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[GitarooMan]

PSP Top 10 is always good for a laugh. And Boom Blox, yikes, I knew the "worst box art 2009" award would come back to haunt them.

 

[nincompoop]

is that for the Wii version, the PS2 version, or both combined?

I'd like to know this too. It's obviously not the Wii version by itself since it wasn't released in Japan.

 

[Karma]

Man, it really sucks that Killzone 2 hasn't had very good legs. The game has done well for a Sony first party title, but it should have done a lot better. It's easily one of the best, if not the best, console FPS and it has the best graphics of any console game to boot. That's generally a recipe for insanely good sales, but as it currently stands KZ2 has merely done okay.

Gotta chalk this up to a failure on Sony's marketing.

Or maybe people did not like the demo.

 

[GameGamer]

Man, it really sucks that Killzone 2 hasn't had very good legs. The game has done well for a Sony first party title, but it should have done a lot better. It's easily one of the best, if not the best, console FPS and it has the best graphics of any console game to boot. That's generally a recipe for insanely good sales, but as it currently stands KZ2 has merely done okay.

Gotta chalk this up to a failure on Sony's marketing.

I think it did not have good word of mouth like a COD etc.

I found the game of quality, but very boring. I didn't talk about it or recommend it to anyone. I think others felt the same way and word just didn't spread around.

 

[OldJadedGamer]

dp

 

[OldJadedGamer]

Since I'm not an Xbox 360 owner I can't speak to this personally, but I was told at some point that the cards for GTA:TLATD were actually just points cards that could be used toward the purchase of the game, but could actually be used for anything.

I bought TLAD code from Amazon cause they had a promotion where I also got a 3 month card to live. It had a little box, a big fold out poster of TLAD and had the map of the city on the other side then a code for the content. Not a point card, but for the content exactly.

I got it delivered to my work, I redeemed the code at Xbox.com then called my roommate to go into my room and turn my 360 on. Didn't want to wait to download over a gig. So when I got home from work, the game was already downloaded and ready to play.

Or maybe people did not like the demo.

This was me. Had the game pre-ordered then canceled it after playing the demo and not liking it then borrowed the full version from a friend played like 2 levels and that was all I needed.

Gotta chalk this up to a failure on Sony's marketing.

Is this going to be the new meme for any PS3 exclusive that under performs in sales now?

 

[JoJo13]

I think it did not have good word of mouth like a COD etc.

I found the game of quality, but very boring. I didn't talk about it or recommend it to anyone. I think others felt the same way and word just didn't spread around.

The game was universally praised. You'll find people that find CoD4, Halo, whatever boring. It's not about that.

 

[dammitmattt]

The game was universally praised. You'll find people that find CoD4, Halo, whatever boring. It's not about that.

Actually, it might just be. It's MUCH easier to jump into COD4 online than Killzone 2 online, and there's just so many more people playing COD4 that it's tough to break into that market with a similar game.

You also have to realize that there's frequently a pretty big disparity between game reviewer opinion and that of the general American public.

 

[DemonSwordsman]

Actually, it might just be. It's MUCH easier to jump into COD4 online than Killzone 2 online, and there's just so many more people playing COD4 that it's tough to break into that market with a similar game.

You also have to realize that there's frequently a pretty big disparity between game reviewer opinion and that of the general American public.

The only problem with KZ2 was that the way the game plays is not FPS noob friendly like COD4 is. You have to play it a bit and learn. So lot of people who are not really hardcore that like COD tried it out and had trouble because it was very different.

I really like the weight and control of KZ though. Its good to have games that play completely different.

 

[JoJo13]

Actually, it might just be. It's MUCH easier to jump into COD4 online than Killzone 2 online, and there's just so many more people playing COD4 that it's tough to break into that market with a similar game.

You also have to realize that there's frequently a pretty big disparity between game reviewer opinion and that of the general American public.

I don't think it's difficult to jump into a game of KZ2, nor do I really notice the difference between playing in a community that has 10,000 active users at any one time or 100,000 at any one time. Also, KZ2's multiplayer is pretty unique in comparison to other titles.

Call of Duty has built up brand name recognition over the years. Halo had great brand recognition built up over the years. There's a point where 'first mover' status matters (being the first few FPS titles next-gen is important and KZ2 may have been late to the party), and as we have seen with games like UFC, brand name is hugely important. KZ2 has no brand name -- that was Sony's job to get it out there somehow. In fact, KZ2 was at a disadvantage from the start thanks to the tepid (at best) response to the original. So it had kind of a negative name brand recognition going in.

All in all, KZ2 did well and I'm sure it's made Sony a profit, but it didn't set the world on fire like it had the potential to.

 

[RBH]

I don't think it's difficult to jump into a game of KZ2, nor do I really notice the difference between playing in a community that has 10,000 active users at any one time or 100,000 at any one time. Also, KZ2's multiplayer is pretty unique in comparison to other titles.

Call of Duty has built up brand name recognition over the years. Halo had great brand recognition built up over the years. There's a point where 'first mover' status matters (being the first few FPS titles next-gen is important and KZ2 may have been late to the party), and as we have seen with games like UFC, brand name is hugely important. KZ2 has no brand name -- that was Sony's job to get it out there somehow. In fact, KZ2 was at a disadvantage from the start thanks to the tepid (at best) response to the original. So it had kind of a negative name brand recognition going in.

All in all, KZ2 did well and I'm sure it's made Sony a profit, but it didn't set the world on fire like it had the potential to.

Nobody here on GAF is sure of that.

 

[Opiate]

The game was universally praised. You'll find people that find CoD4, Halo, whatever boring. It's not about that.

Honest question -- why are games like Left 4 Dead, CoD4 and Halo showing such better legs than KZ2 then? If this were a marketing failure, you'd expect the positive word of mouth to propel the game beyond the modest initial sales provided by its marketing. All of the aforementioned titles besides Killzone exhibited this sales pattern, be they Killzone2 big (L4D has sold in KZ2's ballpark) much bigger than KZ2 (Halo) or much, much bigger than KZ2 (CoD4).

For Killzone 2, the opposite seems to be true: the game is showing particularly poor legs for a high budget shooter with a strong multiplayer component. CoD4, Halo and L4D aren't getting marketing any longer, but they keep on selling. Again, why isn't KZ2 doing the same?

 

[JoJo13]

Honest question -- why are CoD4 and Halo showing such better legs than KZ2 then? If this were a marketing failure, you'd expect the positive word of mouth to propel the game beyond the modest initial sales provided by its marketing.

But the opposite seems to be true here: the game is showing particularly poor legs for a high budget shooter with strong multiplayer component. Again, why?

Because they're brand names and heavily discounted right now? It seems to me as though Halo 3 is a big mover with new 360 sales, and ditto for CoD4.

By building up their brand name over the years, they've amassed a huge fan base that has allowed for much greater 'word of mouth' of new console owners; their friends all have Halo or CoD, so they are picking up systems and buying these games alongside them. KZ2 doesn't have this advantage.

 

[Opiate]

Because they're brand names and heavily discounted right now? It seems to me as though Halo 3 is a big mover with new 360 sales, and ditto for CoD4.

CoD wasn't nearly the brand name it is now until CoD4 hit. The same could have happened to KZ2; the series could have taken a significant jump in prestige. Why didn't it?

And how do you explain Left 4 Dead (I edited this in), a completely original IP that theoretically -- using your logic -- should have had even less brand sway than KZ2?

By building up their brand name over the years, they've amassed a huge fan base that has allowed for much greater 'word of mouth' of new console owners; their friends all have Halo or CoD, so they are picking up systems and buying these games alongside them. KZ2 doesn't have this advantage.

Let's just assume you're right for the moment and throw out CoD4 and Halo 3 because they have an unfair advantage. Again, what about Left 4 Dead?

 

[AltogetherAndrews]

For Killzone 2, the opposite seems to be true: the game is showing particularly poor legs for a high budget shooter with a strong multiplayer component. CoD4, Halo and L4D aren't getting marketing any longer, but they keep on selling. Again, why isn't KZ2 doing the same?

Because PS3 owners are former PS2 owners who are still in denial about the system and are subsequently still waiting for the arrival of the games expected of a straight sequel to the PS2. Games like KZ2 do not fit into this. It's not the only reason, but I'm convinced that there is something to it.

 

[boiled goose]

I think KZ2 might show less legs because of PS3 exclusivity.

There are just less PS3s out there. This means less exposure, less word of mouth, less potential sales base, etc.

If your friends are playing call of duty on 360, you can buy it on your ps3. (A theory..)

 

[Beer Monkey]

Honest question -- why are games like Left 4 Dead, CoD4 and Halo showing such better legs than KZ2 then?

They are more fun for mainstream gamers. But you know this.

I rented K2. It's an amazing looking game, but it didn't have the accessible feel that many other shooters have. Sure, there are serious hardcore L4D, CoD4, and Halo players, but they are also very easy to "get into".

Accessibility = viral word of mouth.

 

[viciouskillersquirrel]

Because PS3 owners are former PS2 owners who are still in denial about the system and are subsequently still waiting for the arrival of the games expected of a straight sequel to the PS2. Games like KZ2 do not fit into this. It's not the only reason, but I'm convinced that there is something to it.

What games, exactly would these be?

 

[JoJo13]

CoD wasn't nearly the brand name it is now until CoD4 hit. The same could have happened to KZ2; the series could have taken a significant jump in prestige. Why didn't it?

Call of Duty 2 was the biggest selling launch title on the 360, IIRC. It sold significant units. It had built up brand name recognition. CoD4 continued that momentum, and obviously the better online play was a big contributing factor.

And how do you explain Left 4 Dead (I edited this in), a completely original IP that theoretically -- using your logic -- should have had even less brand sway than KZ2?

Sure, let's look at L4D's sales. L4D is essentially an Xbox 360 exclusive. Killzone 2 is a PS3 exclusive. Xbox 360 has twice the userbase as the PS3 in North America (roughly).


November:
X360: Left 4 Dead - 410k

December:
Left 4 Dead - Xbox 360 – Electronic Arts – 629K

January:
Left 4 Dead (360) 243k

Total first three month sales ~ 1282k. Great sales for a new IP, but obviously not Call of Duty or Halo numbers.


Coincidentally, Killzone 2 has sold roughly 700k in a similar timeframe.

So, having half the userbase KZ2 managed to do a bit better than half the sales of L4D. Userbase puts things into perspective a bit (though, it's not the only factor obviously).

Also, Sony's release timing was rather poor - games do get elevated sales during the holiday period. L4D benefitted from this, as did Resistance 2 and LittleBigPlanet (both of which have sold over 700k, IIRC, and I think that in a non-holiday time period neither would have done as well as that). Killzone 2 did not have that luxury.

There's also the situation of demographics. The Xbox brand was almost exclusively built around the success of the FPS. Playstation, not so much as its success was merely having a wealth of diverse titles but not overbearing success of just one particular genre.

As I mentioned previously, CoD4 and Halo 3 are selling quite well because of their lower price and their brand name recognition, thus I'm sure they have great attachment rates to new console owners. Since these titles came out of the gate first and established themselves over many different titles and even over the course of a different generation in Halo's case, they've been established as 'THE' titles to get when you buy a new system because their legs feed off the 10+ million or whatever userbase that is spreading the word.

 

[AltogetherAndrews]

What games, exactly would these be?

Japanese crap, I suppose. Hey, I'm happy that the system is nothing like a PS2.

 

[OldJadedGamer]

Also, Sony's release timing was rather poor - games do get elevated sales during the holiday period. L4D benefitted from this, as did Resistance 2 and LittleBigPlanet (both of which have sold over 700k, IIRC, and I think that in a non-holiday time period neither would have done as well as that). Killzone 2 did not have that luxury.

Release months have nothing to do with it. Exactly one year earliar in March of 2008 Rainbow Six Vegas 2 sold 750k and Army of Two sold around 630k in the exact same month and that is only counting the 360 skus of the games.

March is not a bad time to release as proof from other game sales. Killzone 2 just didn't resonate with gamers they way that the constant gif posters of GAF would have wanted it to. And also, as for the not having an established name, I remember having many of KZ2 poster here tell me that the first one sold over a million copies and was a great game just held back by the tech.

 

[JoJo13]

Release months have nothing to do with it. Exactly one year earliar in March of 2008 Rainbow Six Vegas 2 sold 750k and Army of Two sold around 630k in the exact same month and that is only counting the 360 skus of the games.

March is not a bad time to release as proof from other game sales. Killzone 2 just didn't resonate with gamers they way that the constant gif posters of GAF would have wanted it to. And also, as for the not having an established name, I remember having many of KZ2 poster here tell me that the first one sold over a million copies and was a great game just held back by the tech.

Rainbox Six Vegas was also a name brand, it was released on a larger userbase, and it catered to the Xbox 360 audience (as evidenced by the skewed slant in favor of the 360 for these particular titles -- despite the 360 being 2x + the PS3 in the US, both titles sold much greater on the 360. R6V sold about 150k on the PS3 that month that it did 750k on the 360).

Secondly, when does a title that sells 700+k somehow suggest that it didn't "resonate" with gamers? MGS4 did about those numbers in June, and I don't recall anyone claiming the sales were bad or that the title didn't "resonate" with gamers. Injecting your personal opinion on KZ2 is pretty immaterial to the discussion.

 

[jvm]

I bought TLAD code from Amazon cause they had a promotion where I also got a 3 month card to live. It had a little box, a big fold out poster of TLAD and had the map of the city on the other side then a code for the content. Not a point card, but for the content exactly.

I got it delivered to my work, I redeemed the code at Xbox.com then called my roommate to go into my room and turn my 360 on. Didn't want to wait to download over a gig. So when I got home from work, the game was already downloaded and ready to play.

Thanks for explaining it, OJG.

 

[GameGamer]

The game was universally praised.

By critics. Not by any people I know.

 

[Slavik81]

Let's just assume you're right for the moment and throw out CoD4 and Halo 3 because they have an unfair advantage. Again, what about Left 4 Dead?

L4D most certainly benefited from the Valve name. Their long history on the PC would certainly keep them in the public eye more, even for console gamers, and The Orange Box turned lots of heads in the previous year.

 

[OldJadedGamer]

Secondly, when does a title that sells 700+k somehow suggest that it didn't "resonate" with gamers? MGS4 did about those numbers in June, and I don't recall anyone claiming the sales were bad or that the title didn't "resonate" with gamers. Injecting your personal opinion on KZ2 is pretty immaterial to the discussion.

Were you on GAF during the onslaught of KZ2 gifs in every thread related to or not even close to being related to the game? I said "Killzone 2 just didn't resonate with gamers they way that the constant gif posters of GAF would have wanted it to" and it didn't.

I'm comparing KZ2's numbers with other shooter games numbers btw regardless of what console they appear on.

 

[billy.sea]

According to Majesco's Twitter (which is legit IIRC), Gardening Mama's April sales were within striking distance of GTA:CTW's April Sales.

Mama wanted me to share with you that for the month of April, Gardening Mama was just shy of Chinatown Wars in sales! You go girl!!!

I suppose that's the best and most horrifying aspect of the DS. The leveling field is essentially leveled. You can't really just waltz in with your bread and butter franchise and top the charts. A publisher that took the initiative and built a reputation during the DS's early life is reaping the rewards of their effort. It's no surprise that Majesco had such a reversal of fortune with the DS.

It also appears to have better legs.



No, no... that's not quite leggy enough.






Ah! That's the ticket. Mama raised no fool!

The Mama series is extremly popular. It's probably the most popular third party casual series on Nintendo system, ahead of all those Petz or Imaginez titles, and in the level of Brain Age or Nintendogs.

 

[JoJo13]

Were you on GAF during the onslaught of KZ2 gifs in every thread related to or not even close to being related to the game? I said "Killzone 2 just didn't resonate with gamers they way that the constant gif posters of GAF would have wanted it to" and it didn't.

I'm comparing KZ2's numbers with other shooter games numbers btw regardless of what console they appear on.

GAF is a hardcore forum. KZ2 is a pretty looking game that was received well by fans here on the forum and by critics. It's a hardcore game. And on a hardcore forum, you'd expect a lot of anticipation.

You should know GAF is not representative of game sales, or else the UFC thread would be absolutely gigantic and the Wii Fit thread would be the biggest thread in GAF history.

Comparing KZ2's numbers 'regardless' of what platform they're on isn't really a very good way to look at the numbers. Given historical data for a lot of shooters on the PS3, KZ2's numbers are very strong for the platform, the only title that has really done much better is the call of duty series which isn't too surprising given its reputation.

 

[a Master Ninja]

L4D most certainly benefited from the Valve name. Their long history on the PC would certainly keep them in the public eye more, even for console gamers, and The Orange Box turned lots of heads in the previous year.

The Valve brand doesn't mean anything to your average console gamer, and the consoles sales of the Orange Box were meager compared to Left 4 Dead's. L4D sold on the 360 because of word of mouth, not because it was the next game by Valve.

Average Joe boots up his 360, see's a good friend playing some game he's never heard of called "Left 4 Dead". Sends a message to the friend asking about it. The friend responds "Holy shit, this game is fucking awesome! You shoot zombies! You gotta get this!" Then the cycle repeats.

 

[billy.sea]

GAF is a hardcore forum. KZ2 is a pretty looking game that was received well by fans here on the forum and by critics. It's a hardcore game. And on a hardcore forum, you'd expect a lot of anticipation.

You should know GAF is not representative of game sales, or else the UFC thread would be absolutely gigantic and the Wii Fit thread would be the biggest thread in GAF history.

Comparing KZ2's numbers 'regardless' of what platform they're on isn't really a very good way to look at the numbers. Given historical data for a lot of shooters on the PS3, KZ2's numbers are very strong for the platform, the only title that has really done much better is the call of duty series which isn't too surprising given its reputation.

GAF probably constitutes about 0.000001% of US hardcore gamer population.

 

[boiled goose]

GAF probably constitutes about 0.000001% of US hardcore gamer population.

this is why hardcore is such a bad term. who does it really include? players who post record times on trauma center? players who buy and play every game released? gamers who discuss stuff on forum? gamers who are ranked at the top in halo? players who spend hundreds of hours breeding pokemon? players who make compositions in wii music and post them on youtube?

 

[AniHawk]

this is why hardcore is such a bad term. who does it really include? players who post record times on trauma center? players who buy and play every game released? gamers who discuss stuff on forum? gamers who are ranked at the top in halo? players who spend hundreds of hours breeding pokemon? players who make compositions in wii music and post them on youtube?

It means people who go out and buy mature-rated games for the Xbox 360 and PlayStation 3.

PC gamers can join in too if they play nice.

 

[charlequin]

and that's considered a failure? holy crap what is going on here

Okami's a friggin' huge game that was in development for a long-ass time.

Because they're brand names and heavily discounted right now?

Call of Duty 4 is selling for $3-4 less than Killzone 2 on Amazon right now. Halo 3's still $37. L4D appears to be discounted on Amazon but still close to full price at Gamestop.

 

[Aaron Strife]

It means people who go out and buy mature-rated games for the Xbox 360 and PlayStation 3.

PC gamers can join in too if they play nice.

Go out?

As in... outside?

 

[AniHawk]

Go out?

As in... outside?

Who else is going to pick up those boxes from amazon?

 

[Version 3.0]

By critics. Not by any people I know.

Yeah, review scores are a mostly worthless metric these days. Killzone 2 had enough hype surrounding it to get its free pass with the gaming media. They know where their money comes from. If it wasn't apparent already, the GTAIV debacle provided clinching proof that whole structure is irredeemably broken.

I'm not saying Killzone 2 is a bad game; that's a matter of opinion. But the review scores have more to do with the game's highly anticipated status than they do with the game's quality.

 

[Hammer24]

Nice to see that Sacred 2 didn't completely bomb on consoles. I haven't read the whole thread, do we know how many units it sold yet?

80k on the 360, haven´t seen a number for PS3 and PC.

 

[AniHawk]

80k on the 360, haven´t seen a number for PS3 and PC.

80k for PS360.

 

[Hammer24]

80k for PS360.

Aah, thx for the clarification!

 

[D.Lo]

I'm not saying Killzone 2 is a bad game; that's a matter of opinion. But the review scores have more to do with the game's highly anticipated status than they do with the game's quality.

Exactly. Publishers have worked out how to basically buy off review scores even without paying cash monies. And they get near universal praise, rather then just the reviews they paid for too.

 

[Johann]

The Mama series is extremly popular. It's probably the most popular third party casual series on Nintendo system, ahead of all those Petz or Imaginez titles, and in the level of Brain Age or Nintendogs.

It's not a Brain Age or Nintendogs hit but most publishers would kill to have a low-input/high-output franchise like that. I think the entire series is about 4 million+ in total sales.

Honest question -- why are games like Left 4 Dead, CoD4 and Halo showing such better legs than KZ2 then? If this were a marketing failure, you'd expect the positive word of mouth to propel the game beyond the modest initial sales provided by its marketing. All of the aforementioned titles besides Killzone exhibited this sales pattern, be they Killzone2 big (L4D has sold in KZ2's ballpark) much bigger than KZ2 (Halo) or much, much bigger than KZ2 (CoD4).

For Killzone 2, the opposite seems to be true: the game is showing particularly poor legs for a high budget shooter with a strong multiplayer component. CoD4, Halo and L4D aren't getting marketing any longer, but they keep on selling. Again, why isn't KZ2 doing the same?

CoD4 and Halo 3 have a lot of advantages, such as brandname and consistent popularity. The most important is that they each have a very active online multiplayer community. These people who first build the community are attracting more and more people by creating a large community and word of mouth. If you pick up a PS3 or 360, your friends will most likely point you in the direction of either of these two games. The legs of most other shooters typically rise and fall with the strength of the online community. People are probably too invested in these two mega-shooters to give most other games. Why should I play Killzone 2 when World at War has my friends on it and I can level up the character I already spent months working on? I think most PS3 owners stuck with CoD:WaW (great sales on the PS3 and best post-Holiday legs on the system) and were reluctant to play any other shooter that was too similar.

As for L4D, it fulfills a want for multi-player without directly competing with Halo or CoD. think a person playing this will be playing a unique shooter experience that doesn't have a large overlap with the Halo or CoD experience. It's fulfilling desire of action, shooting, stat-tracking, co-operation, and competition but it's satisfying them is way that's substantially different from Halo or CoD.

 

[donny2112]

Honest question -- why are games like Left 4 Dead, CoD4 and Halo showing such better legs than KZ2 then?

Halo 3 shouldn't be a question. Xbox = Halo. New buyer to Xbox? At least consider buying Halo.

For L4D and CoD4, "word of mouth" travels easier on Xbox Live than actual words coming from an actual mouth (and not going into a headset). Xbox Live is the best innovation Microsoft has brought to the gaming landscape, in my opinion. The 360 prompted the phrase "flavor of the month" to apply to game sales' patterns due to (I feel in large part) Friend List interaction. You see what your friends are playing, look into the game via online or asking your friends, and if it's quality, you get it, too, to "jump in." Demos and trailers push this, as well. For really good multi-player focused games like L4D, CoD4, and Halo 3, I think the community keeps sales going by continuing to play the game themselves. This gives longer exposure to the game via Friend Lists, and if your friends are playing the same game all the time, that's an even bigger incentive to "jump in," as well, since that means it pretty much has to be good.

 

[poppabk]

It means people who go out and buy mature-rated games for the Xbox 360 and PlayStation 3.

PC gamers can join in too if they play nice.

Sarcastic or not, that is the best definition I have read for how the term is actually used.

 

[Dunlop]

Halo 3 shouldn't be a question. Xbox = Halo. New buyer to Xbox? At least consider buying Halo.

For L4D and CoD4, "word of mouth" travels easier on Xbox Live than actual words coming from an actual mouth (and not going into a headset). Xbox Live is the best innovation Microsoft has brought to the gaming landscape, in my opinion. The 360 prompted the phrase "flavor of the month" to apply to game sales' patterns due to (I feel in large part) Friend List interaction. You see what your friends are playing, look into the game via online or asking your friends, and if it's quality, you get it, too, to "jump in." Demos and trailers push this, as well. For really good multi-player focused games like L4D, CoD4, and Halo 3, I think the community keeps sales going by continuing to play the game themselves. This gives longer exposure to the game via Friend Lists, and if your friends are playing the same game all the time, that's an even bigger incentive to "jump in," as well, since that means it pretty much has to be good.

100% agree. It was great foresight on the part of Microsoft (also with 100% of players havng headsets and of course achievements).

Because I am not gaming as often I am letting my LIVE membership lapse (unless MTG proves to kick ass) and will play multiplayer on the PS3, but it quite frankly pales to the experience on LIVE. The fact that this is a hard choice, shows the strength of LIVE.

I think that Sony pushing the PS3 as a BD player also hurt them as we really don't know what percentage of PS3 owners only use it for that purpose

 

[Jive Turkey]

Who else is going to pick up those boxes from amazon?

Duh. My mom. Usually while she's bringin' me my FUCKING CHOCOLATE MILK!

 

[Turrican3]

Xbox Live is the best innovation Microsoft has brought to the gaming landscape, in my opinion.

I don't know if what Microsoft did with Live constitutes an actual innovation, but I'm sure (almost) everything they did, they did it right.

I mean, for example, Sony didn't need to have PSN ready and feature-standard on day one: they could always have improved the service via firmware upgrades, but as insignificant as it may seem at first, PS3 missing a bundled headphone was a key, distinguishing factor that really, really made a difference between the two online services/experiences.

 

[pr0cs]

KZ2 isn't selling like the COD series of games because it's just not accessible. Everyone I've let try it who are COD nut-jobs just find the controls too strange, unintuitive and the world/characters aren't interesting enough. They loved the intro and then get a big meh when actually playing the game.
I didn't find the multiplayer anywhere near as compelling as COD either, the rewards are not handed out often enough, in COD the rewards are handed out early and often to hook you in and give you a sense of progress whereas in KZ2 it starts to feel very "samey" very quickly.

 

[Sgt. Killjoy]

Data care of NPD Group


PlayStation 2 117K
PlayStation 3 131K
PSP 100.4K
Xbox 360 175K
Wii 289.5K
Nintendo DS 633.5K


UFC 2009 UNDISPUTED (Xbox 360) 679.6K
Wii FIT W/ BALANCE BOARD (Wii) 352.8K
EA SPORTS ACTIVE BUNDLE (Wii) 345.8K
UFC 2009 UNDISPUTED (PS3) 334.4K
INFAMOUS (PS3) 175.9K
POKEMON PLATINUM VERSION (NDS) 168.9K
MARIO KART W/ WHEEL (Wii) 158.3K
PUNCH OUT!! (Wii) 156.9K
X-MEN ORIGINS: WOLVERINE UNCAGED ED (Xbox 360) 120.7K
Wii PLAY W/ REMOTE (Wii) 109.8K


---------------------


Analysis from NPD's Anita Frazier:

wow, THQ discovered the UFC market. congrats. im glad it wasn't EA.

 

[dammitmattt]

I don't know if what Microsoft did with Live constitutes an actual innovation, but I'm sure (almost) everything they did, they did it right.

I mean, for example, Sony didn't need to have PSN ready and feature-standard on day one: they could always have improved the service via firmware upgrades, but as insignificant as it may seem at first, PS3 missing a bundled headphone was a key, distinguishing factor that really, really made a difference between the two online services/experiences.

Bundling a headset was just smart, but here are some innovations:

1. Achievements - this is by far the biggest one since they are everywhere now from Steam to iPhone games to PS3 games even to a few Wii games; this fundamentally changes how some people play games

2. Persistent Online Presence - it's very cool to have a consistent presence across all XBL/GWL games that tracks what you are playing and when, regardless of whether you get any achievements or not

3. XML Tags - makes sites like 360voice and many other cool sites possible

4. Xbox.com - manage/speak to your friends, queue downloads, compare achievements, etc.

5. XBLM - it took time but it evolved into a great service, and without this, PSN and Wiiware/VC wouldn't be what they are today

 

[Dunlop]

They loved the intro and then get a big meh when actually playing the game.

For this reason exactly, KZ2 is the first FPS in a long time that I did not finish the SP campaign.

I was more entertained reading the kickass timelime someone posted a while back than playing the actual game