumers so the end result is the same: a bigger user base.

So true. The people saying that the 360 sales are up due to repeat sales from current 360 owners are ignoring the fact that most of those 360 owners sell their old systems which in turn are sold to new 360 users. So, the 400+K 360 sales this month means close to 400k+ new 360 owners in the end.

360 owners aren't keeping two or three systems at their place for the hell of it for the most part.

 

[poppabk]

WSR is a game not a $150 piece of hardware.

Well you can compare to Wii Fit but that just makes things tougher.
If you look at the 3rd party support for motion+ or the balance board they have been pretty limited - so unless MS are going to really crank out tons of kinect games - then it is going to fizzle out pretty quickly if it does worse numbers (even proportionally) than those attachments .

 

[Lyude77]

Well you can compare to Wii Fit but that just makes things tougher.
If you look at the 3rd party support for motion+ or the balance board they have been pretty limited - so unless MS are going to really crank out tons of kinect games - then it is going to fizzle out pretty quickly if it does worse numbers (even proportionally) than those attachments .

I think the Balance Board is the best comparison, even with limited support. Kinect basically can't do as well as it did, but I think the support will be similar (but better), as will the software sales of that support. I think that's one of the major problems with Kinect. If 5 million people buy it lifetime, almost no game will hit a million, and few games will spur more developer support (Kinect Adventures is the obvious exception). Basically, I think there will be a repeat of the overall Wii third party situation, but worse because of the segmented market. Unless companies take the budget approach (which usually doesn't work), I don't see much support coming or success in general. Of course, if it sells 10 million, it will be a completely different story. Oh well, I guess we'll just have to see how it does during the holidays.

 

[Segata Sanshiro]

I don't think the Balance Board is a good comparison. Most people who buy Wii Fit with the Balance Board probably aren't thinking much outside Wii Fit as far as using that board, whereas the person who buys Kincest is probably doing so with the plan to buy software beyond Kincest Adventures.

 

[ShockingAlberto]

whereas the person who buys Kincest is probably doing so with the plan to buy software beyond Kincest Adventures.

Illusion is developing for Kinect, too?

 

[A Twisty Fluken]

I don't think the Balance Board is a good comparison. Most people who buy Wii Fit with the Balance Board probably aren't thinking much outside Wii Fit as far as using that board, whereas the person who buys Kincest is probably doing so with the plan to buy software beyond Kincest Adventures.

This can be seen in the billing, as well. When you buy the balance board, you're actually buying "Wii Fit with Balance Board". You're buying a game with a required accessory included.

When you buy Kinectcest, you're buying "Kinect Sensor with Kinect Adventures!" If the Kinect Bundle Box had KINECT ADVENTURES in big bold letters I could maybe see it, but that's definitely not how MS is positioning it.

 

[ULTROS!]

I'm planning to buy Kinect for academic purposes actually. Of course, the PC version of Kinect (hopefully it releases by Q1 2011).

 

[TheFLYINGManga_Ka]

Anyone know sales numbers for Arc Rise Fantasia or Singularity?

 

[BladeoftheImmortal]

Anyone know sales numbers for Arc Rise Fantasia or Singularity?

Anywhere from 1-Bomba!

 

[A Link to the Past]

Anywhere from 1-Bomba!

Isn't one also bomba?

So shouldn't it be anywhere from Bomba?

 

[Gravijah]

Isn't one also bomba?

So shouldn't it be anywhere from Bomba?

0<1<bomba<niche success<major failure<success<sony 1st party<microsoft 1st party<major success<mega success<nintendo 1st party

 

[REMEMBER CITADEL]

3D TV isn't a gimmick. The TV is capable of showing 120 frames. How those frames are used will be up to game developers.


They can do "stereoscopic 3d" by generating 60 frames for each eye, and the user wears shutter glasses


or

TEMPORAL UPSAMPLING, where the GPU generates 60 real frames, then interpolates 60 fake frames based off of the 60 real frames. So in essence you get 120 pseudo frames per second.

http://www.mpi-inf.mpg.de/resources/3DTemporalUpsampling/3DTemporalUpsampling.pdf



or

A company like Capcom can make Street Fighter 2 run at 120 frames per second. The animation and controls would be much more crisp.


or

Instead of split-screen for a first person shooter, each person puts on pair of shutter glasses, and plays the game while each sees their own view on the full size of the screen.

OR most games will continue to be 30 fps "2D" affairs, because as history has shown us, most developers would rather use the extra processing power to make visuals richer at 30 fps.

 

[plasmasd]

OR most games will continue to be 30 fps "2D" affairs, because as history has shown us, most developers would rather use the extra processing power to make visuals richer at 30 fps.

30FPS and and as Jagtastic as possible.

 

[FrankT]

In an interview with Major Nelson this weekend Aaron Greenberg mentioned MW2 360 was at 127k. Not sure if that number had been filled in on the list yet. He gave latest attach rates for PS3(7.3) and Wii(6.8) as well. He gave total consumer spend at retail of $290 million for 360(in the PR earlier), for PS3 $181 million, and Wii $173 million. I believe he said $52 million of the 360 total was accessories sales (he says to date at the end of the convo, but then compares it to the $124 million SW total for the month) with the rest being pretty evenly split between SW and HW. $32 is the average cost per accessory. Internally they believe August should be pretty strong as well. Also says he has seen Reach pre-order numbers to date and they are outpacing MW2. I'll stick with my prediction coming in somwhere between ODST and H3 first month, but likely on the higher end of that. I still think there is a small chance for it to come in higher than H3. They were also teasing some TGS stuff(Greenberg states he just came out of a long meeting about it and putting it together now), but I can't imagine what they might have their heh.

Interview is here with time;

http://majornelson.com/archive/2010/08/15/show-365-lara-croft-npd-s-etc.aspx

 

[Arnie]

August should also be big for Microsoft in the US. They have Madden which is usually a heavier hitter on the 360 as well as two core titles in K&L2 and Mafia 2. Then comes September which contains Reach which no matter how people believe it will perform in relation to Halo 3, will drive software and hardware sales.

 

[FrankT]

August should also be big for Microsoft in the US. They have Madden which is usually a heavier hitter on the 360 as well as two core titles in K&L2 and Mafia 2. Then comes September which contains Reach which no matter how people believe it will perform in relation to Halo 3, will drive software and hardware sales.

I suppose DR2 could be decent in Sept as well if it scores well although I believe it is kind of late in the month.

 

[LosDaddie]

Very entertaining thread! :lol

Great sales for X360.