Jawbreaker
Member
No, that's never OK. It should never be tolerated.
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videogamedunkey (Dunky) Thread
- Thread starter MasterOfPastures
- Start date
No, that's never OK. It should never be tolerated.
I wouldn't call Jim Sterling video broad or appealing to outrage
Its literally focused pieces on specific subjects he finds interesting, and if he doesn't like it he will talk about it. And often gets criticized and shat on for not liking said things. Its actually literally the opposite of what you said.
A lot of his criticisms are about 5 years too late, pretty much all of the big outlets do focus on personality driven content now. His video focuses too much on review scores, you should be reading the review not an arbitrary score at the end. The score isn't often decided by the reviewer, but by a senior stuff who aim to tie all the reviews together with a score that represents and is in line with the rest of the website. Advertisers and reviewers are separate departments and have been for quite some time, so leave the unfounded gamer gate bullshit at home Dunky. YouTubers however...
The video felt like a critique on games journalism in 2005.
The video felt like a critique on games journalism in 2005.
It's quite sad that nowadays you can't point out that IGN/Gamespot/etc. are all completely crap for reviews and anyone who is using them to judge whether they should buy a game in 2017 is a Muppet without people assuming you're part of a group of misogynistic losers. Gamergate really ruined shitting on game review sites.
The only one of those sites worth anything is Polygon imo, and that's just because it hosts McElroy based let's plays.
As for dunkey saying slurs on his streams, it is shitty and I don't condone it but I also don't believe he really means any hate towards LGBT people, I think he's just an idiot. So I still enjoy his videos, as long as he isn't using language like that.
The only one of those sites worth anything is Polygon imo, and that's just because it hosts McElroy based let's plays.
As for dunkey saying slurs on his streams, it is shitty and I don't condone it but I also don't believe he really means any hate towards LGBT people, I think he's just an idiot. So I still enjoy his videos, as long as he isn't using language like that.
Well said. His video sounded like a compilation of Youtube comments. "This game sucks" 9 out 10. Or they have ads they must be paid.
I don't know of a major gaming website that doesn't have a Youtube channel or a personalty driven content.
This. l'm gay and I hate it even when my gay friends say it.
Oh and that video is ultra-reductive and aiming for the low-hanging fruit. Yet it still missed. Like a 10-minute long Twitter rant.
Yeah, that's her real voice. She has a youtube channel: https://www.youtube.com/user/xLeahbee.
---
I never really know when to take Dunkey videos seriously and when not to. There were obvious jokes in the video, some of them funny, but I don't know if the opinions here are genuine or he's making fun of them.
TheVoidDragon
Member
Isn't his that point with that part of it that it lacks consistency and it ends up being pretty meaningless? With Youtubers you can get an idea of the sort of games they like and don't like, and that can then add more weight to what they say regarding certain games. With review sites though scores can be all over the place based on whichever arbitrary reviewer got to review the game, so there's not as much context behind what they say.
There's also the problem of review sites sort of coming across as a single entity (e.g. when you think of IGN i doubt you're thinking of the individual reviewers themselves) despite that being pretty meaningless overall because of the differing opinions. So to then have someone else at the site turn around and give a complete opposite view of something at the same site just sort of defeats the point a bit.
I don't see the problem with what he's saying in the video, it makes sense to me - there's a complete lack of context and meaning to review sites with scores and what they say being arbitrary based on the random person there assigned to review a game, whereas youtubers or individual reviewers can have more weight to what they say and consistency because you sort of get to know them a bit more personally.
Same with the word "retarded." He has used it at least 2 times in his videos. One time, he was trying to impersonate someone else, but still... It's not funny.
Youtubers just seem to be incapable of learning some manners.
1. Not liking someone because their gay is not OK. Full stop. Doesnt mean you have to love every gay person. But if someone has the reason "I don't like him because he's gay", that shit doesn't fly.
2. Pointing out your token gay friend doesn't really deflect any criticism. If anything it makes you look even more tone deaf for growing up around someone like that and not understanding how you are literally excusing people choosing to hate him for being him.
People literally advocate hate and violence against LGBT persons or want them to be second class citizens because they "don't like gays". Jesus and people are wondering why this thread gets off topic with posts like these.
rakkadakka
Member
The problem of people who get a voice being a meme and then leverage it so they can be taken for realz.
I see tons of reviews critical of AAA games nowadays, so it feels like now more than ever reviewers are free to rate games how they think they should be rated. In addition to that, lots of gaming websites have podcasts where you can hear reviewers go even more in-depth about the process of writing specific reviews, if you care that much. I feel like tons of people just look at the score, decide whether to get outraged or not, then scan the article for lines that can be taken out of context to sound bad.
privitsan02
Member
If anything, that Sonic part is incredibly true. As is the Crash part. Did the guy really just play half of each game and write a review? Makes sense why he 6'd it.
Best wishes.
Best wishes.
TheVoidDragon
Member
What's the problem with that? How can what a youtube reviewer says not be more valid than a faceless entity publishing reviews from arbitrary reviewers that you know nothing about, and who's opinions vary greatly within that entity so it's pretty random what standard a game gets reviewed to? In comparison youtubers can come across as an actual person, who's likes and dislikes you can figure out and you can determine how they review their games and what they consider to be important.
He makes his point pretty clear with what he says about Persona - he doesn't like RPG games, he doesn't like Anime, and he doesn't like Turn-based games. He wouldn't usually recommend that style of game...so considering that, when he recommends Persona , you can infer that means there must be something great about it that made him change his mind about that. You can't really have that sort of thing with review sites because you tend to have absolutely no idea about a reviewers preferences.
Well said. You pay attention to who wrote it and what they've written when you look at reviews. Just going by the score will tell you nothing. We have all known this forever, Dunkey is just rehashing old criticisms.
Human Trashcan
Banned
haha no it isn't, what are you, 12?
Undead Hero
Member
Yeahh, I think this just says more about the people you hang around with. I haven't heard any of my friends use that word since high school, and I'm 32 now. Hell I can't remember the last time I've heard that word used period in real life. Words like that should be stigmatized and not accepted as just "how people talk."
Mr. Nice_Guy
Member
Then does not that not compromise the entire review? If I write a review that is critical of a game to the point of it being a "6" or a "7", and the senior staff slaps a "9" on it, then what's the point? The number summarizes your thoughts, and if it is chosen by someone else completely, then it colors your whole review; like with the NSMBU review at the end of the video. Also if the advertisers are causing the senior staff slap arbitrary numbers onto reviews, to as you say, "keep them in line with the rest of the site", then I would not call that separate. Actually sounds like the complete opposite.
Crossing Eden
Hello, my name is Yves Guillemot, Vivendi S.A.'s Employee of the Month!
Jesus fucking christ people trying to justify homophobia ITT....
It helps to actually talk to one of the many journalists that frequent this site instead of making assumptions and then telling them that their system is wrong based on those assumptions.
You are disgusting.
Crossing Eden
Hello, my name is Yves Guillemot, Vivendi S.A.'s Employee of the Month!
Would you ever tell your friend that it's ok for them to be discriminated against due to their sexuality?
Jangowuzhere
Banned
Like who? The major gaming websites are definitely not personality driven. A lot of their viewership is still based mainly on reviews and news.
And finishing a game half way just seems lame. Like, I could understand if we were talking about a huge and overly long JRPG, then maybe I could understand. However, we're talking about Crash Bandicoot here. Even all three games together is not a super long gaming experience.
No, it's not. It is factually not okay to "dislike gays." There is nothing to agree or disagree with. It is wrong to be homophobic. There is literally no argument to be had.
I suppose you think it's "okay" to not like black people too?
Holy fucking shit.
Demoskinos
Member
That's some real tolerate my intolerance shit right there man. And that is never okay.
Just to clarify since that seems to be the takeaway of a few of dunk's fans here. I don't think Dunkey IS a gamergater (and no one mentionned trump, so I don't know where that one person got that from). I don't think he's a bad person at all, just to make that clear, and I don't think most people think that. Although yeah, his shitty language shouldn't be excused at all.
But yeah I like his "hot takes" vid way less. Someone explained it way better: it's like a tweet from some random egg account...from 5 years ago
Not to say there isn't stuff to say about IGN or Gamespot's method versus independent reviewer.
But yeah I like his "hot takes" vid way less. Someone explained it way better: it's like a tweet from some random egg account...from 5 years ago
Not to say there isn't stuff to say about IGN or Gamespot's method versus independent reviewer.
DoctorFling
Member
Surprised this video is as divisive as it seems to be here. Think it's pretty reasonable.
I don't condone using slurs but in context of his videos I always saw it as parodying the usual mouthbreathers using voice chat in most online games. Part of his performance. Quite like how Jim Sterling puts on an incredibly smug act in his videos but is a pretty humble dude in reality.
I don't condone using slurs but in context of his videos I always saw it as parodying the usual mouthbreathers using voice chat in most online games. Part of his performance. Quite like how Jim Sterling puts on an incredibly smug act in his videos but is a pretty humble dude in reality.
Fantastapotamus
Wrong about commas, wrong about everything
I can only figure out the likes and dislikes of a Youtuber if I watch all his videos - I can do the same thing by reading all the reviews a random IGN reviewer has written.
Why is it apparently a complete hassle to figure out what Peter Brown from Gamespot likes but super easy and obvious what AngryJohn likes and dislikes?
I have maybe watched 3 videos of this guy so far, how am I supposed to know that he doesn't like anime? By following him and watching his stuff. Same can be done with any reviewer out there if I want to. If I don't want to do that, his opinion on Persona 5 tells me just as much as a review written by "IGN Staff". It's ludicrous to assume that I instantly know what a Youtuber likes and dislikes just because he "is a person" and not a "faceless organisation"
MadJackChurchill
Banned
Thank you for simultaneously saying "I don't support what he says" while also speaking for him. Bizarre contradiction there.
Uno Venova
Banned
That twitch link really derailed things. Guess I need to wait this whole ordeal out, this conversation is boring.
I don't know if it's because we're from separate parts of the country but growing up faggot and gay have 2 completely different meanings to me. You can be a faggot and not be gay. I've never used the word "faggot" towards a gay dude.
uomoartificiale
Member
His video reads like Gerstmann was never fired and never funded giantbomb. Also, Peter Brown is very knowledgeable about the history of games and one of the best reviewer in "corporate" mainstream games media. Even if he's at fault here, he's definitely not the right target for this kind of criticism.
I subscribed yesterday to his channel because I saw one of his funny videos, very stupid but also quite funny. This thread gave me the heads up about his LOL ban video and now I unsubscribed.
The most frightening thing of all though is reading the YouTube comments section of these videos. These kids reason in a way that is beyond any possibility of being corrected once they'll become adults, they'll "grow up" and still think that SJW and feminazis ruined it for everyone.
I subscribed yesterday to his channel because I saw one of his funny videos, very stupid but also quite funny. This thread gave me the heads up about his LOL ban video and now I unsubscribed.
The most frightening thing of all though is reading the YouTube comments section of these videos. These kids reason in a way that is beyond any possibility of being corrected once they'll become adults, they'll "grow up" and still think that SJW and feminazis ruined it for everyone.
air jordans for dogs
Member
I don't understand why people are derailing the thread with something he said months ago on a stream, I really don't think he hates gay people. Are people bringing it up because they disagree with this video or is it just one of those Boogeyman situations?
You used it for :
(relevant to your profile picture)
Yes, the best explanation of the word was in that episode of South Park
Nitpicker_Red
Member
(Answering to bold) Yeah it seems to me like this is another case of Procès d'Intention sophism. (Trial of Intent)
I haven't found a similar concept in english yet, so if someone knows...
But it's the idea that you can discredit a person's action by claiming that their intentions are the most nefarious and shameful. (For example "he donated for the fame")
It's a fallacy if you cannot prove or verify the person's intentions.
But if you can (for example by highlighting a person's actions), then it can serve as proof.
Is it insensitivity? Is it non-correctness? Is it internet slang? Is it hatred? Is Dunkey really prejudiced against homosexuals (=homophobe)?
Procès d'intention.
Another point of contention is the usage of "faggot" at all.
Because unfortunately "OP is a bundle of sticks" and similar are a common saying in a lot of "open to everyone" internet communities (reddit, image sites like imgur, Youtube comments, Twitch chat).
I'm thankful that Neogaf (hiveminding it) takes to heart to avoid such language. We can do without.
But outside of Neogaf, I'm not sure the same rules applies.
So Yeah, if Dunkey was a Gaffer, that would totally be unnacceptable here. The word is considered harmful just to use after all. So if you don't want to look at his videos anymore, because he doesn't have the same "bases" as you, that's reasonnable.
Also, people defending the word because they want to defend Dunkey, don't do it that way... You are getting your priorities mixed up.
SafeinSound
Member
Love all the posts about how this video is useless. Actually it's not, because it sheds more light on how fucking useless review scores actually are. But hey, keep posting in those review threads and getting upset when your favorite series doesn't get the score you want. The worst people.
lifetimeofnot
Member
It seems weird to me to show a review from 2006 then a clip from somewhere around 2013 if not earlier and complain that there's a contradiction. Opinions change about games over time especally nearly a decade later. Yes websites like ign have a lot of different employees that makes them stronger because they have more people with more diverse views on games. Dunkey says he doesn't like rpgs so he doesn't talk about them which is fine, but if someone at ign doesn't like a genera there are 20 other people who do so they can give the game the proper coverage. I don't know anyone who looks at just one game review and decides if they are going to buy a game so I'm not sure why he's getting hung up on individual scores so much. I don't know anyone who looks at one review for any product and decides it's worth there money for that matter.
Someone mentioned big sites like ign not being personality driven. This seems weird to me since they had two of the biggest personalitys in gaming at there site at one point (Greg and colin). Ign continues to have podcasts with a small rotation of people. When I think of ign I think of daemon Hatfield, dan Stapleton, Sam, peir, Marty, Brian, Andrew and allana just off the top of my head, not some faceless corporation. Dan Stapleton is seen on reddit fairly often engainging with people about ign reviews (he's the reviews editor last time I checked.) Having a large group of people means it's harder to stand out but it doesn't mean that nobody who works there does.
Finally onto the topic of racism and homophobia. People are so quick to jump to throwing those words around nowadays. Dunkeybis most likely neither of those things. The language he uses is incredibly intolerant. Being intollerent of others is still awful but it doesn't mean he's actively trying to hurt people, that distinction is important. Intollerence also should not be brushed off. I'm probably going to stop watching this guys stuff because I don't want to give him money.
Someone mentioned big sites like ign not being personality driven. This seems weird to me since they had two of the biggest personalitys in gaming at there site at one point (Greg and colin). Ign continues to have podcasts with a small rotation of people. When I think of ign I think of daemon Hatfield, dan Stapleton, Sam, peir, Marty, Brian, Andrew and allana just off the top of my head, not some faceless corporation. Dan Stapleton is seen on reddit fairly often engainging with people about ign reviews (he's the reviews editor last time I checked.) Having a large group of people means it's harder to stand out but it doesn't mean that nobody who works there does.
Finally onto the topic of racism and homophobia. People are so quick to jump to throwing those words around nowadays. Dunkeybis most likely neither of those things. The language he uses is incredibly intolerant. Being intollerent of others is still awful but it doesn't mean he's actively trying to hurt people, that distinction is important. Intollerence also should not be brushed off. I'm probably going to stop watching this guys stuff because I don't want to give him money.
IGN with their almost daily lives streams, weekly podcasts and other personality driven web shows. A reviewer is no longer just expected to just write, but also partake in videos and podcasts. Hell IGN even have their own snapchat team. GameSpot is the same (maybe to a lesser extent). The personality stuff is there, it might not be as accessible as it should be, but it's there.
Dangansona
Member
Yeah statements like that makes it seem like it's just another games sites vs. us YouTubers video. And guess what? A lot of publications follow that system across all entertainment mediums for reviews. I'm about to go read movie reviews from one of the people who contribute to the NYT. Maybe if I do or don't like what I read I'll make a note of that person.
Also he props himself up for exploring the scale but then calls out Peter (who im not familiar with) for giving Crash a 6. Exactly the same score he flashed up on screen for several of his own reviews. I don't agree with it but it's Peter's opinion on the game.
Jangowuzhere
Banned
Yes, that stuff is there, but that still doesn't make these sites personality driven. The majority of people visiting these sites are doing so for reviews, trailers, news, guides, etc.
You visit the front page of IGN and Gamespot, and there is barely a hint of personality based videos. Most content is various 10 ten lists, news articles, and reviews.
Well, then we agree to disagree. People are allowed their opinions right or wrong.
Yea. There are violent acts which are immediately more scary, but saying awful things about gay people, saying you don't like gay people, and using gay people as words to mean people who suck, are bad, are monstrous, or are weak are what really fuck with you. People's words are what hurt the most.
ldcommando
Banned
Great video by dunkey again.
The video came off very "fake news, fuck the media" to me.
And this thread is getting thoroughly weird with mother fuckers popping up with homophobia and slur defenses like they've never been on GAF before. Lol, gtfo.
I have a hard time believing that people who say stuff like this don't realize how much of a nonsense non-statement it is.
And this thread is getting thoroughly weird with mother fuckers popping up with homophobia and slur defenses like they've never been on GAF before. Lol, gtfo.
I have a hard time believing that people who say stuff like this don't realize how much of a nonsense non-statement it is.