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[Amentallica]

No, of course not, they own the IP now. I am saying that MS is not generally a consumer friendly corporation, and they usually try their best to force things onto the consumers that are not value added for anyone but MS. If not for the backlash we would now have an online only Xbox One where all games are digital only with a mandatory Kinect. No one but MS wanted that, an they only wanted it to enact a form of control over both the consumers and developers.

And that is why they are where they are now.

Will they learn from the market and their own mistakes? Or will they do what Bunny said above and try yet again to control and funnel the market along their own roads?

Yea, I'd much rather have Microsoft exit the console space. I have an overtly negative perception of them.

 

[Mengy]

All the numbers are posted here :

Edit : Apparently I'm not supposed to post this link.

Thanks for the link.

And there it is, the PS4 doubled the X1 for the month. Ouch.

Wow, the Xbox360 nearly sold as many consoles as the Wii-U did for September.

 

[allan-bh]

All the numbers are posted here :

Edit : Apparently I'm not supposed to post this link.

Better not. GAF is the source and this is bad for our leakers.

 

[Nirolak]

I said the same thing last generation, but it's all about context. Yes, the Xbox One is selling decently, but you have to take into account the momentum gained over the last generation and how it was completely squandered or inverted with the release of the XB1. For example, if viewed in a vacuum, the Playstation 3 sold wonderfully last generation. But when you take into account that the Playstation 1 and 2 had such commanding leads in their respective generations, then the fact that the Playstation 3 was in an even foot race with the competition isn't so impressive. The same idea is true for the XB1.

Having said that, I suppose it depends to what scope your context is given. If your snapshot is of the XB1's unveiling to now, then I suppose they're doing well considering how many bullets they riddled their foot with.

The context is also what the chalkboard represents though, right?

The PS3 was frequently pulling below 100K in the first half of 2007, which I believe was the first chalkboard to come out. The Vita and Wii U also had abysmal performances.

Here the Xbox One is almost 2.5 times what the PS3 was doing in September 2007.

Now, that's certainly lower than the PS4, but that system comparatively has the second best September ever.

 

[ak1276]

People don't seem to care about it on reddit either, I posted something about the PS4 having the best September debut ever and in the top 3 September results of all time, but it just got downvoted and people were replying about how a console with 'no games' doesn't deserve this success.

I've heard that a few times so far.

My snarky response: 'Well, I guess it's better to subjectively have a smaller library games than to objectively have a smaller install base.'

 

[omonimo]

Why does he even take this personally? He obviously can afford both consoles, he has no skin in this game, he made a wrong prediction, just suck it up and admit he was wrong, no big deal, nobody is perfect. Why even troll PS4 owners?

Because he is a child in a man body.

 

[Donny]

Maybe I'm confused, but what would the Xbox One need a chalkboard for?

I thought those were for things that were generally selling horribly. Not for "Not in first place."

Yeah it was a joke post to see whether the board would come out, but it's not really in first place for anything is it?

 

[Chobel]

Wait, there's already a 1M difference in the US between PS4 and X1?

Yep.

 

[allan-bh]

The PS3 was frequently pulling below 100K in the first half of 2007, which I believe was the first chalkboard to come out.

I miss PS3 vs. GBA Epic Battle. That was fun.

 

[RamzaIsCool]

The context is also what the chalkboard represents though, right?

The PS3 was frequently pulling below 100K in the first half of 2007, which I believe was the first chalkboard to come out. The Vita and Wii U also had abysmal performances.

Here the Xbox One is almost 2.5 times what the PS3 was doing in September 2007.

Now, that's certainly lower than the PS4, but that system comparatively has the second best September ever.

Didn't that only happen 1 time?

 

[KooopaKid]

Anyway, the Shadow Of Murder numbers seem disappointing. Ah no it released at the end of the month.

 

[Jal]

All the numbers are posted here :

Edit : Apparently I'm not supposed to post this link.

GAF hacked, the email quote system has been breached, The NPDening!!

 

[flkraven]

GAF hacked, the email quote system has been breached, The NPDening!!

Jesus, that didn't take long.

 

[SeventhSon]

I'VE NEVER HIT QUOTE SO MANY TIMES BEFORE.

 

[allan-bh]

Didn't that only happen 1 time?

3 times. Between april and june 2007.

 

[orthodoxy1095]

What just happened?!

 

[KefkaPalazzo]

Didn't that only happen 1 time?

April, May, and June.

 

[Paganmoon]

Anyway, the Shadow Of Murder numbers seem disappointing. Ah no it released at the end of the month.

iirc, 5 days of tracking. Not stellar, but not too bad for a new IP, with very little hype (compared to Destiny)?

 

[Patroclos]

An external device that you can buy for an additional $200.

Ohhh. Awesome! Just like their HD-DVD player for the 360!

 

[allan-bh]

Anyway, the Shadow Of Murder numbers seem disappointing. Ah no it released at the end of the month.

I think is fine. This game doesn't had too much attention before launch.

 

[Ombala]

Mere profitability is not enough and is not the goal in and of itself. The goal is high margin profitability. With their core products, Microsoft have 90% margins (Windows, Office, Enterprise), and a stranglehold on the marketplace. Consumer Electronics on the other hand, struggle to get about 10% margins and that is no where good enough.

Mattrick's plan would have given them a stranglehold and those high margins. An Xbox with a cut of all software, yearly memberships, and extensive Kinect-fueled biometrics for advertising would have been a goldmine if the competition had been the Wii U and a 2013 version of launch PS3. But Cerny's PS4 is a great console and so the Xbox division is in a hard spot: how to justify their exsistence within Microsoft given MS expectations?

Spencer's moves--such as buying Tomb Raider/TitanFall exclusivity, getting rid of Kinect, packing-in games, adding Games-with-Gold, and buying Gears of War IP--do nothing to get Xbox into the high margins. In fact, they all reduce margins. IMO, his mandate for his first year is nothing more than damage control. At best, he is going to do what Sony did with the PS3 in its first 18+ months, i.e. making the console into a product that isn't actively repulsive. Which leads to the question: what are they planning next?

The big push for MS before SN became CEO was 'one microsoft', wherein every division was supposed to work with every other division and create seamless products in a walled garden. I believe that this is still their goal, and SN is just the guy to make that into a reality.

MS would not make Windows 10 free for Windows 8 users and give away the mobile version without a solid plan for monetizing users. As such, MS' next big push is undoubtedly going to be getting people to use the Windows store 100% of the time. The easiest way of doing that in Windows is by doing what Apple does with OSX. In OSX a user cannot add software that hasn't been downloaded from the Apple store without toggling a hidden setting. Without that toggle, OSX puts up an ominous warning screen that adding software from untrusted sites will lead to ruination. This, in effect, forces all software through Apple for regular users who will never change hidden settings.

Their phones and RT tablets already force Windows Store use, which why they give that OS away. So, Xbox will have to do the same. But like Win10, it will have to be done in such a way that doesn't get gamer ire up, i.e. you will still have to be able to buy discs and used games.

So what might they do to get Xbox into the One Microsoft vision? My answer would be Minecraft + integration. The next version of Minecraft is undoubtedly going to be for MS products only and only available on the MS store. This is going to push tens of millions into the MS tablet-desktop-phone-xbox ecosystem. After that, they can make moves to get games like AC moving through the store on PC as well as X1 through crossplay and remote play on tablets if the user has purchased the product from MS store. An integrated X1 that pushes people into the overall ecosystem is a justified high margin x1.

In this scenario, MS wins, xbox division wins, and consumers end up with interoperable products that are very appealing.

That sounds like a horrible future.

 

[SeventhSon]

Why is it so hard to admit that you're wrong? Super duper mega wrong.

 

[Grewitch]

ok derailing shit now

That was some good shit. Bravo.

 

[RamzaIsCool]

3 times. Between april and june 2007.

April, May, and June.

Thanks for clearing that up!

 

[KooopaKid]

How do you guys explain Forza Horizon 2? It's very well reviewed.

 

[GifGafIsTheBestGaf]

The chart tool at the end is really cool.

yup, i agree

 

[Impeccable]

It is amazing how much Halo news is happening today of all days.

Gone gold, up for preload, huge download pre release. It is almost like a distraction from stuff and things.

 

[Miles Quaritch]

This is a tier mere mortals can only ever dream of achieving.

Goddamn.

 

[ethomaz]

How do you guys explain Forza Horizon 2? It's very well reviewed.

This Forza spinoff never sold well... it is really a small games in terms of sales no matter how good it is reviewed.

Gamers prefer the mainline Forza over the Forza Horizon... that is showed in sales if you compare Forza 4 vs Forza Horizon.

The USA doesn't buy racing games really. It's a European market.

Forza Horizon didn't sold well in Europe too.

People needs to realize Forza >>>> Forza Horizon in terms of sales.

 

[orthodoxy1095]

How do you guys explain Forza Horizon 2? It's very well reviewed.

The USA doesn't buy racing games really. It's a European market.

 

[bombshell]

I fell so good with my predictions this month...

[PS4] 550k
[XB1] 280k

Finally I will will be on the top guys

Almost spot on, well done

 

[sinseers]

XboxOne will be Microsoft's last console.

It very well might be. Would you consider that that a good or bad thing ?

 

[fade_]

Why does he even take this personally? He obviously can afford both consoles, he has no skin in this game, he made a wrong prediction, just suck it up and admit he was wrong, no big deal, nobody is perfect. Why even troll PS4 owners?

That tweet was made before NPD was released.

 

[R1CHO]

Shouldn't Patch be a "banned" source of news in the forum? At least regarding his "predictions".

 

[Guevara]

Interesting: if you can trust that non-english, non-chartz site I'm not quoting, the Xbox One is still up like 800k over the Xbox 360 launch aligned. You can still claim Xbox One is the best Xbox launch ever.

That's almost all from the first two months though and that lead is gradually diminishing. YTD (Jan-Sept) the Xbox 360 actually sold better than the Xbox One in the same period, and by about 400k.

 

[MrGlass]

Guys, that's Pachter tweet looks like it's from the 14th so most likely it's not a response to the NPD figures...

 

[McHuj]

Shouldn't Patch be a "banned" source of news in the forum? At least regarding his "predictions".

Why? Since when is a prediction considered news?

 

[Sectorseven]

It very well might be. Would you consider that that a good or bad thing ?

I think the Xbox is largely redundant of Windows at this point. It would be a lot cheaper and more practical for MS to start funneling that console money back into the PC. Come up with something similar to Chromecast, but for gaming and they could still be a viable competitor for the living room market, but without all the baggage.

 

[FDC1]

Maybe I'm confused, but what would the Xbox One need a chalkboard for?

I thought those were for things that were generally selling horribly. Not for "Not in first place."

Xbox One is not just in "Not in first place" position.

Interesting: if you can trust that non-english, non-chartz site I'm not quoting, the Xbox One is still up like 800k over the Xbox 360 launch aligned. You can still claim Xbox One is the best Xbox launch ever.

That's almost all from the first two months though and that lead is gradually diminishing. YTD (Jan-Sept) the Xbox 360 actually sold better than the Xbox One in the same period, and by about 400k.

This

 

[TrebuchetGames]

MANY people don't have any idea.

That's why Chartz admins are so rich. Thousands upon thousands of people just blindly visit their site because they think Chartz numbers are "pretty accurate."

News flash: they're not.

Many of the users just go there for the forums and sales discussions, in fact many dispute the sales figures on a regular basis - not that most of the time they get listened too... so not all visitors there are bad.

 

[Cess007]

The chart tool at the end is really cool.

Agree.
And Wow! Didn't know that the original Xbox launch sales were that good in USA!

 

[jett]

lol pachter

 

[Thunder Monkey]

Honestly though, I'm still kind of shocked. I really didn't expect Destiny to do quite as much for PS4 as it did.

I cannot stress enough how much a showing like this means. Holiday season is going to be psychotically large for Sony. After resting the majority of the year around OG Xbox levels, the first big game of the generation releases and sends PS4 to the stratosphere. If US interest is maintained at a higher baseline, PS4 could maintain it's LtD lead over PS2 much longer than I initially expected of it.

 

[Jimmyfenix]

Agree.
And Wow! Didn't know that the original Xbox launch sales were that good in USA!

The Wii / Wii u / Gamecube graph is also interesting.

 

[PhatSaqs]

Maybe I'm confused, but what would the Xbox One need a chalkboard for?

I thought those were for things that were generally selling horribly. Not for "Not in first place."

The payback is real.

 

[shandy706]

Why does he even take this personally? He obviously can afford both consoles, he has no skin in this game, he made a wrong prediction, just suck it up and admit he was wrong, no big deal, nobody is perfect. Why even troll PS4 owners?

How is he trolling PS4 owners? (I think that tweet may be a few days old too)

He's literally only commenting on "Fanboys". Owners that take nothing from one system outselling another wouldn't care what he said.

One should have absolutely no problem with that tweet unless they are one I would think.

Do you not agree?

I need no validation for buying a PS4, having my Vita, or my X1. I thought his prediction was way off (you can see that in the post I made in reaction to his prediction). I didn't believe it at all.

Heck I own a DS and a Vita. I'd love to see the Vita come charging back. It doesn't even slightly bother me that the 3DS murdered it. I'd just like to see a nice piece of hardware sell well.

I completely agree with that particular tweet.

Edit** I also agree he could have just held it back by the way, I just don't think he was trolling "PS4 Owners".

 

[Opiate]

I actually agree with those that say the most reasonable explanation for PS4 sales trumping Xbox One sales is that the PS4 is a more compelling platform for consumers.

However, I'm not sure everyone who is saying this is thinking this through entirely. For instance, one could make the reasonable argument that this means iOS is an even more compelling platform than the PS4 is. Also using the same reasoning, one would have to conclude that the Wii was simply a better platform than the PS3 or Xbox 360 were.

I actually agree with those statements, but I suspect a lot of people are going to be inconsistent and only use this reasoning when it suits their platform preferences. The Wii's sales were driven by hype, but the PS4's sales are truly deserved. The Xbox One sales are relatively low because it's a mediocre platform, but Vita sales are low because people just don't understand how awesome the Vita is. DS sales were amazing because the platform was amazing, but iOS sales are amazing because people buy anything Apple makes like sheep.

Not everyone will fall in to this trap, of course, but I suspect a lot do. When something you like sells well, it's because it's deserved, and the free market works. When something you don't like sells well, it's all hype and fluff and people are being brainwashed.

 

[Nirolak]

Didn't that only happen 1 time?

Unless I'm missing something:

April 2007: PlayStation 3 82k
May 2007: [PS3] 81,604
June 2007: Playstation 3 -- 98.5k

There may have been more, but some of our NPD archives threads from 2007 are missing hardware numbers.

September was:

PlayStation 3 119.4K

The Xbox 360 was over 500K that month, but it was also the launch of Halo 3.

donny2112's old chart here suggests that the Xbox 360 was about 250K in September 2006, which would put it a bit lower than the Xbox One just did: http://img1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20090531023610/vgsales/images/4/43/Xbox_360_NPD_yoy.png

 

[N.Domixis]

Hopefully this puts an end to all those who wonder why ps4 is selling so well. A third party game made the ps4 sell this much!

 

[Thunder Monkey]

I actually agree with those that say the most reasonable explanation for PS4 sales trumping Xbox One sales is that the PS4 is a more compelling platform for consumers.

However, I'm not sure everyone who is saying this is thinking this through entirely. For instance, one could make the reasonable argument that this means iOS is an even more compelling platform than the PS4 is, One would have to conclude that the Wii was simply a better platform than the PS3 or Xbox 360 were.

I actually agree with those statements, but I suspect a lot of people are going to be inconsistent and only use this reasoning when it suits their platform preferences. The Wii's sales were driven by hype, but the PS4's sales are truly deserved. The Xbox One is selling poorly because it's not a compelling platform, but Vita sales are low because people just don't understand how awesome the platform is. DS sales were amazing because the platform was amazing, but iOS sales are amazing because people buy anything Apple makes like sheep.

Not everyone will fall in to this trap, of course, but I suspect a lot do. When something you like sells well, it's because it's deserved, and the free market works. When something you don't like sells well, it's all hype and fluff and people are being brainwashed.

That's why barring a stint in the late 90's arguing on pro-PSX anti-N64 chatrooms I just follow the numbers and their impact. It makes "nontraditional" sea change movements much easier to weather when it's just numbers. Helped by the fact that I like gaming itself instead of any one player.