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[Bojji]

I'm shocked PSSR isn't perfect..

On a game that was filled with all kinds of IQ issues and ghosting with DLSS and displayed the same AO flickering using hardware lumen..

PSSR isn't perfect, but Thread is unnecessarily the shitshow.


You are spot on, unsurprisingly..

Changing dlss preset/version most likely fixes this.

Good. The Pro patch wasn't ready. How did Blooper not see that?

More like PSSR wasn't ready, silent hill 2 is only one of the games with issues.

There are games with pro patches but without PSSR, there must be reason for this.

 

[Topher]

Changing dlss preset/version most likely fixes this.

Should not have to do this. So is this a DLSS problem or a Blooper problem?

More like PSSR wasn't ready, silent hill 2 is only one of the games with issues.

There are games with pro patches but without PSSR, there must be reason for this.

Some games have made better use of PSSR than others and that is going to be reflective of the studio. PSSR is evolving tech just like DLSS. So while the implementation of PSSR has started out rough for some, that is not true across the board. And like DLSS, it will get better overall.

 

[LordOcidax]

Give it sometime , it just released two weeks ago ffs

Agree with this… The console has just born two weeks ago, is not like the devs has the hardware for months… a year or something like that… They received the development hardware the same day as the consumers received the PS5Pro… Just give it some time until PS6 comes out.

 

[TerribleAtThisGame]

That's Bloober team for you mate - and this is the reason why I was always contrary to them remaking this game.

After the original whoo-haaaas of the initial release after it receiving good reviews, we're back to "Bloober are hacks" and for a good reason.

One of the most technically incompetent developers out there and that's being polite...

I won't go nearly that far. It's my GOTY so I'm happy as fuck for it despite the issues. I do think they did a fantastic job BUT yes, I agree with the rest. I played on Performance Mode and the technical issues were obnoxious and constant.

 

[lh032]

Agree with this… The console has just born two weeks ago, is not like the devs has the hardware for months… a year or something like that… They received the development hardware the same day as the consumers received the PS5Pro… Just give it sometime until PS6 comes out.

be patient.

 

[rkofan87]

if it still runs at a locked 60 fps its still pro in my book .

 

[Gaiff]

It’s funny to see people who always shit-talked the Pro come out of the woodwork to thrash it when it has issues. They’re nowhere to be found in good implementations, but the moment it’s bad, they’re like rabid dogs on a carcass.

 

[XXL]

It’s funny to see people who always shit-talked the Pro come out of the woodwork to thrash it when it has issues. They’re nowhere to be found in good implementations, but the moment it’s bad, they’re like rabid dogs on a carcass.

 

[FrankWza]

At first I thought it came From other consoles not having a Pro. Then I figured it was coming From the threat of it closing the gap on more expensive hardware. I wonder where it's coming From now. Where do you think it comes From?

 

[XXL]

At first I thought it came From other consoles not having a Pro. Then I figured it was coming From the threat of it closing the gap on more expensive hardware. I wonder where it's coming From now. Where do you think it comes From?

It's obvious coming From Software.

 

[Xtib81]

Trolls are out in full force it seems. Can't believe most if not all are adults.

 

[FrankWza]

It's obvious coming From Software.

Of course. I don't know why I didnt think of that. But even if it's coming From software, it still my be exclusive to specific hardware. So, another platform may have software like the one this is coming From, but it won't be From the same people who made this.

 

[Loomy]

That's Bloober team for you mate - and this is the reason why I was always contrary to them remaking this game.

After the original whoo-haaaas of the initial release after it receiving good reviews, we're back to "Bloober are hacks" and for a good reason.

One of the most technically incompetent developers out there and that's being polite...

That's a little much. They made a good remake, and like some other studios out there, are struggling with getting this right.

Sony with get in touch with them like they are with other struggling teams and help them figure it out.

 

[SlimySnake]

Trolls are out in full force it seems. Can't believe most if not all are adults.

Criticizing the marquee tech of a $700 console for not delivering is not trolling. it's literally stating facts.

 

[Makoto-Yuki]

if it still runs at a locked 60 fps its still pro in my book .

what's pro about 60fps? it's 2024 not 2004.

It’s funny to see people who always shit-talked the Pro come out of the woodwork to thrash it when it has issues. They’re nowhere to be found in good implementations, but the moment it’s bad, they’re like rabid dogs on a carcass.

same could be said of everything else but now it's sony you're upset? funny.

Trolls are out in full force it seems. Can't believe most if not all are adults.

when aren't trolls out in full force defending PS5?

can't have it both ways.

 

[Killer8]

I just want a toggle like God of War Ragnarök. If a first-party game can do it then the idea that Bloober are being forced to use PSSR is obviously bullshit.

 

[Topher]

Criticizing the marquee tech of a $700 console for not delivering is not trolling. it's literally stating facts.

There is a difference between legit criticism and trolling though. I'm seeing a bit of both.

 

[Gaiff]

same could be said of everything else but now it's sony you're upset? funny.

And when it happens, I call it out too. Criticizing the tech’s shortcomings is fine, that’s what we’re here for. I’ve been plenty critical of the Pro myself. The price tag, low bandwidth increase, lack of disc drive, and PSSR being a mixed bag.

There’s a huge difference between genuine criticism and useless drive-by posting meant to troll and rile up other users, but you knew this already.

 

[rofif]

Need a PS5 Pro De-enhanced sticker

Seriously. It’s false advertisement at this point.
The game is still 30 and 60fps. Nothing is enhanced aside from dynamic res

 

[nkarafo]

PC version still has very intense traversal stutters even after so many patches. Judging from that, it must have been unplayable at launch.

 

[Black_Stride]

The patch removes the PS5Pro marquee feature?

 

[Xtib81]

Criticizing the marquee tech of a $700 console for not delivering is not trolling. it's literally stating facts.

Lmao. People are trolling and you know it. Pssr is not the issue, the devs are.

 

[GHG]

Lmao. People are trolling and you know it. Pssr is not the issue, the devs are.

It's most likely somewhere in the middle.

It's either Sony haven't tested it across a wide enough range of applications to work out the kinks (so that workarounds and guidance in certain scenarios can be given to devs), or the documentation simply isn't good/clear enough.

There is the possibility that certain developers are not following any existing documentation closely enough and are attempting to implement things based on how they typically would FSR/DLSS, but even still, if Sony want this to be a success they would be better off following any implementation principles and best practices that are already considered industry standard as far as AI upscaling tech goes. No need to reinvent the wheel or make things unnecessarily complicated for developers.

 

[Rocco Schiavone]

But somebody here told me that PSSR was better than DLSS

 

[Topher]

It's most likely somewhere in the middle.

It's either Sony haven't tested it across a wide enough range of applications to work out the kinks (so that workarounds and guidance in certain scenarios can be given to devs), or the documentation simply isn't good/clear enough.

There is the possibility that certain developers are not following any existing documentation closely enough and are attempting to implement things based on how they typically would FSR/DLSS, but even still, if Sony want this to be a success they would be better off following any implementation principles and best practices that are already considered industry standard as far as AI upscaling tech goes. No need to reinvent the wheel or make things unnecessarily complicated for developers.

Someone mentioned XDEV helping Shift Up with their Pro implementation for Stellar Blade. Right there we see what the tech is capable of doing, but seems not everyone is up to speed yet. That very well could be a lack of documentation or best practices to share. Could be that Sony is prioritizing implementing PSSR in new games rather than patching old games which was a mistake if they wanted to put PS5 Pro in the best possible light day one. No doubt the focus is on the negatives at this point so Sony has a lot of work to do.

 

[NeverYouMind]

I'm shocked PSSR isn't perfect..

On a game that was filled with all kinds of IQ issues and ghosting with DLSS and displayed the same AO flickering using hardware lumen..

 

[Lysandros]

I'm shocked PSSR isn't perfect..

On a game that was filled with all kinds of IQ issues and ghosting with DLSS and displayed the same AO flickering using hardware lumen..

PSSR isn't perfect, but Thread is unnecessarily the shitshow.


You are spot on, unsurprisingly..

Usual DF selective blindness huh? Maybe Oliver is as eagle eyed as Tom after all.

 

[SlimySnake]

Lmao. People are trolling and you know it. Pssr is not the issue, the devs are.

You are the one trolling if u think pssr is not the issue. Almost every game with rtgi, rt ao and rt reflections is having these issues. Alan wake 2, Jedi survivor, dragons dogma 2, dragon age, silent hill 2, gt7. This is a pattern that directly links pssr with these issues. Especially considering the fact that previous techniques like fsr or tsr on base ps5 didn’t produce shimmering this bad. I mean you are literally in a thread where devs switched out pssr with tsr and it fixed the shimmering.

It’s ok to get things wrong. I misread and misconstrue things all the time myself but to go and accuse others of trolling instead of trying to understand the actual issue is bizarre.

 

[Esppiral]

But somebody here told me that PSSR was better than DLSS

Yay you beated me lol.

 

[SlimySnake]

Someone mentioned XDEV helping Shift Up with their Pro implementation for Stellar Blade. Right there we see what the tech is capable of doing, but seems not everyone is up to speed yet. That very well could be a lack of documentation or best practices to share. Could be that Sony is prioritizing implementing PSSR in new games rather than patching old games which was a mistake if they wanted to put PS5 Pro in the best possible light day one. No doubt the focus is on the negatives at this point so Sony has a lot of work to do.

Stellar blade has no rt. This is an issue with pssr not being able to handle dynamic objects. Just look at the best pssr implementations. Demon souls, ff7 rebirth, tlou1, tlou2, stellar blade. All games without rt.

 

[kiphalfton]

But somebody here told me that PSSR was better than DLSS

Probably trying to justify their PS5 Pro purchase.

 

[DenchDeckard]

Its a joke, but in this case genuine. We need the tools to arrive.

PSSR is the first step into ML upscaling tech in a console. It will take some time to resolve issues.

Look at the LOU footage, DLSS has some awful ghosting there. Nothings perfect.

 

[Topher]

Stellar blade has no rt. This is an issue with pssr not being able to handle dynamic objects. Just look at the best pssr implementations. Demon souls, ff7 rebirth, tlou1, tlou2, stellar blade. All games without rt.

If that's the case then yeah, Sony needs to fix PSSR/RT. In the meantime, devs need to give people the option to turn off RT just like PCs do. That's not an excuse for the RT issues, but a reasonable work around.

 

[Bojji]

Should not have to do this. So is this a DLSS problem or a Blooper problem?



Some games have made better use of PSSR than others and that is going to be reflective of the studio. PSSR is evolving tech just like DLSS. So while the implementation of PSSR has started out rough for some, that is not true across the board. And like DLSS, it will get better overall.

I should be more specific, I was talking about ghosting in that the last of us gif.

 

[mckmas8808]

I miss the days when console devs actually still did QA of their updates.

Thank you! Idiots here on GAF don't seem to understand that software is supposed to be checked by some quality assurance team. This is not a PSSR issue at all!

 

[mckmas8808]

Seems like this feature wasn't ready for prime time across all games.

All those users that were waiting to play this game on PS5 pro. It's a major shame.

Also, another example of the digital future. Can't even play the disk version..... :/

This is a ball faced lie! And you know it. Stop the BS!

 

[SlimySnake]

If that's the case then yeah, Sony needs to fix PSSR/RT. In the meantime, devs need to give people the option to turn off RT just like PCs do. That's not an excuse for the RT issues, but a reasonable work around.

Yes. The fix is simple. Jedi, dragons dogma, Alan wake and dragon age didn’t even have rt in performance modes on base consoles. Not sure why these geniuses decided to add them especially after seeing the results.

 

[Topher]

Yes. The fix is simple. Jedi, dragons dogma, Alan wake and dragon age didn’t even have rt in performance modes on base consoles. Not sure why these geniuses decided to add them especially after seeing the results.

Seems like a case of trying to do too much too quickly. That's forgivable. Ignoring the poor quality and pushing it out anyway is not.

 

[Fess]

It’s funny to see people who always shit-talked the Pro come out of the woodworks to thrash it when it has issues. They’re nowhere to be found in good implementations, but the moment it’s bad, they’re like rabid dogs on a carcass.

That’s how it is in any discussion where there is some tribalism going on. It’s been that way for as long as I can remember but things has become more extreme the last 5 years or so.
For awhile I tried to put all warriors on ignore but the place felt dead.

 

[Darsxx82]

same could be said of everything else but now it's sony you're upset? funny.


when aren't trolls out in full force defending PS5?

can't have it both ways.

Exactly, it's funny when people complain about these kinds of attitudes from the other side... and doubly funny when the one who complains has a pretty strong history of trolling and similar console war attitudes .

Neogaf.

 

[fersnake]

Am I wrong for feeling like there's more than a whiff of gate-keeping/protectionism about the way that PSSR not being perfect is being highlighted?

As if other forms of upscaling don't have their issues also, and that somehow PSSR is making previously "flawless" IQ worse.

Also...

Sorry, but I don't buy the idea that all these devs are doing the work to implement the new system and ignoring the fact that its making things worse. I mean, its not like they are being mandated to use the tech. So if the problems are so severe or striking, why would they bother when they don't have to?

It makes no logical sense.

yep but because it's the new sony's console they need to talk shit, another thing of course pssr has issues like you said no matter if its dlss/fsr or xess but i feel its the devs fault why the game has bad implementation of pssr. pretty sure they just rush it out.

 

[mckmas8808]

yep but because it's the new sony's console they need to talk shit, another thing of course pssr has issues like you said no matter if its dlss/fsr or xess but i feel its the devs fault why the game has bad implementation of pssr. pretty sure they just rush it out.

We've had horrible implementations of DLSS also in the pass. But because have to be console warriors they look pass that and ignore those games and situations.

 

[NeverYouMind]

Performance mode on Pro seems like a big upgrade (900p to 1080p native is great). Even when it dips below 60 the frame pacing seems consistent.

 

[Bojji]

Yes. The fix is simple. Jedi, dragons dogma, Alan wake and dragon age didn’t even have rt in performance modes on base consoles. Not sure why these geniuses decided to add them especially after seeing the results.

RT seems to be the main culprit. OR it's something else entirely.

SB seems to have the same issues as SH2 and Jedi have but this game is just using standard SSAO and no RT in sight:





Timestamped^

FOR SURE this will be fixed, but first showing of PSSR is not really that positive and this tech was in development for months or years.

 

[light2x]

Was this product not ready or what? Sony's standard of quality has really deteriorated.

 

[saintjules]

PSSR is still being used in Quality Mode on the Pro for SH2

 

[Heimdall_Xtreme]

Imagine that as a developer you have done the most meticulous job in the world and without errors, Sony arrives and it comes to you with problems due to its updated console.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

Always be weary of Bloober.

 

[Gaiff]

We've had horrible implementations of DLSS also in the pass. But because have to be console warriors they look pass that and ignore those games and situations.

In fairness, the standards are different. Consoles are expected to "just work" and the QA for implementing features in them is more rigorous than on PC. Devs have repeatedly come out and said that getting patches out for consoles is a lot more difficult than for PC as they have to go through a certification process with Sony or Microsoft and if I'm not mistaken, there's even a limit on the number of patches they can release.

PC's DIY nature makes people more tolerant to problems and a lot of the time, the community can overtake the devs and fix the issues themselves. The Pro is a $700 machine and PSSR was described as one of its pillars. Seeing it miss the mark so often leaves a sour taste in the mouths of a lot of consumers. Whether or not it's due to PSSR is irrelevant to most of the customers. They paid $700 for a console and saw PSSR as being advertised as this big upscaling tech and that's what they want. Contrast that with DLSS 1.0 and the early implementations of ray tracing. Most PC gamers mocked DLSS 1.0 and called it trash and simply didn't use it. RT was considered too demanding and sparse and the majority didn't bother with it. There was no big controversy. They just sucked and we had a laugh and kept using native resolution and no ray tracing. There's also the fact that these were the first of their kind and we gave them a pass. Now, people want PSSR to be as good as DLSS asap and they want that ray tracing goodness that was marketed.

There are certain expectations with a premium console. You cannot directly compare it to PCs, especially when devs sometimes patch things for the worse and don't give you the option of reverting to a better version.

 

[Topher]

Exactly, it's funny when people complain about these kinds of attitudes from the other side... and doubly funny when the one who complains has a pretty strong history of trolling and similar console war attitudes .

Neogaf.

When has Gaiff exhibited "console war attitudes"? That's who Makoto-Yuki is responding to here.