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[Kotaku] Concord Director Steps Down As Studio Behind Historic PlayStation Flop Waits For Sony's Decision

blacktout

Member
Because everybody knows why. I was responding to someone.
Everyone knows what?

That's not an answer to my question.

Are you going to claim that Stray is a well-known game?

What does this even mean? Relative to what standard? Stray is exceptionally well known (and sold exceptionally well) for a game from a small team and studio. Concord is well known by the standard of major first party releases not tied to a huge existing IP (like Mario or Spider-Man) and sold obscenely poorly by that standard. That's my point.
 
What an honourable human, 'so uh guys, I'm no longer going to be the game director for Concord' bruh, concord is already dead, no shit, none of you are going to be game developers on Concord, or any other game if dev studios have any sense, Herman Hulst should be sacked as well.
 

Killjoy-NL

Gold Member
Everyone knows what?
Why the game bombed.

What does this even mean? Relative to what standard? Stray is exceptionally well known (and sold exceptionally well) for a game from a small team and studio. Concord is well known by the standard of major first party releases not tied to a huge existing IP (like Mario or Spider-Man) and sold obscenely poorly by that standard. That's my point.
4M copies isn't exceptionally well and the game is nowhere near well-known, that's why you had to add "for a game from a small team and studio" to try and give it a bit more weight.

Concord is a major flop and the first release of a completely unknown studio that happened to be acquired by Sony.
 

blacktout

Member
Why the game bombed.

I mean, you don't seem to, since you're arguing that it flopped from a lack of visibility, when that clearly was not a significant contributing factor.

4M copies isn't exceptionally well and the game is nowhere near well-known, that's why you had to add "for a game from a small team and studio" to try and give it a bit more weight.

Concord is a major flop and the first release of a completely unknown studio that happened to be acquired by Sony.

Do you not realize that all sales performance is relative to budget, promotion, and expectations? I think you're just playing rhetorical games now.

If you want, I will call Stray a "well known game," and I can do that with complete honesty, because that phrase means absolutely nothing without a standard to judge it by, and any standard you introduce will make Concord's performance relative to its visibility look truly horrendous.
 
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Killjoy-NL

Gold Member
I mean, you don't seem to, since you're arguing that it flopped from a lack of visibility, when that clearly was not a significant contributing factor.
Not at all, I was saying it's a factor. The other guy said it sold maybe 20K copies, to which I replied 'most people don't even know it exists'. So a low number is a given based on that alone.

And then there's literally every other reason why the game failed, which has been discussed to death already.
Do you not realize that all sales performance is relative to budget, promotion, and expectations? I think you're just playing rhetorical games now.

If you want, I will call Stray a "well known game," and I can do that with complete honesty, because that phrase means absolutely nothing without a standard to judge it by, and any standard you introduce will make Concord's performance relative to its visibility look truly horrendous.
I said it in regards to the hate bandwagon not being as big as some people think it is.
Because most people don't care and aren't aware the game even exists.

You then decided to turn this into some pointless discussion, because the game is dead anyway.
 
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FewRope

Member
Astro Bot is proof how much amazing talent still recides in Japan that Sony leaves completely underutilized. Says something when their top two games this gen (Gran Turismo 7 and Astro Bot) are both made in Japan. Meanwhile God knows how many millions Sony has blown on these failed GAAS games. I'm guessing the budget for Factions must've been similar given the many years it was in development. And all that money wasted on Bungie. It just makes me sad to think about. The fate that befell Sony. So much short term greed thinking, so little about the actual quality of games.
Yeah, I think Sony it's done for. They have the market share but that isnt granted, I think they are done for, not in the short term, but it is coming
 
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Filben

Member
Wether he's a good human or not doesn't add to much in three-digit-million dollar industry that needs to sell millions of copies. This is literally a shark tank. Sink or swim.

If you want true creativity, want to inspire people and show your heart of hearts, go indie.
 
Wether he's a good human or not doesn't add to much in three-digit-million dollar industry that needs to sell millions of copies. This is literally a shark tank. Sink or swim.

If you want true creativity, want to inspire people and show your heart of hearts, go indie.
I know plenty of great people who could not throw hard enough to play in the majors who now are selling insurance

These people at FW don't deserve another chance after 8 years and 250 million if this is their visions of what we gamers want
 

near

Gold Member
I know plenty of great people who could not throw hard enough to play in the majors who now are selling insurance

These people at FW don't deserve another chance after 8 years and 250 million if this is their visions of what we gamers want
So Ryan Ellis should end he's career as a game designer because he was part of a team that created a complete dud? He's ability to design games isn't defined by the time and cost it took to create Concord.
 
I'm assuming all the higher ups started their job search before Concord even launched. Reaction to the beta basically guaranteed that this thing was going to land like a meteor.
 
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So Ryan Ellis should end he's career as a game designer because he was part of a team that created a complete dud? He's ability to design games isn't defined by the time and cost it took to create Concord.
Someone would be pretty stupid to let him run a studio again with this happening under his watch

Go back to doing what he does best

As far as the people who actually designed this game, maybe some of those people are talented enough to find other work but the vast majority of them should be out of the game business

I have no sympathy for colossal mega ton failures

If none of those people stepped back, especially the head of the studio, and say wait a minute, this game wont do well then no they shouldn't be making gaming decisions
 

DonkeyPunchJr

World’s Biggest Weeb
I'm assuming all the higher ups started their job search before Concord even launched. Reaction to the beta basically guaranteed that this thing was going to land like a meteor.
Less than 3000 concurrent players max on Steam during the free open beta. I can’t believe they even bothered launching the game after that. I’m sure Sony is regretting that decision and wishing they could erase Concord from people’s memory. They should’ve delayed it indefinitely and quietly canceled it when nobody was looking.

Man, I can’t imagine the mood at Firewalk on launch day. Probably felt more like a funeral than a celebration.
 
Less than 3000 concurrent players max on Steam during the free open beta. I can’t believe they even bothered launching the game after that. I’m sure Sony is regretting that decision and wishing they could erase Concord from people’s memory. They should’ve delayed it indefinitely and quietly canceled it when nobody was looking.

Man, I can’t imagine the mood at Firewalk on launch day. Probably felt more like a funeral than a celebration.

Agreed. Not to mention buzz from the small group playing it wasn't exactly upbeat.
 

saintjules

Gold Member
Who was that outspoken dev from that team that wasn't giving a shit on what people thought about the game? Saw a tweet a few weeks back right around release I think.
 
Who was that outspoken dev from that team that wasn't giving a shit on what people thought about the game? Saw a tweet a few weeks back right around release I think.
Oh we had the one calling us talentless freaks for not liking the game.

Then there was the one a few years ago preaching about White privilege

Then we have the professor who hated guns, tried getting people fired over their vax status and held classes where she demanded people call her The Professor

wR6k4Nf.png
KK06Elj.png
 

BigBeauford

Gold Member
150 people making a full time salary. What exactly are they doing now? Going to the office and doing what? They’re not working on Concord obviously. They’re not making a new game. So what are they drawing a salary for?

1ec6fb5195f1fea8d57438316b79192d.gif
You know they are wearing out the Foosball, bean bag chairs, and Keurigs right now.
 

NickFire

Member
Oh we had the one calling us talentless freaks for not liking the game.

Then there was the one a few years ago preaching about White privilege

Then we have the professor who hated guns, tried getting people fired over their vax status and held classes where she demanded people call her The Professor

wR6k4Nf.png
KK06Elj.png
I'll never stop being dumbfounded by the industry's decision to put people who act like that in upper level creative positions at development studios. They seem completely detached (IMO) from a massive percentage of their target audience, and in some cases seem to have outright disdain for the audience. It's even more bizarre that they didn't course correct at some point. They had plenty of warning if they actually paid attention to what succeeds and underperforms.

I would think a lot of people involved with Concord could still have a bright future in the industry though. They just need to learn from their mistakes and take a couple lessons to heart. No one owes them a single penny or minute of their time just because they got funding and made a game, so they better make games the audience wants. And get out of their stupid bubbles and use common sense.
 

DonkeyPunchJr

World’s Biggest Weeb
Someone would be pretty stupid to let him run a studio again with this happening under his watch

Go back to doing what he does best

As far as the people who actually designed this game, maybe some of those people are talented enough to find other work but the vast majority of them should be out of the game business

I have no sympathy for colossal mega ton failures

If none of those people stepped back, especially the head of the studio, and say wait a minute, this game wont do well then no they shouldn't be making gaming decisions

I might have some sympathy if they had some ambitious new game concept that was flawed in its execution, or if this were a case where they had to make some cuts to the game’s scope/quality due to the harsh realities of budget + release schedules. But FFS they managed to make a game that gamers just have zero interest in, from the very first reveal trailer.

I work in R&D in a different industry, and rule #1 is you NEED to know what the hell your customer wants, how they’re using your previous products, what they like and dislike about your products and your competitors’, etc. And you make a great effort to learn those things and seek your audience’s input and feedback along the way.

That Firewalk could spend 8 years and $100M+ and apparently not have the slightest clue what their customers wanted just beggars belief. Total incompetence and dysfunctional company culture from top to bottom.
 

DeepEnigma

Gold Member
I might have some sympathy if they had some ambitious new game concept that was flawed in its execution, or if this were a case where they had to make some cuts to the game’s scope/quality due to the harsh realities of budget + release schedules. But FFS they managed to make a game that gamers just have zero interest in, from the very first reveal trailer.

I work in R&D in a different industry, and rule #1 is you NEED to know what the hell your customer wants, how they’re using your previous products, what they like and dislike about your products and your competitors’, etc. And you make a great effort to learn those things and seek your audience’s input and feedback along the way.

That Firewalk could spend 8 years and $100M+ and apparently not have the slightest clue what their customers wanted just beggars belief. Total incompetence and dysfunctional company culture from top to bottom.
One of the many side effects when you and the people you surround yourself with are in that of a bubble. This is going to be biting a lot more western studios, and possibly a reason we are not seeing much of other games, due to a "call to arms" of having to gut and restructure what they have done so far, since they are realizing that shit isn't going to fly.

Once again, where new players in the East will eat up those in the West if they don't course correct.
 
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SSfox

Member
So let me get this straight

Sony shut Down the historical Japan Studio

And also the amazing Evolution Studios

And London Studios even tho it's not the most iconic studio in the world, but they done lot of decent things, that are easily far more worth than Concord and specially, waaaaaaaaaaaaay less expansive...


AND THEY STILL DIDN'T SHUT DOWN THIS SHITTY STUDIO FIREWALK ALREADY?????!!!!!!!!!!!!! HOW THE FUCK?????????????
 
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Longcat

Member
I hate woke stuff as much as the next guy, but really, do you plan on buying Fair Games? It’s not woke, so surely it’ll be fun, right?
I don't really play multiplayer games, so they'll have to show me something spectacular to make me interested. What I've seen so far reeks of Ubislop.
 

Radical_3d

Member
I don't really play multiplayer games, so they'll have to show me something spectacular to make me interested. What I've seen so far reeks of Ubislop.
See? It’s not because it was woke. It’s because Jim Ryan and Hermen Hulst are retarded. And they should be feathered publicly for their great idea of GaaS in a company that made its name with single player movie-like games.
 

ArtHands

Thinks buying more servers can fix a bad patch
So let me get this straight

Sony shut Down the historical Japan Studio

And also the amazing Evolution Studios

And London Studios even tho it's not the most iconic studio in the world, but they done lot of decent things, that are easily far more worth than Concord and specially, waaaaaaaaaaaaay less expansive...


AND THEY STILL DIDN'T SHUT DOWN THIS SHITTY STUDIO FIREWALK ALREADY?????!!!!!!!!!!!!! HOW THE FUCK?????????????

Man the way you say that, I guess Sony will be shutting down this studio.
 

near

Gold Member
Someone would be pretty stupid to let him run a studio again with this happening under his watch

Go back to doing what he does best

As far as the people who actually designed this game, maybe some of those people are talented enough to find other work but the vast majority of them should be out of the game business

I have no sympathy for colossal mega ton failures

If none of those people stepped back, especially the head of the studio, and say wait a minute, this game wont do well then no they shouldn't be making gaming decisions
Ryan Ellis was the game director not the studio head.
 

StreetsofBeige

Gold Member
Sony gotta make a huge decision really soon.

Either support role, new game or complete closure.
Easy decision for me.

Cherry pick the people who did awesome mo cap and texture graphics. Transition them to another studio.

All the rest.... character designers (ouch), art director (worst colour palette ever in a shooter), political workers who just whine about pronouns and DEI (poison), the people who decided spending time and money on YT clips instead of the game (cant set priorities), the project managers who let this game take forever to make at incredible costs (no idea what they are doing), and any other role should all get fired pronto.

Then again, maybe Sony is in a giving mood. Ryan Ellis Art Director somehow kept his job. The worst thing about Concord right at face value was graphics. Everyone said it was lousy and got a good laugh at it. How he keeps his job is incredible. Or perhaps he's just the biggest ass licker and got pitied a new role.
 
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near

Gold Member
Because it was trash

Woke was just in the list of many reasons it was horrible, thus it sold poorly.
Shinji Mikami should’ve retired after God Hand because it was trash, right? Also, a game can be great and still sell poorly, it isn’t a good metric to measure quality. The woke direction Concord took is due to our current social climate. There is nothing career ending here for Ryan Ellis, he still has a future in the business and having played Destiny 2 in it’s prime when he was involved, I’d still want him to lead projects again in the future.
 

StreetsofBeige

Gold Member
Shinji Mikami should’ve retired after God Hand because it was trash, right? Also, a game can be great and still sell poorly, it isn’t a good metric to measure quality. The woke direction Concord took is due to our current social climate. There is nothing career ending here for Ryan Ellis, he still has a future in the business and having played Destiny 2 in it’s prime when he was involved, I’d still want him to lead projects again in the future.
There's more to woke that killed the game.

The characters were ugly, colour palette (characters and maps) were the worst ever with a pastel faded look to them, the handful of modes were cookie cutter, and some gameplay designs like forcing gamers to change characters after each win isnt the type of feature all shooter fans like (I wouldnt like it in my shooter game). The beta also didn't have join in progress matches. So if a player quits, his team is shorthanded all match. They fixed that in the final game, but too late.

If Firewalk couldnt figure it out to adjust any of this stuff in years, thats on them being stubborn idiots. Releasing info to the masses for the first time 3 months before launch is incredibly weird. And was fatal.

This game is trash. It got reviewed terribly, looked bad, had meh gameplay, priced at $40. Add it up and gamers stayed away. The only good thing about the game was the mo cap and custom Concord gamepad.

Probably the first time in gaming history its gamepad is better than the game.
 
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Shinji Mikami should’ve retired after God Hand because it was trash, right? Also, a game can be great and still sell poorly, it isn’t a good metric to measure quality. The woke direction Concord took is due to our current social climate. There is nothing career ending here for Ryan Ellis, he still has a future in the business and having played Destiny 2 in it’s prime when he was involved, I’d still want him to lead projects again in the future.


If making the biggest flop of the decade isn't a reason for layoff I don't know what is.

"due to our current social climate" what???? You make a product for people, not for social display and twitter shares. In fact, this mindset alone should be enough to end someone's career, for being on the opposite end of what entertainment is all about.
 
Marvel Rivals will tell the tale of whether the market is oversaturated with hero shooters. If it does well, that narrative needs to die a quick death.
I'm sure the people that defend this game will then turn to the $40 price tag, but that still doesn't explain why few cared to play it when there was a free beta. Meanwhile Marvel Rival's beta required you to watch streams to play it and still had tons of people partipating in it.

In the end, the game as a whole was trash.
 

near

Gold Member
"due to our current social climate" what???? You make a product for people, not for social display and twitter shares. In fact, this mindset alone should be enough to end someone's career, for being on the opposite end of what entertainment is all about.
Every major studio is pushing this sort of content now. A lot of mainstream games have to fulfil a quota. It doesn't always represent the quality/skill of the staff involved in some of those projects. Should Neil Druckmann step down because of all the woke shit in TLOU2?
 

StreetsofBeige

Gold Member
Marvel Rivals will tell the tale of whether the market is oversaturated with hero shooters. If it does well, that narrative needs to die a quick death.
I'm sure the people that defend this game will then turn to the $40 price tag, but that still doesn't explain why few cared to play it when there was a free beta. Meanwhile Marvel Rival's beta required you to watch streams to play it and still had tons of people partipating in it.

In the end, the game as a whole was trash.
That Steam Deadlock game is an alpha test shadow drop. And supposedly to play it you have to get a steam friend invite. 120,000 CCU right now and holding pretty well for 3 weeks straight at this level.

Biggest problem for Concord was graphics, characters, and the pronoun bit added fuel to the fire. All the laughs were going on before the beta was even available. People stayed away. Anyone involved with the artwork should be fired easy, unless it's a drone asked to do some clever visuals, or the mo cap team. But anyone with an ounce of pull who designed the characters or chose the watered down faded look to the game should be gone.
 
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DeepEnigma

Gold Member
Every major studio is pushing this sort of content now. A lot of mainstream games have to fulfil a quota. It doesn't always represent the quality/skill of the staff involved in some of those projects. Should Neil Druckmann step down because of all the woke shit in TLOU2?
This could be the reason why we're not seeing anything out of their backbone studios. Maybe a few adjustments are being done behind the scenes after seeing these trainwrecks.
 
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