-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
PeteBull
Member
Fully understandable and i agree 100% here, got 4k 32inches monitor so i cant go back to full hd either, im ok with 4k dlss quality but even 4k dlss performance is noticeable downgrade in IQ even tho my eyesight isnt as good as it used to be.
Both u and me are "lost cause", aka we gonna be upgrading our gpu's more often and to higher tiers in future vs the full hd dudes, we cant go back to older standard w/o it feeling like big downgrade anymore.
Same way when ppl played TTT on their brand new ps2 at launch and got used to that image quality back in 2000 we had hard time going back(ofc difference is massive at that res and new more detailed models on top, but bringing up this example just to exagerate and prove humans easily addapt to new/higher standards):
A 3080 bought in 2020 is still fine for 1440p today w/DLSS, and will likely last the entire generation outside of super expensive RT settings.
Bojji
Member
You gave up on PC in early 200x based on issues you are mentioning.
On PS you have firmware updates, game installs and in game tweaking (multiple modes and variations).
Schmendrick
Member
The last time you touched a PC was when those were still programmed with stamp cards I guess......
Bullshit²
Last edited:
Bojji
Member
That's the price of a monopoly but some people will be fine with it, obviously the same ones that complained about consoles getting more expensive
That's the price of monopoly as well. Consoles were relatively cheap for decades now, even including One X and PS4 Pro.
PS5 Pro price is absurd.
And just like with PS5 Pro, fanboys and people that have enough money to not care about the price will buy those gpus. People that care about price/performance ratio will buy better priced products (from nvidia if those will exist or Intel, AMD).
Absurd price of Nvidia GPUs =/= Pro price is justified in any way.
Gaiff
SBI’s Resident Gaslighter
You won’t last long. I can tell.
rodrigolfp
Haptic Gamepads 4 Life
Ignorance is not a bliss here.
HeisenbergFX4
Gold Member
NEO account that isn’t taking it well they can’t afford new toys
Corporal.Hicks
Member
With the latest DLSS 3.8.2 + reshade sharpening (you need sharpening regardless of DLSS scaling factor if you want to get sharp image, because even DLAA blurs image) I get equally sharp image in both DLSS Q and P. There's only subtle noise difference around hair and grass, but that's small difference to me, so I'm already very happy even with DLSS Performance (even DLSSP offers far better image quality compared to consoles).
DLSS Quality
DLSS Performance
I also see no problems running 1440p with black borders on a 4K display. Hell, I can even run 720p + CRT mask on a 4K screen and still be happy with the image quality (I'm playing 480p / 480i games on PS2 / xbox / gamecube), becasue phosphor mask tricks my eyes and mind into believing the image is far more detailed than in reality.
People who are not willing to compromise might be tempted to upgrade their PCs more frequently, but for me it will be years before I want to upgrade. I used my old (2016) GTX1080 until recently (I also had a 1080ti for three years, but I sold it during the mining craze for a very good price). TLOU remake was the first game that I couldnt run with at least console like settings at 1440p 60fps. Becasue nvidia hit the wall with node shrinks current high end GPUs might last even longer.
Last edited:
There is no monopoly in the console market, Nintendo is a pretty healthy competitor that could even outsell Sony when Switch 2 is released and Microsoft is still there although their decisions have considerably hurt their console sales compared to the past.
The baseline price of hardware IS getting higher.
Consoles prices have not stayed the same, previously 199/299$ were the baseline during the PS1/PS2 gen, now the baseline for good console hardware is 499$. There was also the outlier of PS3 that launched at 599$.
You can't avoid higher baseline costs with inflation and when the semiconductor business is fucked with a single company (TSMC) deciding prices, silicon technology being at its limits and more advanced nodes being super expensive.
The Pro IS expensive but at least is a full system at 699$, not just a GPU, the price just reflects the reality that it's an enthusiast system where Sony doesn't feel it's needed to take losses like they do on the base model.
nVidia is just a greedy company that wants to fuck their customers because they can with outrageous margins, they have always been like that, great tech but zero respect for consumers and shady tactics against competitors that could threaten them.
But again some people will be fine with that and their hypocrisy pre-ordering the 5090 but acting outraged about the Pro and few months earlier
Last edited:
Bojji
Member
There is no monopoly in the console market, Nintendo is a pretty healthy competitor that could even outsell Sony when Switch 2 is released and Microsoft is still there although their decisions have considerably hurt their console sales compared to the past.
The baseline price of hardware IS getting higher.
Consoles prices have not stayed the same, previously 199/299$ were the baseline during the PS1/PS2 gen, now the baseline for good console hardware is 499$. There was also the outlier of PS3 that launched at 599$.
You can't avoid higher baseline costs with inflation and when the semiconductor business is fucked with a single company (TSMC) deciding prices, silicon technology being at its limits and more advanced nodes being super expensive.
The Pro IS expensive but at least is a full system at 699$, not just a GPU, the price just reflects the reality that it's an enthusiast system where Sony doesn't feel it's needed to take losses like they do on the base model.
nVidia is just a greedy company that wants to fuck their customers because they can with outrageous margins, they have always been like that, great tech but zero respect for consumers and shady tactics against competitors that could threaten them.
But again some people will be fine with that and their hypocrisy pre-ordering the 5090 but acting outraged about the Pro and few months earlier
Nvidia are motherfuckers but good guy Sony, really? They are charging for everything and trying to suck their consumers dry for quite some time now.
Pro Price in Europe - 800 Euro, with DD - over 900 Euro. You can build full decent pc with 4070 with that money.
Something like this coudn't be done when PS5/XSX launched ^
And no monopoly in console space? Fuck me, Nintendo isn't competing directly with Sony, MS is. And MS is almost dead. Nintendo doesn't even have AAA third party games and their audience are not hardcore and COD/FIFA gamers (that are majority of Sony and MS audience).
DirtyBast8rd
Member
Who's gonna open a thread to bitch about people buying Lamborghini's instead of a Volkswagen? I can't afford a Lamborghini but get why people who can buy them. I dont bitch and moan about it. Because I can is reason enough to get something you like but don't need.
No one admit they need to upgrade their gpu every 3 years, it's not personal like what they say and there's no logic behind burning someone's money just because they can. 6k dollars range doesn't scream poverty and it's in everyone's hands to earn that amount easily with much more to save.You can smell the salt and sweat from low income PS5 Pro owners in this thread.
Sony is not a good guy. No company is, they're all doing their interests.
But the price of the Pro is just them not taking a loss on hardware like they usually do because they don't feel it's needed for a specific enthusiast model. They're still offering a full system not just a GPU.
Sony also has a lot of competition, both direct and indirect (including PC, cloud gaming, competitive subscription services). Nintendo is not direct competition for hardware power but has pretty much the Japanese market on lock and this had an impact on the PlayStation success in that market.
nVidia is quite frankly a shitty company for everything that is not their tech/engineers, there isn't anyone they haven't tried to fuck at least once, consumers, partners,competitors, retailers. They have good tech and the CEO has been able to catch the next big waves to ride on the business side, props to them about this.
My point is just about the hypocrisy, PC fans that acted outraged about the Pro should now riot about these prices. They obviously won't, it's all just hypocrisy and fake complaints.
ricardo_sousa11
Member
Step one - buy Nvidia stock
Step two - wait
Step three - Sell nvidia stock + buy GPU
Rinse repeat.
Step two - wait
Step three - Sell nvidia stock + buy GPU
Rinse repeat.
Pharaoh 117
Member
Question is: is it still viable to do it now?
JohnnyFootball
GerAlt-Right. Ciriously.
The 5090 tempts me in many ways beyond performance.
1. DP 2.1 finally being implemented.
2. Evolved DLSS and Frame gen. (Ada version is pretty damn good)
Having said that...whether I replace my 4090 remains to be seen.
ricardo_sousa11
Member
IMO it is, but you might need to wait a bit longer.
But lets say new GPUs come out every 2 years, if you wait 2 years you'll always have enough for the new top of the line and then some, and once you get the ball rolling its pretty much free GPUs for life, for the cost of 1 new GPU.
Nvidia has the monopoly on GPU and AI, in 2 years time it should be much higher than it is now (even if now is a bit high).
This has been consistently true for the past 20 years.
I even do the same with some games, when GTA was announced I bought some shares of TakeTwo, im now up 30%, I could buy the game+ a new console for free, let alone after the game comes out.
Last edited:
Schmendrick
Member
Ah yes the usual imaginary "they".....
Brigandier
Member
Constant upgrades? If you want absolute top tier sure, You don't need to splash the cash to make a nice PC that will last you a good few years or outperform the mighty PlayStation...
1440p is perfectly fine and looks fantastic you don't NEED to game on 4k.
There is so many options to make a nice PC these days that only the ignorant come out with the waffle you have...
OverHeat
« generous god »
Bojji
Member
Most people here are outraged about that rumored price, and prices of 4xxx series.
I'm criticizing both Sony and Nvidia for what they are doing.
People that don't have problem with 5090/5080 price shouldn't have any problem with pro price as well.
DoubleClutch
Gold Member
Time will tell. Nothing goes up forever. The same thing people said about Intel when AMD was on its deathbed.
Nvidia may have an advantage, but those enormous margins won’t last forever. In due time the competition will undercut it.
AMD’s MI325X is around the corner.
ricardo_sousa11
Member
You're free to do your own research, and counter the pros and cons.
Im simply saying what has worked for me, and since doing it, prices for new GPUs are irrelevant.
The issue with AMD is they have a tiny market compared to Nvidia, hardware surveys reveal 88% of PCs use Nvidia GPUs, so there is no competition whatsoever and i'd argue serious competition is almost impossible for the next decade, support is simply not there.
Apart from us (enthusiasts) AMD is rarely even taken into consideration.
I dont even consider this an investment, just a way of getting new stuff for "free", instead of spending thousands every 2-3 years.
Last edited:
SolidQ
Member
RTX 5090 and RTX 5080 listed for $2,600 and $1,350 at Chinese retailer
37% more expensive than the RTX 4090 when adjusted for VAT.
Happy New Year (c) Huang
Last edited:
DoubleClutch
Gold Member
Ah the past performance argument…
Tell me, what happened to someone who bought in September ‘21 and lost over half their money a year later? Not everyone held.
I don’t recommend the average person buys any stock expecting to profit in the short term to cover their expenses.
I don’t see Nvidia’s recent stock explosion as sustainable growth. It may grow, but not 20x over.
ByWatterson
Member
LOL, tell me more how the PS5 Pro is a scam
YeulEmeralda
Linux User
DeaconOfTheDank
Member
Cos I'm an enthusiast and daddy needs to justify the LG C4 OLED I just bought.
Joking aside, this is literally the only hobby of mine that I spend any significant money on outside of travel. So I don't mind dishing out a couple grand every 5+ years. In fact, I look forward to it!
Last edited:
rodrigolfp
Haptic Gamepads 4 Life
GeForces also have a tiny list of improved games with some with questionable upgrades?? Or every game is improved?
YeulEmeralda
Linux User
Playing old games in 4k is one of the least talked about joys of PC gaming.
Your PC couldn't run Bioshock 2? Well it can now.
The pc fans that can afford a 4090 didn’t give a single shit about the ps5 pro price. They just laughed at the idea that people thought it was going to be similar to a high end GPU and it hasn’t been. Or that the pro is some value when it clearly isn’t.
There is no hypocrisy. It’s just the usual haves and have nots. You won’t find actual high end gamers talking about value they know the choices they are making and do not care.
To be more clear: when you buy a 4090 you are getting games like wukong at ultra settings in 4k at 60fps and it’s like playing 2 generations in the future. Some people don’t mind paying for that kind of an experience. I’ve still yet to see a single example of a ps5 pro game that would make me sell my base ps5 and get a pro. Not a single example.
Last edited:
HeisenbergFX4
Gold Member
Sadly it’s not a straight forward answer.
Mostly at 4k you are GPU bottlenecked but the X3D chips can still improve some games plus help improve 1% lows
Budget is key on what you’re willing to spend because personally if you’re not wanting to kill your budget go with a 7800X3D and possibly the 5070 Ti with the 16G of RAM, likely a great sweet spot bang for your buck.
And I buy all my PCs as pre builds, have built my own many times and don’t care to do it anymore so some very decent pre builds out there.
My 4090 just died in my PC and as a holdover got a 9800X3D 4080Super CLX prebuilt and honestly it’s a nice machine
If I am wrong on anything above someone with better tech knowledge feel free to correct me please
Kilau
Member
Ouch sorry about the 4090. I feel pretty locked in on the 5090 unless it’s just a dud for some reason, and I’d like a CPU with 16 cores.
I figure with a pre built and 5090 I’m looking at north of $4k
wafflecioccy
Neo Member
Wish I was rich enough to buy a brand-new high-end system when a graphics card is faulty and waiting for replacement
yansolo
Member
i've been hanging for a new pc, but the prices in Australia are off the charts and even during sales there isnt any real big discounts. No way i'd be able to touch a 5 series card, maybe a 4080s, or 4070ti super, are they still good cards? either way the way it's going if i pull the trigger I wont be looking at upgrading again for a long long time.
wafflecioccy
Neo Member
Is a current high end graphics card still a good card?
Oh, man, idk! x)
Hohenheim
Member
I'm fine with it, and i've never complained about the price of any console.That's the price of a monopoly but some people will be fine with it, obviously the same ones that complained about consoles getting more expensive
Of course I wish everything would cost less, but at the end of the day this stuff is not something I feel the need to scream and shout about.
It's all hardware that will last a long time, and i'd rather pay a bit more for more quality experiences the next few years.
The money I would have saved by getting a cheaper GPU would probably be wasted on something that for sure wouldn't give me as much joy as a top notch GPU.
Last edited:
PeteBull
Member
Why did you enter Squid Game?
Neogaf: to buy a 5090 videocard
