Has microsoft dropped interest in the Japanese Market?

Drawing the conclusion that Japan can't accept outside influence because their takeout Indian cuisine is bastardized and broadly uniform is about as sensical as walking into nearly any Chinese restaurant in the west and drawing the same conclusion.

Probably less so, I can't say I'm a huge hole-in-the-wall curry joint connoisseur but I don't believe they tend to use the same printed menus with the only the restaurant name changed.

I've stated over and over that a) I'm not using one tiny phenomenon to draw that conclusion. I came to the conclusion after observing hundreds upon hundreds of pieces of evidence and am now using examples to try and illustrate my point, different things. Read what I said. b) I never said can't. c) I never said it doesn't also happen in other countries to a lesser or greater degree.

Do you think that the multiculturalism of say, the states doesn't make people more accepting of things from other cultures over an extremely homogenous society like that of Japan?
 
They will try again next time.

In fact I bet given Capcoms distance for Sony and pretty good relationship with MS that they get a real monster hunter game on xbox next gen.

In a world where Nintendo doesn't exist
and pigs fly

Didn't Microsoft stop making 360's in Japan a while ago? I think you're a bit too late to suggest this if they aren't making 360's for Japan anymore.

First I'm hearing about this.
 
Given that the case against Japan is "historical popularity is in decline, and other markets offer more effective investment opportunities given rapid expansion", I'm not sure "historical popularity" is a case for Japan.



1) Is there a particular reason to believe that Microsoft will be less able to break into China at some future point due to a weak position in Japan? IE that investing now is crucial, because investing later when China is a viable market won't work, and investments elsewhere now can't pay dividends in China later.

2) Although I know Sony does good SEA business and Nintendo has emphasized its Korean operations in recent years, it's not clear to me that either would consider "Asia outside Japan" as a bigger market than even the minor European markets. It seems to me like EMEA investments are key to both Sony's firewall and Microsoft's upside growth more than SEA.

Correct, it's a poor fit for MS's current product line and MS's focus on the short term.

The current decline in the console market seems to be more a) a shift to handhelds, b) generational ennui, and c) poor position in the mid-00s to respond to an AAA market with two strong contenders and commodity engines; all of these are issues with trying to resurrect the 360 now, which we can all agree is a terrible idea, rather than indicators that Japanese software is permanently devalued.

The best argument for investing now is that the big-splash strategy has failed miserably for MS; Blue Dragon and Lost Odyssey floundered, and MS quite literally sank more money into N3's development than it grossed at retail. What did appear to work for MS's mindshare, for quite a long time, was a slow and extremely inexpensive drip of cultivating a niche fanbase and medium-dev familiarity with their tools.
If we assume that China will in large part follow Japanese software in the same way that Taiwan and HK do, and this is the core assumption that's my own experience and gut instinct, leaving the positive impression in the hypothetical launch buyer's mind that they're not going to be trading it in for $150 once they finish the launch titles will pay off in spades when the time does come to go big.

As for when that time will come? That's the big question, it's something that can't be pushed directly by any platformholder, and that's why it's on the back burner for everyone. The time for a major push is when the market opens up, and relying on the Chinese government in your business plans is lunacy. But that unpredictability is exactly why having a base to build from will be so vital.
MS exploited core mindshare in the US to break out with a strong 360 launch when the market suddenly expanded. Thanks to the 360's global strength they either have or had the potential to build similar mindshare in Japan in preparation for the huge expansion the SEA market will undergo, at costs that are a rounding error.
EMEA is certainly the market that will see multibillion-dollar returns on billion-dollar investments next gen, and it's where MS needs to seriously attack which forces Sony to seriously defend. But over the very long term, it will be matched-to-eclipsed by China's later maturation just as the US was the rising star of the past two gens but will likely be pipped by Europe this time or next.
Edit: And to address your edit, the impression that I get in my work marketing a Japanese multimedia property to the global market is that a) the mainland Chinese market is very responsive to Japanese trends, and b) it is possible to maintain core buzz on a very cost-effective level and stay far ahead of the competition that doesn't bother even when your attempts at bridging the Pacific on a mass-market level sink like the Titanic made out of lead.
 
EMEA is certainly the market that will see multibillion-dollar returns on billion-dollar investments next gen, and it's where MS needs to seriously attack which forces Sony to seriously defend. But over the very long term, it will be matched-to-eclipsed by China's later maturation just as the US was the rising star of the past two gens but will likely be pipped by Europe this time or next.

I think your assessment is pretty good, at least from what little I know about Japan, although I'm not sure I understand why China is supposed to be more closely linked to Japanese taste than European or North American taste. You state that Hong Kong does currently, and I suspect that that's true, but I'm not sure I understand why it would be. I guess I think of film as a counter-example, where China is eating up the biggest, dumbest, most western films rather than hewing closer to an "eastern" taste?

But I think the qualifiers required on every aspect of the case pretty much renders inert anyone here who is trying to proclaim that it's self-evident that Japan should/does matter to MS, that jRPGs are a big part of strategy, etc. (IE the reply context in which I asked the question) And certainly a case built on springboarding into China is a good deal different than a case that Japanese-targeted software pays global dividends today.
 
I bought both of the Xboxen for the Japanese-developed exclusives, the original one for the Sega stuff and the 360 for Mistwalker's. All the Western-developed games I've played and really enjoyed on both of them haven't been exclusive- they've been on PC as well, and sometimes PS3. So maybe I'm not the average customer for MS but if they abandon Japan I'll most likely skip the Durango.
 
I've stated over and over that a) I'm not using one tiny phenomenon to draw that conclusion. I came to the conclusion after observing hundreds upon hundreds of pieces of evidence and am now using examples to try and illustrate my point, different things. Read what I said. b) I never said can't. c) I never said it doesn't also happen in other countries to a lesser or greater degree.

Do you think that the multiculturalism of say, the states doesn't make people more accepting of things from other cultures over an extremely homogenous society like that of Japan?

I think we're all tribal naked apes who can barely see outside of our apartment building and our daily haunts. The personality traits required to get beyond this are completely orthogonal to the (terribly ironically) insular definitions of homogenous/heterogenous which are in play in the US.

I think your assessment is pretty good, at least from what little I know about Japan, although I'm not sure I understand why China is supposed to be more closely linked to Japanese taste than European or North American taste. You state that Hong Kong does currently, and I suspect that that's true, but I'm not sure I understand why it would be. I guess I think of film as a counter-example, where China is eating up the biggest, dumbest, most western films rather than hewing closer to an "eastern" taste?

But I think the qualifiers required on every aspect of the case pretty much renders inert anyone here who is trying to proclaim that it's self-evident that Japan should/does matter to MS, that jRPGs are a big part of strategy, etc. (IE the reply context in which I asked the question) And certainly a case built on springboarding into China is a good deal different than a case that Japanese-targeted software pays global dividends today.

To digress as to why it's linked, entertainment is a spaghetti-at-the-wall sort of affair in my opinion. I don't believe in regional tastes except as in sort of a collective of what's stuck recently. And it's simply easier to toss noodles from Japan than straight over the Pacific; translation is significantly easier between CJK, there's shared TV satellite coverage, larger expat trader communities, merchandise can be shipped at far lesser expense, bands can play one-shot or weekend engagements, casts and crews can film on location for low-budget productions or roll up to premieres, and of course from 1995-2005 the winning systems basically placed SEA within the NTSC-J region.

As for the immediate benefit to MS of paying more attention to Japan, I think it's hardest to make an argument for that as the key focus because most of the reasons it hasn't worked are both endemic and philosophical, and are best addressed on a global basis at which point Japan will follow. However, I do think that it's either top-3 or top-5 priority simply because it's top-3 or top-5 feasible userbase, and while it's not necessarily a growth market as a whole there's still plenty of room to try and eat Sony's lunch. Doubly so because the phone-tablet-Xbox-PC convergence MS is taking as their overall strategic direction places the greater .NET/DirectX platform firmly in a market that IS still growing in Japan and that Japanese software companies have a dominant position in.

To clarify, this doesn't mean making it rain for washed-up '90s legends, and diving into jRPGs is laughably dumb until one happens to stick again. But Java and Flash are both miserable piles of security holes that are half a step away from setting off most antivirus programs just being installed, so maybe dangling a few bucks in front of DeNA or GREE to favor Windows Phone versions and IE/Silverlight PC implementations? (Ideally a couple years ago while they were on the way up, rather than now in the post-'business model so profitable it was outlawed' era?)
For that matter, an in-house localization support team to match their in-house dev support teams would have been far cheaper over the whole gen than several of their individual projects, and would've provided both a major boost to sales in Japan and a major boost to support from the midrange devs who have to pick one system to support/support well. And it's those midrange devs that throw the most spaghetti collectively and generate the explosions that shake up the industry; they're prime targets whether you're trying to wring every penny of revenue out or develop the next big thing.
 
I think we're all tribal naked apes who can barely see outside of our apartment building and our daily haunts. The personality traits required to get beyond this are completely orthogonal to the (terribly ironically) insular definitions of homogenous/heterogenous which are in play in the US.

That is a bit reductionist.

Being human + culture + home + individual personal experience

You can make sweeping generalizations about a culture (both negative and positive) and they will live up to their name being only mostly true for any large group.
 
Its not a matter of xenophobia. The Japanese have a great sense of national pride and a greater sense of community than any other culture on the planet. everywhere else on earth there's NO loyalty to your neighbor friend or family like in Japan. the Japanese ppl understand that supporting companies and products made by their ppl they're supporting themselves.

Every other culture is only interested in where they can get it the cheapest and then they complain that there's no jobs.

very true

btw, did you know that Japan is deep in debts and the economy might be on the verge of collapsing within this decade
 
It's not so simple, most of the debt is actually owned by Japan. Look it up.

I'm aware of that

http://www.spiegel.de/international/world/massive-japanese-sovereign-debt-could-become-global-problem-a-875641.html

(...) Indeed, the country has gotten trapped in an inescapable spiral of deficit spending.

The fact that this tragedy has been playing out in relative obscurity can be attributed to a bizarre phenomenon: In contrast to the debt-ridden economies in the euro zone, Japan continues to pay hardly any interest on what it borrows. (...) The reason is simple: Unlike countries in the euro zone, Japan borrows most of its money from its own people. Domestic banks and insurers have purchased 95 percent of the country's sovereign debt using the savings deposits of the general population. What's more, the Japanese are apparently so convinced that their country will be able to pay off its debts one day that they continue to lend their government a seemingly endless amount of money.

Experts warn that this system cannot go on for much longer. Takatoshi Ito, an economics professor at the University of Tokyo, says for example that Japan could become the "next Greece" if its government doesn't change course; the money, he says, will eventually run out. Ito and a colleague have calculated that even if the Japanese people invested all of their assets in sovereign bonds, it would only be enough to cover 12 years of state expenditures.

and a few more interesting bits in the article. Sorry for going slightly off-topic
 
I'm aware of that

http://www.spiegel.de/international/world/massive-japanese-sovereign-debt-could-become-global-problem-a-875641.html



and a few more interesting bits in the article. Sorry for going slightly off-topic

It's true that the current deficit spending has gone beyond Iron Triangle levels. However, it's either shortsighted or opportunistic to look at it as a long-term proposition.
As much as I hate to get behind the LDP, the fact remains that the yen is untenably high and every option short of coming off as complete lunatics has failed to budge it. Yet we're finally seeing movement, because they were crazy enough to put Rozen Maiden Fanboy #1 as finance minister.
Now, we just need to hope they get tossed in a year or two.
 
Could they just partner with a Japanese company to market the 720 over there? Like Panasonic Xbox or something.

It could be done, but it's not really a problem-solving move. 90% of the Xbox's problem in Japan is that the used-game culture there makes Gamestop look like that guy at the flea market with NES carts; the hardcore gamer will buy a 20k yen X360 for one title and trade it back in for \17,500, or better yet find a shop that will guarantee him 18k back within a month (rentals are actually illegal, and this is how they get around that!) Then he'll grind through that one yearly release in a week or two.

Slapping the Sharp or Panasonic/Matsushita names on it might buy a few percent, just like there were people in the US who would never touch Toyota or Mazda but bought up Geos or the Escort line. The biggie is that to make a splash in the US market you need one AAAA title a year, but to make a splash in the Japanese market you need one B title a month.

Having a trusted partner who can be relied upon to support longterm can't hurt, but you need to follow through with that implicit promise or the veneer fades. On the other hand, your name can be mud now but if you do support it will recover fast.
 
as for Apple i don't think they have jpanese co making anything like the ipone, i pad or i pod.

Plenty of Android devices from domestic manufacturers, often of better quality than international units. Android still isn't doing better in Japan than in the US.
 
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