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Tqaulity
Member
Look, I always said that it was silly how people were getting all up in arms when GT7 first came out and didn't feature RT in races. Similarly, I thought it was dumb how Forza tried to hype so hard that RT was coming to races. Hybrid RT (as it's used today) is indeed very subtle in most genres....BUT IT IS ESPECIALLY SUBTLE IN RACING GAMES! You are moving so fast and having RT reflections on the body of a car that you don't even see in most views while playing is kind of pointless. You don't have time to admire the accuracy of a reflection in a puddle while going 150mph. You don't have time to see the reflections off the surface in the environment that is only on screen for 1-2 secs tops. The cost of RT generally isn't worth the trade off in a racing game where stable performance is paramount and the existing solutions for raster including cube maps and SSR already look pretty good...especially in GT7. Noticing the slight advantages of RT is even more difficult during gameplay.
I've always said, GT7 handled the RT perfectly at launch. RT was enabled EVERYWHERE in the game except for the races where it mattered least. In the garage, in the photomode, during replays makes PERFECT sense for RT because you actually have nothing to do but look and admire the cars in detail! And the RT effects looked glorious there! In races game looked insane already running at native 4K/60 with good looking reflections using fallback techniques. Case closed. I've played PC racers with RT and now F1 24 on the PRO with RT and the differences are negligible in gameplay to the point of being uninteresting. If you pause the game and look for the differences for the sake of A/B comparisons, you may find some. But if you're doing that, you're clearly not playing the game!
All that said, GT7 looks good with RT but I'd hardly call it necessary.
Klosshufvud
Member
During gameplay, in third person view? Not really. But sure if you go light hunting, I'm sure you'll find something and then blow said light source way out of proportionsThe RT differences look absolutely noticeable to me if you know what to watch
Kenneth Haight
Gold Member
I noticed a small difference that in your wing mirrors the reflections look a lot better.The RT differences look absolutely noticeable to me if you know what to watch
It was already a super looking game and now this has elevated it. GT8 is going to be unbelievable.
FIREKNIGHT2029
Member
I can't wait to get home and play the hell out of this after work today. This game is the main reason I bought a PS5 Pro and the enhancements I'm seeing here are stunning. I also can't wait to play it on my PSVR2 as I hear it has VR enhancements as well 
Skifi28
Member
This isn't just reflections, lighting is completely different in the cockpit. There's certainly a GI element here, even if it's not RTGI.Really hard to spot the difference?
I always play in cockpit view and it was one of the first things I noticed.
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Romulus
Member
I can't wait to get home and play the hell out of this after work today. This game is the main reason I bought a PS5 Pro and the enhancements I'm seeing here are stunning. I also can't wait to play it on my PSVR2 as I hear it has VR enhancements as well
Yeah reddit is raving about the psvr2 enhancements
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SkyHighTrees
Member
Great great great update! PD are so detail oriented...
It has two graphics presets.
RT and no RT
RT runs at 1440p PSSR to 4K, has some advantages like RT, which looks great imo, especially in cockpit view and hood cam. Reflections update at full frame rate. IQ is similar to the old PS5 mode, if a bit more shimmery, but sharper.
- LODs and shadow cascade retain the settings from the old PS5 mode.
The Performance Mode gets really interesting, it uses PSSR to make a much better looking image than the old native mode, while lacking RT, it boosts the LOD distance considerably, and this is the mode that is running on PSVR2, at lower frame rate than 120fps. Reflections are half rate here, same as before.
Both modes are pretty great, happy to see PD always do the most they can
For VR, now the game retains it's full graphics (before it had much lesser LOD, especially on grass and trees) and has the reprojection option.
Edit: I'm still figuring out if they upgraded the user CAR LOD in this performance mode... Meaning your cockpit will look better than on base PS5, while using the chase cam.. can anyone check?
It has two graphics presets.
RT and no RT
RT runs at 1440p PSSR to 4K, has some advantages like RT, which looks great imo, especially in cockpit view and hood cam. Reflections update at full frame rate. IQ is similar to the old PS5 mode, if a bit more shimmery, but sharper.
- LODs and shadow cascade retain the settings from the old PS5 mode.
The Performance Mode gets really interesting, it uses PSSR to make a much better looking image than the old native mode, while lacking RT, it boosts the LOD distance considerably, and this is the mode that is running on PSVR2, at lower frame rate than 120fps. Reflections are half rate here, same as before.
Both modes are pretty great, happy to see PD always do the most they can
For VR, now the game retains it's full graphics (before it had much lesser LOD, especially on grass and trees) and has the reprojection option.
Edit: I'm still figuring out if they upgraded the user CAR LOD in this performance mode... Meaning your cockpit will look better than on base PS5, while using the chase cam.. can anyone check?
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Senua
Gold Member
I was thinking this looks like it could be RTGI, but is it only in replays?
Skifi28
Member
I'm fairly sure it's in gameplay too. Perhaps not as accurate as in replays, but I did notice cockpits being brighter in general.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
From the patch notes for PSVR2
www.gran-turismo.com
Update Notice (1.54) - Update - Gran Turismo 7 - gran-turismo.com
A new update for Gran Turismo 7 has been released. The following is a list of the main features and adjustments introduced.Main Features Implemented1. Cars - The following five cars have been added: ・Ford Escort RS Cosworth '92 (Sold at the 'Used Cars' dealership) ・Mercedes-Benz W 196 R '55...
www.gran-turismo.com
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Viruz
Member
What a great update! I play on a budget tcl 65C745
I play in 60fps with pssr and without rt, GT7 never looked this good. The image is so clean compared to og ps5.
The image quality in 120hz mode with pssr and without rt looks like the og ps5 in 60fps.
With rt I was surprised to see the reflection of the light breaks front of me on my hood The 'resolution' or preciseness of the image looks again like the og ps5 to me but I can see why some will prefer this mode.
Good job Polyphony.
Unrelated but aside from HZFW and Ratchet the game that impressed me the most is RE2R. I played for the first time a week prior to getting the pro and it's the best upgrade. The 60fps with rt looks so good and in this game the rt doesn't alter too much the image quality.
I play in 60fps with pssr and without rt, GT7 never looked this good. The image is so clean compared to og ps5.
The image quality in 120hz mode with pssr and without rt looks like the og ps5 in 60fps.
With rt I was surprised to see the reflection of the light breaks front of me on my hood
The 'resolution' or preciseness of the image looks again like the og ps5 to me but I can see why some will prefer this mode. Good job Polyphony.
Unrelated but aside from HZFW and Ratchet the game that impressed me the most is RE2R. I played for the first time a week prior to getting the pro and it's the best upgrade. The 60fps with rt looks so good and in this game the rt doesn't alter too much the image quality.
ShakenG
Member
I did a quick comparison of the bac mono, bonnet cam. It has higher polycount on the quality mode. I look forward to doing more later but its late.
Sorry, no pics. No idea how to upload.
Edit. Wrong car, was X bow.
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it does not use RTGI, If you wanna see RTGI in Gran Turismo 7, just check all the trailers and the game intro, you will see the diference.
Is anyone able to do a before and after shots?
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DeepEnigma
Gold Member
Here is a great PowerPoint on their rendering techniques, RT, and real time skylight / atmosphere sky simulation.
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Spukc
always chasing the next thrill
Thats actual gameplay bro it does this ingame too.
Stop crying and get that ps5 pro
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SkyHighTrees
Member
I might just have to buy the Pro. From GT7 to Withcer 3, my top 2 is muuch improved.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
Yes. VR mode now runs full graphics of non-VR with better framerate and a reprojection option.
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Kaiserstark
Member
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
Looks just like the original trailer now.
Polygonal_Sprite
Gold Member
Return of the King.
With RT i suppose?
Imtjnotu
Member
The lighting more than anything.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
thats because the implementation in GT7 and Forza 8 is very limited. You are not seeing RT as it should be. Why do you think the pre-rendered opening of GT7 looks so good? Its full of high quality lighting and reflections that can only be done realtime by RT effects.
This is where you want to go. Not just reflections but also proper GI bounce lighting inside the cars. Proper RT selfshadows on trees and tracks that do proper light bounce. Forza 8 had some great lighting on the track surfaces though again because its not full RT and instead was software based GI, it was limited and didnt quite seem a next gen leap over GT7.
Senua
Gold Member
GT8 preview right there.thats because the implementation in GT7 and Forza 8 is very limited. You are not seeing RT as it should be. Why do you think the pre-rendered opening of GT7 looks so good? Its full of high quality lighting and reflections that can only be done realtime by RT effects.
This is where you want to go. Not just reflections but also proper GI bounce lighting inside the cars. Proper RT selfshadows on trees and tracks that do proper light bounce. Forza 8 had some great lighting on the track surfaces though again because its not full RT and instead was software based GI, it was limited and didnt quite seem a next gen leap over GT7.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
See below. I am sure more will come out as well when there are tech deep dive videos.
DeaDPo0L84
Member
Witcher 3 got a Pro patch? trying to find out more information about it but coming up short.
Mr Moose
Member
Last update was a year ago.
DeaDPo0L84
Member
That's what I thought, the person I quoted made it seem like it got a Pro patch.
Nice! i picked up a racing wheel for the first time in my life, after reading all the posts here about how immersive it is. A Logitech G920. Just need to figure out a chair and I’m set.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
Pretty much. Having a PS4 version put an axe on a full blown RTGI solution. Probably why the change in lighting solutions from announcement to retail when Sony decided to add a PS4 version months after announcement. Their atmosphere and sky simulations are real time, as they were in Driveclub, the lighting while still real time calculations is a dynamic solution similar to Driveclub as well.
SkyHighTrees
Member
It didn't, but the res is much better and on the Pro, it doesn't have the awful grass bug... That's my biggest reason
Senua
Gold Member
Yep it's a shame Sony decided on cross gen, because uncorked PD is just outstanding. Ignoring the PS3 titles where they struggled to grasp the hardware ofc. Gran Turismo 4 still looks good today, especially emulated. And If we ignore the crazy rain effects of Driveclub, I'd say GT Sport is similarly good looking at double the framerate. I hope GT8 is a PS6 exclusive launch title and not another cross gen victim, purely because I want to see what PD can really do with the latest hardware, unshackled.
Stooky
Member
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
If it's a launch title, it will be cross gen PS5/6, if mid cycle, it won't be.
That's more of a testament that they didn't skimp on rasterized solutions for non RT, like Cyberpunk or Control did.
Spukc
always chasing the next thrill
What fucking car is that one then?thats because the implementation in GT7 and Forza 8 is very limited. You are not seeing RT as it should be. Why do you think the pre-rendered opening of GT7 looks so good? Its full of high quality lighting and reflections that can only be done realtime by RT effects.
This is where you want to go. Not just reflections but also proper GI bounce lighting inside the cars. Proper RT selfshadows on trees and tracks that do proper light bounce. Forza 8 had some great lighting on the track surfaces though again because its not full RT and instead was software based GI, it was limited and didnt quite seem a next gen leap over GT7.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
I believe it's the Lambo V12 VGT.
Lambo V12 Vision Gran Turismo
The Lambo V12 Vision Gran Turismo is a concept car made by Lamborghini for the Vision Gran Turismo project. Launched at the 2019 FIA-Certified Gran Turismo Championships World Finals in Monaco, it was originally set to appear in Gran Turismo Sport as part of a future update, originally due to...
gran-turismo.fandom.com
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SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
Really is. I was hoping for so much more from GT7. I loved Sports which was a massive generational leap over GT6, and my heart sank when GT7 looked virtually identical.
GT8 will simply be a cross gen PS5/PS6 title and thats if we are lucky and they push the release to 2028 to launch with PS6. That would give the game a 6 year dev cycle but i think PD will have GT8 out by holiday 2027 so it will be PS5 only. it will be curious to see just how much they can get out of PS5 especially with how taxing RT can be and the fact that they need to stick to a 60 fps framerate.
Fortuneelsewhere
Member
That’s the problem.. if you need to “know what to watch” it means they are not “absolutely noticeable “…The RT differences look absolutely noticeable to me if you know what to watch
fastest finger
Member
Some minor details on the new “VR Positional Reprojection” tech used in GT7 VR on Pro.
Hopefully they can utilise this on base PS5+PSVR2 as well.
Edit - a developer has confirmed this technique is also available on base PS5, albeit at additional GPU load so not all games will be able to take advantage of it.
- Reprojection allows updating the image considering the latest head rotation when presenting the image on the screen. This shows a more natural point of view and improves comfort.
- Positional reprojection is an improvement over reprojection on PS VR as we can get positional tracking information at a high frequency, allowing us to update reprojection in six degrees of freedom.
Hopefully they can utilise this on base PS5+PSVR2 as well.
Edit - a developer has confirmed this technique is also available on base PS5, albeit at additional GPU load so not all games will be able to take advantage of it.
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CitizenKratos
Member
I’m excited to try this.
hououinkyouma00
Member
I played a couple races just now as I wanted to make sure my 30th controllers were good. One in Graphic and one in Performance and I prefer performance. Generally in racing games I'm too busy to notice stuff like RT but the RT does looks really good.
I'm gonna try out VR later today. I'm too busy playing Stalker right now anyway.
I'm gonna try out VR later today. I'm too busy playing Stalker right now anyway.